The job hunting support thread

[Orang Utan]

Wow, thought that type of interview was the standard.
Don’t I’ve ever had the latter type of interview. Glad of it! Doesn’t sound very professional.

 

[RubyToogood]

Actually it's not just that I don't want a job. I don't really want to move, have to start again, learn the ropes somewhere else. Bleurgh.

 

[Elpenor]

Actually it's not just that I don't want a job. I don't really want to move, have to start again, learn the ropes somewhere else. Bleurgh.

Can really relate to this. My line of work is more or less the same everywhere but I found starting a new job around 3 years ago really challenging and it took well over a year to feel comfortable and about 18 months to feel confident to make suggestions. And I have friends who change jobs every 2 years, no idea how they do it, do they leave before they get found out?

 

[Cloo]

Another useful discussion today - colleague pointed out that there are probably roles I could do that have generic sorts of names so I haven't thought of trying them, will have a proper look tomorrow. The business is quite good at letting people have a shot at roles that are quite different to what they've done so far, and a lot of roles with 'project', 'engagement' or 'innovation' (followed by 'lead' or 'manager') might actually be feasible for me, and also quite interesting. Basically they encompass project management type roles that mainly need someone who knows the business, knows the industry and can get people to do shit. And seeing as most of my jobs have involved chasing people up to do stuff that is not their day job or professional priority, and in some cases not even paid, I'm quite good at that. Some of those roles also encompass some writing and research, which would be my ideal. I think in some cases they might end up ecompassing that anyway if they hire someone like me to do them.

Gives me a bit more hope re: one I'm discussing on Friday morning which turns out to be under a lovely lady I've worked with a bit and knows me - and she will also be frank and honest about my chances with it but I'm sure will be a helpful discussion one way or another.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

And I have friends who change jobs every 2 years, no idea how they do it, do they leave before they get found out?

in some cases, yes.

one colleague in a job some years back tended to have a shelf life of about 2 years anywhere then moved on - he was a massive bullshit merchant (or, since he was called bill, one of my other colleagues coined the phrase 'billshit') so would have been good at interviews, then gradually got found out.

in some lines of work / types of organisation, it seems that moving organisations is the only way to make 'progress' as internal promotions are not a thing unless you're on the graduate fast track scheme.

i've changed jobs 'too many' times in the last decade or so for a variety of reasons - two of last three jobs (about 2 years in one, and i'd have left sooner but covid happened, and slightly less than 6 months in another) were a mistake.

current job (2 years next week) is starting to look insecure and it's not worth waiting for a redundancy payment, so i've started to look again.

Bleurgh.

i agree entirely.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

My interview from beginning to end was about 20 minutes long. I don't know if that's good or bad. At least I didn't freeze up, or fidget, and seemed to have reasonable answers to their questions. I'm pretty overqualified for the job, but I've been overqualified before and not gotten the job.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

I don't know if that's good or bad

it's hard to tell, really. and it's sometimes hard to get an impression what they think - there's interviews i think i've done fairly well and not got an offer, there's one or two i thought i had ballsed up and got an offer.

I'm pretty overqualified for the job, but I've been overqualified before and not gotten the job.

hmm. with some employers, being 'overqualified' is a reason for saying no, as they don't want to be having to go through the process again as soon as the person finds something better

 

[AnnO'Neemus]

you might have done STAR without realising it. If it's done right, it can be like a proper conversation. a 'STAR' answer is basically along the lines of 'I used to work for this organisation. One time we were trying to do this. I was responsible for that element of it, this is how I did it, this is what a success it was'

sometimes the 'success' can be that nobody outside actually noticed you'd done it - i've got one i use now and then that involved dealing with a monumental balls-up (of another organisation's making) that i sorted out in a way that the actual service users didn't notice anything had happened.



interesting - not sure i'll try that one, though





at one interview, the one when i went back in to full time work after a couple of years of part time / temporary things, i said something like i'd been looking for a while, but much of what i'd seen was either places i didn't want to move to, or organisations i didn't want to work for, which seemed to be an acceptable line of bullshit as they offered me the job...

One of my examples for a particular type of STAR question is also a no one noticed type answer. Mine's about a situation that arose when someone threatened to make a serious complaint against the organisation I worked for, which could've caused some serious reputational damage, and although I properly signposted them to the information about the formal complaints procedure, I didn't just leave it there, which many staff might've done.

