The current rise of the European FAR right; why it's happening and how to fight it.
- Thread starter DrRingDing
- Start date
Interesting Monday night in Dresden. We were going to head to the demo but between thinking there wasn't one due to my poor German, one group wanting to focus on Friday (the anniversary of the bombing. There have been far right marches in previous years though shrinking but a bit of a Pegida boost this year) and Police checking ID outside our hotel (it was a lot closer than planned) we thought we would stay in! Got some more.photos and footage I can post when I get back if anyone's interested. Scary crowd dynamics. Chanting ("we are one people") and boos and hisses etc. At other times it was reminiscent of a Church service. Not knowing what was being said I can't say much more but it was freaky. We put the RT live feed on as well and it didn't come across at all. In the crowd, sharing the beliefs and actually understanding the language it must of been pretty persuasive. Still the odd Pegida hanging around and the pub opposite.is full of them. Ended up walking to the shopping centre to eat instead of anywhere around here.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
The fash were vastly outnumbered.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...rchers-vastly-outnumbered-by-counter-protests
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Yep.The fash were vastly outnumbered.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...rchers-vastly-outnumbered-by-counter-protests
Some twats got their flags out...
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
"We're not fascists or on the far-right" claimed the Pegida woman who organised this in her distinctive London accent. 
gosub
~#
dumb beast
presume you aren't talking about Brian
Sasaferrato
Super Refuser!
Why does any extreme rise?
It rises because the people of a country have within their ranks, those of extreme views. On a scale of 1 -10, with 7 being pretty much neutral, most of us inhabit the region between 5 and 9 (ish). Using the common 80:20 ratio, 80% will fall into that band. The other 20% spread themselves between; pick your ist for the left; and fascist to the right.
At times of discontent, and this has has only started, there is a displacement from the 80 into the 20. The right is marginally less splintered than the left, so they can drag a couple of hundred people together for a march or rally. Unlike the main parties who a fag paper apart ideologically, the far right proselytes vigorously, through many channels, not least social media. The left are not doing this. The right are appealing to patriotism and nationalism. People will not suddenly turn from Lab/Tor to the BNP, but when the message is relentlessly presented, will move as far as UKIP.
I'm not putting this well. UKIP has become the acceptable face of bigotry, and will draw votes from the further right, and the Tories. I feel that there is an undercurrent saying, 'Don't worry, elect us, then we can put things right. The manifesto? Well that is a starting point really ', to try and draw the further right. I don't think UKIP will win more than a seat or two, but I bet their chunk of the vote will end up benefiting Milliband.
It is going to be an interesting election.
It rises because the people of a country have within their ranks, those of extreme views. On a scale of 1 -10, with 7 being pretty much neutral, most of us inhabit the region between 5 and 9 (ish). Using the common 80:20 ratio, 80% will fall into that band. The other 20% spread themselves between; pick your ist for the left; and fascist to the right.
At times of discontent, and this has has only started, there is a displacement from the 80 into the 20. The right is marginally less splintered than the left, so they can drag a couple of hundred people together for a march or rally. Unlike the main parties who a fag paper apart ideologically, the far right proselytes vigorously, through many channels, not least social media. The left are not doing this. The right are appealing to patriotism and nationalism. People will not suddenly turn from Lab/Tor to the BNP, but when the message is relentlessly presented, will move as far as UKIP.
I'm not putting this well. UKIP has become the acceptable face of bigotry, and will draw votes from the further right, and the Tories. I feel that there is an undercurrent saying, 'Don't worry, elect us, then we can put things right. The manifesto? Well that is a starting point really ', to try and draw the further right. I don't think UKIP will win more than a seat or two, but I bet their chunk of the vote will end up benefiting Milliband.
It is going to be an interesting election.
bluescreen
tofu eating wokerati
That much is undeniable, as in the legendary Chinese curse.
Sasaferrato
Super Refuser!
Indeed.
coley
Well-Known Member
Aye, interesting,if the Tories or labour had to try a coalition with a sizeable proportion of greens, independents, UKippers etc.
Bring it on.
Don't want the Tories, would marginally prefer labour, hopefully without Millipede, but a total crash with the above included in the mix?
Politics would be interesting, for a change.
Idris2002
canadian girlfriend
Why the long face?
dumb beast
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Looks unstable to me.
not-bono-ever
meh
Anti-immigration party wins Slovenia elections
Was going to start a new thread but have used this one instead. Slovenia is a bit of a bell weather I think ( obviously Poland and Hungary are already well down this route) - small, culturally sophisticated, relatively wealthy & first amongst the ex YugBlok to be embraced by the EU following the implosion of the area. There are still hefty customs and immigration on the borders between Slovenia and Croatia (I saw a 5 mile queue of trucks at the border a couple of weeks ago). Anti Immigrant party led by a dodgy politico have just nominally won the election. There seemed to be immigrant driven fear I found when out and bout.
