ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Interesting that you grasp this basic truth easily, while others appear to have difficulty with it. The march as a means, not as the end.
Stand up to Lambeth Council - Windrush Square rally and march, Sat 8th Oct
- Thread starter editor
- Start date
Interesting that you grasp this basic truth easily, while others appear to have difficulty with it. The march as a means, not as the end.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
No, the issue at hand being that - regardless of what some wiberals believe - marches are not an end, they're one of many routes to an end. Waaay too many "activists" confine their "activism" to marches, where they mingle with like-minded people, rather than engaging in the project of winning hearts and minds over to the ideas behind the march.
STAND UP... aim to use the march as a basis - one of many - for an ongoing debate about, and questioning of Lambeth Labour's role in carrying out Tory cuts, in providing appalling levels of service, to selling off public goods for short-term political ends. A march alone doesn't do that, but using the march as a basis for facilitating and propagating that debate, does.
Pink Glitter
New Member
My response to the ridiculous reporting in the Brixton Blog.......Kx
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Thank you Andrew St John for putting the venerable Brixton Blog right in their shoddy journalism. I have not much to add except that, while Nicola & I would ADORE being credited with organising this on our own…..the truth is that would be likening a couple of toddlers trying to control a chariot in the Circus Maximus!!! This is a huge group of people, many of whom were for some reason or another unable to actively participate in the march, but nevertheless are members of a section of the community who are deeply dissatisfied with the services being provided by our Lambeth “Labour” Council. Many of us, as the Brixton Blog are well aware, as they have just reported on a large donation being made to the Save Cressingham campaign, are being threatened with the loss of our homes, whether tenant or leaseholder as a result of the regeneration plans….a tory policy, zealously embraced by Lambeth Council. Not only do the policies threaten our homes and communities, they threaten to thrust many of our most vulnerable citizens into a care system, which also as a result of Lambeth Council policies is being slashed to the bone, thus removing a support system when it will be most needed. This protest is not a churlish yell at the council to stop misbehaving, but a cry to the country to see what is going on here, how society is being manipulated by so-called Labour Councils in a move widely recognised by those who can see clearly, as gentrification on a massive scale. Social cleansing is at the heart of these policies, and if it is allowed to continue, we can all be prepared to take a huge step back into the history of our country where workhouses, debtors prisons, the Bethlehem madhouse and societal segregation were the norm. Total control is coming unless we fight back, and the country supports us. Karen Bennett
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Thank you Andrew St John for putting the venerable Brixton Blog right in their shoddy journalism. I have not much to add except that, while Nicola & I would ADORE being credited with organising this on our own…..the truth is that would be likening a couple of toddlers trying to control a chariot in the Circus Maximus!!! This is a huge group of people, many of whom were for some reason or another unable to actively participate in the march, but nevertheless are members of a section of the community who are deeply dissatisfied with the services being provided by our Lambeth “Labour” Council. Many of us, as the Brixton Blog are well aware, as they have just reported on a large donation being made to the Save Cressingham campaign, are being threatened with the loss of our homes, whether tenant or leaseholder as a result of the regeneration plans….a tory policy, zealously embraced by Lambeth Council. Not only do the policies threaten our homes and communities, they threaten to thrust many of our most vulnerable citizens into a care system, which also as a result of Lambeth Council policies is being slashed to the bone, thus removing a support system when it will be most needed. This protest is not a churlish yell at the council to stop misbehaving, but a cry to the country to see what is going on here, how society is being manipulated by so-called Labour Councils in a move widely recognised by those who can see clearly, as gentrification on a massive scale. Social cleansing is at the heart of these policies, and if it is allowed to continue, we can all be prepared to take a huge step back into the history of our country where workhouses, debtors prisons, the Bethlehem madhouse and societal segregation were the norm. Total control is coming unless we fight back, and the country supports us. Karen Bennett
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
I'm not convinced that it was "shoddy journalism". Alan Slingsby gets his reporting right often enough that I reckon that he either deliberately slanted his story, or (probably more likely) his editor did. Why? Because the Blog/Bugle rely on Lambeth or have previously relied on Lambeth for part of their income stream. You don't bite the hand that feeds, even if you pride yourself - as the Blog/Bugle seems to - on being fearless and independent.
editor
hiraethified
He runs the site so I very much doubt if he has an 'editor.' There's no reason to imagine the words are anyone else's but his own.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
My response to the Blog article that I put up on the Brixton chatter thread.
I was at the march.