I addressed one of the underlying problems, got them some help and support, and there was a happily ever after outcome. And they didn't end up submitting the complaint, so crisis averted.

 

[Cloo]

Got my first 'no' from an external job, have just applied to a civil service one but I don't think it's very likely. But first few external applications are always tumbleweed - IIRC usually after 3-5 applications I look at the CV I've been using, suddenly see everything wrong with it and then get more traction with the next version.

On the upside, senior manager around this not-yet-advertised role has got back to me after a week and is still keen to meet. She's based in Boston so I guess will be an afternoon call, I actually have a fair amount of stuff on mid week but in the afternoon nothing I can't shift if I'm looking at what's basically going to be an interview. It's a bit weird considering a move to a role that will be more corporate and probably more stressful than anything I've done before and not at all a direction I ever planned on, but probably worth a go. It's a trajectory that likely means prospects of a much bigger salary than I'd ever expected to collect, which to me mostly means being able to save a lot more for a pension and therefore maybe being able to retire before 70, looking at the big picture.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

Got my first 'no' from an external job

have just applied to a civil service one

hmm

there's a particular way to approach civil service applications, and not sure i understand it well (local authority has a different style again, which i can usually handle)

others may be able to advise.

would come with a reasonable pension scheme though

 

[Cloo]

It has changed since last time I did one, which at that point was much more 'Describe exactly how you have done something that meets this criteria', whereas now it was list roles, then list skills/experience from them, then a slightly less intensive version of the giving examples thing. I think trying to make it more equitable and trying to look at transferrable skills and disposition rather than precise job.

I'm not too bothered about the rejection - it was a nice job but I'm pretty sure they were looking for someone with more of a charity comms background, eg someone like my sister in law who has done similar roles.

I am using the fact I get access to LinkedIn training to look at some relevant vids - I just watched one about internal interviews that was actually very useful and has given me some pointers, tomorrow I'm going to reach out to some people with experience in this kind of role and ask them some things this video suggested researching, like what does good performance look like, how are people doing to job evaluated, what are the main challenges of it. I think it best to assume conversation next week is basically an interview - a good point the LinkedIn thing made is not to be overconfident and overprepare if anything, even if it sounds informal

 

[Puddy_Tat]

hmm

i've been offered the job i interviewed for on monday. thought i was pushing my luck a bit - it's a bit higher level than what i'm doing now in terms of pay grade (although to be honest, current job is fairly cushy for the pay grade it's on) and definitely a level higher in terms of work. i'm a bit out of practice with some of it, but have done the same sort of thing before.

it will mean moving house (further away from london than i am now) and pretty means giving up on the idea of ever moving back to london. which i'm not sure will go down well with mum-tat.

my chances of getting any sort of regular job in london are remote - i'm in a fairly small niche, and the chances of getting anything in that in london are limited, and i'd be seen as overqualified for anything generic, quite apart from the chances of many employers seeing me as too old.

everything feels like it could be a last chance now.

i wish i felt remotely inspired...

 

[cesare]

Congrats! Puddy_Tat albeit uninspired. It's an achievement and an option.

 

[Cloo]

Glad to hear about the option at least Puddy_Tat

I'm feeling kind of enervated and swinging between confidence I'll land an internal role and not being sure. Discussed one this morning which is a bit left-field and would involve being interviewed by the client and I'm a bit worried I'd look rubbish as I've not been client facing/directly involved in the market, strategy etc, but I'm still considering putting forward a bio so they could put me forward, a colleague I spoke to later was very 'yeah, just go for it'. I have finally heard from person behind the internal role which is currently looking like best bet that she definitely wants to speak with me, which is promising - she's in the US and haven't heard back on time yet (we've mooted 1st half of next week), but will check email later this evening. I'd better prep for that over weekend just in case I log in on Monday morning and find she wants to talk in the afternoon!

Externally, I've just started going through lists of professional organisations as my last job was at one and just knowing what membership orgs are like I think is a big plus. Interesting role going at Institution of Engineering & Technology - have contacted a former colleague who works there via LinkedIn to say I'm looking at it and to ask if he would refer me if they have a system. Another one at the Chartered Institute of Building - bad news is it's in Bracknell, albeit hybrid. I suppose if I had to do two consecutive days I have a bunch of mates nearby in Woking wo I could overnight with once a week.