"(Our) party puts Slovenia, Slovenians first " Hmmm
Was going to start a new thread but have used this one instead. Slovenia is a bit of a bell weather I think ( obviously Poland and Hungary are already well down this route) - small, culturally sophisticated, relatively wealthy & first amongst the ex YugBlok to be embraced by the EU following the implosion of the area. There are still hefty customs and immigration on the borders between Slovenia and Croatia (I saw a 5 mile queue of trucks at the border a couple of weeks ago). Anti Immigrant party led by a dodgy politico have just nominally won the election. There seemed to be immigrant driven fear I found when out and bout.
"(Our) party puts Slovenia, Slovenians first " Hmmm
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
Last edited:
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
notes available on request
YouSir
Retired from Urban
Was in Germany recently and saw some traces of the FR around. There was a big AfD protest in Berlin on the day I was there, although I'd no idea about it - apparently the counter-presence was sizeable. On the more mundane side though I came across a Pegida stage in Munich which I was told was a regular thing. Big platform, giant TVs, sound system etc with obligatory sunglasses wearing twat trying to look important while speeches were given. Absolutely zero audience though except for a couple (literally 2) protesters jeering in front of them. Felt like a very well funded SWP paper selling sort of thing. Apparently when it first started it was well attended by the right and there was lots of people out to counter it. Whether the descent into being insignificant and ignored is better than bigger but actively resisted on the regular is a good thing or not I don't know.
People I spoke to, who weren't particularly political, seemed to view the Fash over there as either an oddity, like most political cliques, or something that happened 'over there' (mostly the East) but which didn't really exist near them.
Anyway, there's my anecdotal observations.
People I spoke to, who weren't particularly political, seemed to view the Fash over there as either an oddity, like most political cliques, or something that happened 'over there' (mostly the East) but which didn't really exist near them.
Anyway, there's my anecdotal observations.
Jeremiah18.17
Well-Known Member
Don’t know how accurate this is, but details alarming inroads of new right, fascist and red-brown elements into environmental and animal rights movements in Italy. Similar process can be seen on smaller scale here - particularly in anti fracking and animal rights areas. https://antispefa.noblogs.org/files/2016/04/dossier-antispefa-eng_2016.pdf
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
nothing new, there's even been a fascist vegan cupcake place in camden
from the daily telegraph:
Neo-nazis join animal rights groups
By Daniel Foggo
12:00AM BST 03 Sep 2000
BRITISH neo-nazi groups are attempting to hijack the animal rights campaign by infiltrating protest groups, The Telegraph can reveal.
Extremists from a collection of hardline racist organisations have participated in a spate of demonstrations against animal testing in recent months, mingling with protesters.
The revelations about their presence will give further impetus to Jack Straw's new crackdown on animal rights extremists following last week's fire bombings of workers' cars at the Huntingdon Life Sciences, an animal experimentation laboratory in Cambridgeshire.
The neo-nazi groups are frequenting animal rights demonstrations in an attempt to capitalise upon the tension and controversy generated by the issue. Many of them subscribe to Adolf Hitler's original doctrine of a vegetarian, chemically untainted agrarian society in which vivisection is outlawed.
Their template is the so-called "Blood and Soil" doctrine drawn up by Hitler's agriculture minister Walther Darré. Their adherence to racist doctrine is, however, only thinly veiled. Part of their ethos is a vilification of what they call "alien ritual slaughter" - a reference to Jewish and Islamic methods of preparing meat.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
yeh it's an auld, auld story
Jeremiah18.17
Well-Known Member
I think key difference in two situations then and now was that in UK in 90s and noughties, the fash/new right were tiny irritations in an overwhelmingly left/anarchist dominated animal rights and environmental movement. In Italy at present they are a well funded, numerically increasing, multi pronged attack linked to the now ruling parties, facing a depleted and weakened left already suffering from the attentions (as in the UK, unfortunately) of the conspiracist/red-brown elements that are interlaced in various movements and can be seen to have spread tentacles, internet assisted, from the malign degeneration of Occupy/Anonymous/Wikileaks etc. The advance of reaction and conspiracism is visible both in electoralist and extra parliamentary politics - the Italians are perhaps just farther down that road than we are....
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
given assange's political mates include nigel farage and donald trump i don't really think that wikileaks has malignly degenerated at all.
there have been well-funded fascist groups in the uk, including the bnp (till dowson pulled out...), britain first (till dowson pulled out...). jim dowson definitely deserves more attention
BBC Radio 4 - The Invisible Man of Britain's Far Right
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