I did not see what happened with the Labour party stall. So no first hand account from me on that.
Its an unnecessarily negative article.
Something like this is a broad church. From protest groups like the library campaign to hard left. Like the RCG and I also saw the local anarchist/ autonomist group present. Both groups are not opportunistically trying to use marches like this to gain cadres.
The RCG have given a lot of support to ordinary people and there housing. Such as the E15 mothers in East London.
Yes there views are on the extreme end but they should not just be dismissed as they were in the the Blog piece.
The local Anarchist/autonomist group have also given a lot of support to local struggles. They tend to be more low profile.
Both produce really good banners etc.
Momentum were at the demo with there banner. So the Blog piece was wrong on this. I did chat to a couple of local Momentum supporters.
Cllr Rachel also attended the march.
Kate Hoey could not attend but sent the piece in the Blog that was read out at beginning of the march to applause.
Demos and marches are lively affairs and not always harmonious. Thats not a weakness but a strength.
I was at the march.
I did not see what happened with the Labour party stall. So no first hand account from me on that.
Its an unnecessarily negative article.
Something like this is a broad church. From protest groups like the library campaign to hard left. Like the RCG and I also saw the local anarchist/ autonomist group present. Both groups are not opportunistically trying to use marches like this to gain cadres.
The RCG have given a lot of support to ordinary people and there housing. Such as the E15 mothers in East London.
Yes there views are on the extreme end but they should not just be dismissed as they were in the the Blog piece.
The local Anarchist/autonomist group have also given a lot of support to local struggles. They tend to be more low profile.
Both produce really good banners etc.
Momentum were at the demo with there banner. So the Blog piece was wrong on this. I did chat to a couple of local Momentum supporters.
Cllr Rachel also attended the march.
Kate Hoey could not attend but sent the piece in the Blog that was read out at beginning of the march to applause.
Demos and marches are lively affairs and not always harmonious. Thats not a weakness but a strength.
My Post On Awful Brixton Blog.
I hear that Brixton Blog is funded by Lambeth Council, well well well.
"I wont thank you Allan for your sloppy journalism, “violently dismantling a Labour Party stall”, what utter nonsense, a small Labour party banner attached with drawing pins was pulled off from the front stall BUT only after I was told by the older gentleman behind the stall that they were NOT supporting the Stand Up To Lambeth Council campaign that they had crashed nor was the gentleman in question willing to display any of our flyers!
It is always wise to get ‘Both’ sides of any story & you ‘Chose’ not to, making no attempt at all to speak to me apart from barking out for my name, how very rude of you.
Alan it saddens & frustrates me that you have totally failed to empathize how stressful it is for Lambeth council tenants like myself who live in a borough where our council (Labour) have a wrecking ball hanging over our homes! Maybe you are lucky enough to own your own home.
It cannot be anything other than personnel.
Finally I have been a loyal Labour party voter all my life, I count myself on the Liberal Left politically & not the far left, actually I voted for Helen Hayes last year, something I now regret since discovering that she is a major property developer & for the demolition of Lambeth council estates. Since then I cannot justify my support & like many I feel very betrayed especially by our local Lambeth Labour Council who are causing such misery.
I think it is fair to assume by the tone of this article that your loyalties are with Lib Peck & the progress wing of the Labour party. How very depressing."
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Was talking to a member of the Labour Party who was on the demo.
The was a difference of opinion on the leaflet.
Its discussed on this RCG article on the march.
One leaflet among other demands was for the Lambeth Council Labour Cabinet to resign. It was not on the leaflets I got the weekend before to distribute.
The right of the Labour party used this to attack Momentum. ( There logo was on the leaflet). There is link to Ed Balls twitter with a lively discussion in the RCG article.
Momentum put out on twitter a denial that they supported this particular demand.
ASH- Architects for Social Housing whose leading light I think is in RCG decided to withdraw from march.
The Lambeth section of Momentum piece on the leaflet.
I am staying neutral on this. Was trawling through FB to find what was behind it. As my friend was asking about it.
What I would say is that there are differences of political opinion.
RCG - see Labour Party and Trade Unions as irremediably reformist. They are the enemy as much as this Tory government is. That would be there stance on any issue affecting the working class. Its not just no point working with them but counter productive.
Momentum - ( and many ordinary Labour party members) would want to take critical stance to a Labour Council as in Lambeth which is dominated by the right of the party. But not reject the Labour Party or Trade Unions as part of broad based campaign.