Something with possibilities, but probably too senior, at competitor of current employers, but main offputting thing is it looks like it's asking for full time in the office which sucks a bit and there isn't much point to it being so really.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

Glad to hear about the option at least @Puddy_Tat

hmm

i'm trying to decide between having huge row about it and then declining the job, or just declining the job.

blargh.

bad news is it's in Bracknell

bracknell is rarely good news

I have a bunch of mates nearby in Woking wo I could overnight with once a week.

i don't know if you run a car, but woking to bracknell is not a good journey by public transport - either fairly slow bus journey to camberley then another fairly slow bus journey to bracknell (and it's separate companies, and if they do connect it's by chance rather than design) so about 2 hours each way.

train alternative is a bit quicker - about 1 hour 20 end to end, but it involves changing twice, so the potential for cock-up is high. and you do not want to be changing at (or if you can help it travelling via) ascot while royal arsecot week is on (i used to travel home the long way round via reading that week)

 

[Cloo]

Yes, and I just realised it's not a good option generally as I assumed Bracknell would be within a half hour of Waterloo like Woking, but looks like it's only an hour-long stopping everywhere, once and hour train which makes it a much shittier deal, and I'm not driving it. It's a journal I might do once a week, but not more. It might be worth applying and seeing if I can get away with once a week.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

but looks like it's only an hour-long stopping everywhere, once and hour train which makes it a much shittier deal

it was two trains an hour last time i looked (there were four trains an hour in the peaks before covid, although that was in the commuting to london direction) - south western tend to put an 'emergency timetable' on when there's a drivers' overtime ban on to be sure they can run the advertised service / make the situation look worse than it is (delete as appropriate)

but yes, it is fairly slow.

the trains stop at richmond - i know you're somewhere in that north london - are you near enough a station on the north london line (now one of the orange lines) that has trains to richmond to make that an option?

 

[Cloo]

it was two trains an hour last time i looked (there were four trains an hour in the peaks before covid, although that was in the commuting to london direction) - south western tend to put an 'emergency timetable' on when there's a drivers' overtime ban on to be sure they can run the advertised service / make the situation look worse than it is (delete as appropriate)

but yes, it is fairly slow.

the trains stop at richmond - i know you're somewhere in that north london - are you near enough a station on the north london line (now one of the orange lines) that has trains to richmond to make that an option?

Nowhere that would make it quicker than just going to Waterloo.

The IET role is Stevenage but that's quite easy from mine, either driving or getting to the GNER line (if it's still GNER, can't remember) and certainly fine a couple of days a week.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

Nowhere that would make it quicker than just going to Waterloo.

blargh

The IET role is Stevenage but that's quite easy from mine, either driving or getting to the GNER line (if it's still GNER, can't remember) and certainly fine a couple of days a week.

GNER is the main line / inter city type trains, except it's LNER this week.

Thameslink / Great Northern (it's all the same company) is the ones that stop at local stations.

 

[RubyToogood]

I think don't assume that jobs require you in the office these days without checking, regardless of what the ad says.

I'm through to the second round of the one I had an interview for on Weds. It turns out to be fully remote despite the ad mentioning two possible locations.

I have a fun weekend of prep for that and applying for a civil service job. Yay.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

I think don't assume that jobs require you in the office these days without checking, regardless of what the ad says.

yes - 'hybrid' has a lot of different meanings now. current job is on paper that i'm expected to be in the office (or rather 'an office' as i don't have my own desk or anything) minimum of one day a month, but some months i'm there 2 or 3 days, other months i don't need to go there

I'm through to the second round of the one I had an interview for on Weds.

hope it goes well

It turns out to be fully remote despite the ad mentioning two possible locations.

i think that's a in your case, isn't it?

I have a fun weekend of prep for that

blargh

and applying for a civil service job. Yay.

have fun.

at the risk of repeating something i said a day or three ago

there's a particular way to approach civil service applications, and not sure i understand it well (local authority has a different style again, which i can usually handle)

others may be able to advise.

would come with a reasonable pension scheme though

 

[Cloo]

I think don't assume that jobs require you in the office these days without checking, regardless of what the ad says.

