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The Alt-Left

Or you could have an alt-left that went back to its own perceived traditions, focusing on class struggle and the furthering of the interests of the proletariat
is that not just The Left?
but presenting themselves as something that would appeal to a 21st century crowd rather than a early 20th century one.
Suggests its a question of presentation. Do you have a clear idea of what "appealing to a 21st century crowd as opposed to a 20th century one" means? Im not sure.

Incidentally its the Grey Vote that seems to be in absolute ascendency at the moment, and the right is doing a great job of appealing to much of that blocks 20th century version of things, and winning off the back of it too.
 
I'd struggle to separate the alt-right from a sense of back-slapping superiority - it often comes across as an attempt to rise above a perceived wounded masculinity. It's difficult to see what is redeemable in that.

Having said that, I think there's space for some form of leftism that is sceptical of both market and state but doesn't sign up to any of the current far left ideologies. And has good memes.
 
I think - and I accept that this is dealing with superficialities, but that goes with the territory IMO - that much of this is about "branding" and "market position".

Alt-Right has become a convenient umbrella term to lump all kindsa disparate groups, individuals and ideas together, who otherwise wouldn't fit neatly into established labels. Others who would, are chucked in to (for convenience or for ballast). It suits the media, it suits (most of) those involved and fits the narrtives being touted at the moment from these areas.

Could there be a left mirror of this? Of course.
 
what makes the alt-right "alt" (as opposed to just Right)? that is the question...

I asked this previously, in Austria anyway normal right are different from nazi-right because they don't wear blue flowers on their lapels.
theres definitely a return to imagined christian values / the hetro nuclear family at core ...you could have an alt-left that did that too i guess if you really wanted

"No gods, no bosses, no husbands" no more...
 
is that not just The Left?

Suggests its a question of presentation. Do you have a clear idea of what "appealing to a 21st century crowd as opposed to a 20th century one" means? Im not sure.
For starters, dispense with rhetoric which the left has used without change for decades, with a result which includes "left of Labour alternatives" which fared abysmally (even if said groups claim those results as a victory). One thing you have to give the Green Party credit for, it ditched a lot of that tired dogma and appealed to many more people than any other left-of-Labour group, it's just a pity their principles were more to do with middle-class liberalism than genuine class struggle. I still have some brief hope that the left can properly gain traction and relevance now that Corbyn has caused lefties old and new to flock to the Labour Party and Momentum, but I am generally pessimistic on that front, a lot of the habits of the old left die hard, with infighting over points of dogma the course of the day.
 
Regardless, the absence of said dogma enabled it to be more successful whilst its presence among the left continues to hinder it. Indeed, now that a lot of progressively-minded people have gone over to Labour after Corbyn became leader, the hangers-on in the Greens are more likely to be bearing their own dogmas - and in environmentalism dogmas can be pretty unpleasant and reactionary.
 
I don't think the left has fully capitalized on the new media potential for spreading ideas well enough yet.
When I was in Left Unity a friend (who is still a member) and I were discussing how we as a party needed to spread the message on social media, and use memes to get the message out to a wider base. Unfortunately we were fighting a lot of inertia with a lot of the "old left" in the party who didn't get social media. However I did my best to make my local branch's Facebook page relevant and try and present it in a way that would appeal to people beyond the established left, before getting disillusioned with Left Unity for various reasons (including seemingly lacking any purpose and direction after Corbyn became Labour leader, and the endless faultlines on various issues where people would just not budge).
 
When I was in Left Unity a friend (who is still a member) and I were discussing how we as a party needed to spread the message on social media, and use memes to get the message out to a wider base. Unfortunately we were fighting a lot of inertia with a lot of the "old left" in the party who didn't get social media. However I did my best to make my local branch's Facebook page relevant and try and present it in a way that would appeal to people beyond the established left, before getting disillusioned with Left Unity for various reasons (including seemingly lacking any purpose and direction after Corbyn became Labour leader, and the endless faultlines on various issues where people would just not budge).