Its all unfortunate imo. The way that Lambeth Progress Cllrs attacked Stand up to Lambeth was a lot about there fear of the new people who joined the party due to Corbyn.
Secondly a lot of people on the march- upset about what is happening to Libraries , Estates etc I would guess are not in any party. They are pissed off locals from a variety of backgrounds. Who do not feel the Council listens.
This argument about the leaflet does bring up issues of how to unite together people from different political backgrounds ( and none). How to oppose the actions of a Labour Council which is under pressure from a Tory Government.
I dont have all the answers to this. I also hope that a good idea like Stand Up to Lambeth keeps going. From what I saw of the march it does contain a wide range of people.
The was a difference of opinion on the leaflet.
Its discussed on this RCG article on the march.
One leaflet among other demands was for the Lambeth Council Labour Cabinet to resign. It was not on the leaflets I got the weekend before to distribute.
The right of the Labour party used this to attack Momentum. ( There logo was on the leaflet). There is link to Ed Balls twitter with a lively discussion in the RCG article.
Momentum put out on twitter a denial that they supported this particular demand.
ASH- Architects for Social Housing whose leading light I think is in RCG decided to withdraw from march.
The Lambeth section of Momentum piece on the leaflet.
I am staying neutral on this. Was trawling through FB to find what was behind it. As my friend was asking about it.
What I would say is that there are differences of political opinion.
RCG - see Labour Party and Trade Unions as irremediably reformist. They are the enemy as much as this Tory government is. That would be there stance on any issue affecting the working class. Its not just no point working with them but counter productive.
Momentum - ( and many ordinary Labour party members) would want to take critical stance to a Labour Council as in Lambeth which is dominated by the right of the party. But not reject the Labour Party or Trade Unions as part of broad based campaign.
Its all unfortunate imo. The way that Lambeth Progress Cllrs attacked Stand up to Lambeth was a lot about there fear of the new people who joined the party due to Corbyn.
Secondly a lot of people on the march- upset about what is happening to Libraries , Estates etc I would guess are not in any party. They are pissed off locals from a variety of backgrounds. Who do not feel the Council listens.
This argument about the leaflet does bring up issues of how to unite together people from different political backgrounds ( and none). How to oppose the actions of a Labour Council which is under pressure from a Tory Government.
I dont have all the answers to this. I also hope that a good idea like Stand Up to Lambeth keeps going. From what I saw of the march it does contain a wide range of people.
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
Surely the reason Progress councillors attack such demonstrations is that they see themselves as doing a good job for their constituents?
I shouldn't think people like Lib Peck, Paul McGlone and their cabinet colleagues actually go to bed at night thinking they are attacking the rights and services of ordinary people.
Surely THEIR rationale is that the government has set the parameters, and their council is making the best of it - playing the capitalists at their own game if you like.
MY view is that until there is a change at the top - meaning the government decides to look again at council funding, social housing etc. we are a bit stuck.
At least with a Labour Mayor of London, there is no political objection if housing policy was redirected to a mass building programme for social housing.
Although that said with Boris's energy and perversity I doubt there would have been from him either - if the government had given him his orders.
I don't agree with the balance of measures adopted by Lambeth Progress Co-op Labour, but then again without a shift in government policy the council has limited room for manoeuvre IMHO. The social and ethnic cleansing is a direct consequence of government policy. If the council refused to go along with it presumably services and the environment would just get more and more run-down.
Maybe RCG think this would induce revolutionary consciousness? I think it would induce more squalor - and more crime.
newbie
undisambiguated
that covers us and (sfaik) the friends we met there.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
RCG haven't tried to impose at all on the "philosophical" side of Stand Up. They're well aware that the majority of people aren't revolutionary, but they get stuck in with the hard work anyway, because it's the right thing to do.
TBF, both the ASH and the Momentum issues were honest mistakes. With ASH, one member - who attended every Stand Up meeting - thought he had the endorsement of ASH's glorious leader, but was later told that he didn't (and was probably accused of bourgeois decadence, to boot!).
With Momentum, the issue was more complex. Several Momentum members attended each of the meetings, all of who purported to speak authoritatively for the branch. Stand Up went with what they were told - that Momentum supported all of our statements of aims - and got kicked in the arse for it, when Momentum's committee decided to row back from some of it.
As for "Labour council under a Tory government", we're both of us well aware that the fuckwads at the Town Hall were engaging in this shit before there was a Tory govt. They do it because they're neoliberals who use the "Labour" name as a mask for their Tory policies.
editor
hiraethified
Me too.