I was looking at the business's vacancies page and this role I was looking at said 'Office' while others said 'Hybrid' or 'Home-based', so that suggests a tendency to office but maybe negotiable?

I've done some prep for a potential interview this week - there was nothing yesterday mid-evening but I will check my work email at the weekend in case something came in later as the lady is in Boston so if she mailed late afternoon/evening I won't have seen it.

The good thing about Zoom is that you can stick notes all around you to avoid uhming and ahing.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

Well, I got a job offer. Its only part-time, the pay sucks, and the commute is horrible. I'm tempted to take it because I need the experience in that field. It does sound like if you get on full-time that the pay and benefits are good. If nothing else, I figure I'll walk away with some experience.

 

[cesare]

Well, I got a job offer. Its only part-time, the pay sucks, and the commute is horrible. I'm tempted to take it because I need the experience in that field. It does sound like if you get on full-time that the pay and benefits are good. If nothing else, I figure I'll walk away with some experience.

Even with the drawbacks - congrats!

 

[Puddy_Tat]

Well, I got a job offer. Its only part-time, the pay sucks, and the commute is horrible. I'm tempted to take it because I need the experience in that field. It does sound like if you get on full-time that the pay and benefits are good. If nothing else, I figure I'll walk away with some experience.

congratulations on getting the offer. will it do as an 'until something better comes along' job? presume it being part time is a good enough reason for seeking something else?

 

[Puddy_Tat]

in my news -

as the interview for potential job was (unexpectedly) an online one, i didn't have a chance to look round the patch when i went there for the interview, so had a day out today. northampton looks mostly harmless but meh.

stopped in bletchley on the way back (thinking that's about the furthest i'd want to commute - new job is potentially about 50 / 50 office days / work from home - and closest to civilisation.) hells bells. don't think i've ever seen quite so many empty shops in one place.

i'm not sure i can face what is only going to be an increasing number of weekends travelling to s london and back.

i'm not sure i'm still up to working at a higher level again and if i fail at this, the chances of anything else are remote.

i can't face having a huge row with mum-tat about it.

latest noises from current job is that big cuts are unlikely this year.

i'm going to say no thanks.

i really shouldn't have applied for it.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

congratulations on getting the offer. will it do as an 'until something better comes along' job? presume it being part time is a good enough reason for seeking something else?

Yes, I've applied other places and I think I just didn't have enough experience. I should be able to get a better job in a year. They did say there was the potential to work into full-time so it's probably worth doing. This is a mid-life career change, and it will be my first job in a library.

 

[Elpenor]

Puddy_Tat it seems like you’re a bit stuck mate. Hopefully a job comes up that allows you to pivot a bit closer to where you Mum is. Being offered one is good though.

thinking about where you live now, I can imagine Bletchley / Northampton being more of the same

 

[Cloo]

Well, I got a job offer. Its only part-time, the pay sucks, and the commute is horrible. I'm tempted to take it because I need the experience in that field. It does sound like if you get on full-time that the pay and benefits are good. If nothing else, I figure I'll walk away with some experience.

Mazel tov I guess, yes may be worth if for the experience.

TBH my current job is not dream - the pay is good but TBH they needn't have hired someone with my experience to do it (which perhaps is why it's being made redundant) and it's not very satisfying in itself though it's a nice company to work for. But if I don't find an internal role it has opened up so many more roles I can apply for compared to last time I was given the heave-ho, it's been clear within a fortnight that I can apply for several roles a week rather than one if I'm lucky.

 

[newme]

Going back over job description for interview tomorrow, noticed they have absolutely no mention of anything about where the hell its based. I worked for them before but it was remote and through another company, can't remember staff being full onsite but they had some hybrid and they know I am 300 miles away and even vetoed me being onsite for a mandatory meeting because of distance. Hoping thats still the case. Also that I can remember absolutely anything about what it was I did there before. Been sick for days and basically medded up to the gills. Also of the probably 30-40 people I worked with there, neither on the call are ones I worked with despite it being in the same small team of 10 lol. Thinking I should fly through this really and they actually rescheduled two week after my original one to get me in after I found the invite never arrived and informed them so I didn't know I had actually got shortlisted to begin with. Veering between overpreparing all day, overconfidence, expecting the entire thing to go sideways and wondering if I should just apply for more jobs right now lol.