Been fighting the same issues here as well. For the left to be viable again they have to build media infrastructure that supports them, just as the right has done. I'd go so far as to suggest that we need our own "fake" news sites to put the messaging out there in a way that low information voters will latch onto. You'd be shocked a the volume of alt-right propaganda that gets shared over my Facebook feed each day. That needs countering in some way. It's no wonder that it gets believed when there's no counter-message.
 
Been fighting the same issues here as well. For the left to be viable again they have to build media infrastructure that supports them, just as the right has done. I'd go so far as to suggest that we need our own "fake" news sites to put the messaging out there in a way that low information voters will latch onto.
The left already has its "alternative media" which skews the facts in order to spin a message, The Canary for example is pretty much to Corbyn what Breitbart is to Trump. The problem is most of these sites are Clickbait Central, and their sensationalist reporting and embracing of all the worst aspects of identity politics is very offputting to those outside of the left milleu (not to mention plenty inside it). What is needed is calm, factual reporting, which doesn't infantalise its readership nor tries to use distortion and cherry picking of facts to push a narrative which can easily be picked apart as a result.
 
The left already has its "alternative media" which skews the facts in order to spin a message, The Canary for example is pretty much to Corbyn what Breitbart is to Trump. The problem is most of these sites are Clickbait Central, and their sensationalist reporting and embracing of all the worst aspects of identity politics is very offputting to those outside of the left milleu (not to mention plenty inside it). What is needed is calm, factual reporting, which doesn't infantalise its readership nor tries to use distortion and cherry picking of facts to push a narrative which can easily be picked apart as a result.

I'm unfamiliar with The Canary. Do you have a link?
 
confessions are never spent. you're thinking of convictions.
At the time I voted "yes, join" on that poll. What a difference nine years makes (my love affair with the Greens ended around 2012 when they behaved like any other party when given the chance to run Brighton council), at least I'm now older and wiser.
 
At the time I voted "yes, join" on that poll. What a difference nine years makes (my love affair with the Greens ended around 2012 when they behaved like any other party when given the chance to run Brighton council), at least I'm now older and wiser.
aulder anyway
 
When I was in Left Unity a friend (who is still a member) and I were discussing how we as a party needed to spread the message on social media, and use memes to get the message out to a wider base. Unfortunately we were fighting a lot of inertia with a lot of the "old left" in the party who didn't get social media. However I did my best to make my local branch's Facebook page relevant and try and present it in a way that would appeal to people beyond the established left, before getting disillusioned with Left Unity for various reasons (including seemingly lacking any purpose and direction after Corbyn became Labour leader, and the endless faultlines on various issues where people would just not budge).
Left UNity DID produce lots of good memes, even from their FB main page...they were widely liked and shared IIRC.
I thought the LU project was a good one - great party democracy + memes ;) They were in fact likely what this thread is about - consciously formed to be "a UKIP of the Left".
 
BTW, I'm not suggesting "infantalising" the readership, just suggesting that we need to talk about things they care about. Most people care mostly about making a living and taking care of their families. Some of the messaging on the left has been pretty disconnected from that reality.
 
Left UNity DID produce lots of good memes, even from their FB main page...they were widely liked and shared IIRC.
I thought the LU project was a good one - great party democracy + memes ;) They were in fact likely what this thread is about - consciously formed to be "a UKIP of the Left".
When I was involved it was a very exciting project to get involved in. Unfortunately there were plenty of bitter arguments over the strangest of issues, the shenanigans of the CPGB did not help much, and when Corbyn surprised everyone by only going and bloody well winning the Labour leadership election it ran out of steam, most of those still in LU are there because they think Labour will never be revolutionary enough for them, or due to being previously expelled from the Labour Party for being too left wing back in the 80s.
 
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A model of spreading your message - the one you and your party/network etc have decided is correct - to 'the people' is pretty much just what the left has always done. There's nothing alt- about that. We're just back where we started then aren't we?
 
Another thing - again based upon superficial observation - that the Alt-Right appears to be doing that might be mirrored in a left version is the seeming willingness for all the disparate "members" to just carry on doing their own thing (whilst accepting an umbrella label) and thus avoid the energy sapping takeover manouevering/drives for unity.

Though butchersapron mentions a split within the alt-right ranks which may disprove these superficial observations of mine...
 
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