Sheridan wins libel case

[q_w_e_r_t_y]

So who's allowed to vote in your party then?

Vote on what?

We primarily operate through a geographic branch structure, above the branches are the regions, and above the regions is the National Council. Annual conference is the sovereign body, with the EC responsible for actioning Conference and NC decisions.

Additionally we also have trade union branches; networks who have network rights and platforms who have platform rights

The constitution is available here.
http://www.scottishsocialistparty.org/pdfs/SSPConstitutionMarch2006.pdf

 

[treelover]

Que?

As it would seem you

 

[belboid]

dont worry treelover, this penless bugger just seems to be barking

 

[anybodygotapen?]

Vote on what?

We primarily operate through a geographic branch structure, above the branches are the regions, and above the regions is the National Council. Annual conference is the sovereign body, with the EC responsible for actioning Conference and NC decisions.

Additionally we also have trade union branches; networks who have network rights and platforms who have platform rights

The constitution is available here.
http://www.scottishsocialistparty.org/pdfs/SSPConstitutionMarch2006.pdf

So one man one vote doesn't equate in your world?

 

[anybodygotapen?]

viva democracy

 

[belboid]

do you still think TS used to be an SWP member penless?

In fact, fuck the pen, do you have a clue?

 

[dennisr]

do you still think TS used to be an SWP member penless?

In fact, fuck the pen, do you have a clue?

clearly not... s/he seems to be madder than a box of frogs and equally pointless

 

[anybodygotapen?]

ye bampot

 

[anybodygotapen?]

This is interesting.

Do we have 'Political Scabs' online?

Get a fecking vote!

 

[cutandsplice]

clearly not... s/he seems to be madder than a box of frogs and equally pointless

That's a slur on frogs!

 

[anybodygotapen?]

You people are well fucked and well you know it.

Socialism?

You would not even know it if it kicked you up the arse.

 

[Bear]

Idiots

its a bit windy - but i suspect thats the basic story of what happened

I read the bit in this when they said Tommy was like the star striker but that he couldn't have got anywhere without his defenders and midfielders.

The bottom line is Tommy didn't need them and the other five got elected hanging on to Tommy Sheridans coats tails. It seems that they really don't wanna believe that.

 

[Sue]

What I think is interesting is that the jury were out for less than three hours and it was a 7-4 verdict. Given the length of the trial, that doesn't seem that long to deliberate and it does make you wonder how important the fact it was on Friday afternoon was.

Have to say I'm gobsmacked by the result -- and so is everyone else I've spoken to. Seems the pressure's on for people to be tried for perjury but given the higher standard of proof required in a criminal rather than a civil trial, I've no idea how likely that is to be a runner -- after all, who knows who was lying?

I'm sorry the SSP's been left in the state it has but I can't help but feel that this was exactly why everyone but Tommy thought pursuing the libel case was a bad idea. What a fucking mess.

 

[Bear]

...What a fucking mess.

The far left will always be a "fucken mess".

There is more chance of all the churches in the world getting together and truely uniting all Christians than there is of the far left uniting.

But you can't put all the blame on Tommy Sheridan.

If they'd have had any sense they'd have done what any other party in that situation would do, they'd have asked the leader not to tell them anything about his or her private life that could result in them being placed in a situation they probably wouldn't want to be in, and they'd have lent the leader moral support only.

That's what every other party (or anyone with half a brain) would do! Give them moral support (not risk the party) and ask not to be told anything that they and/or the party would be best of not knowing, we are after all talking about someone's private life here so it's perfectly acceptable to say 'I don't want to know anything'. If I were on the SSP exec I'd have said something like: 'if you're going to court good luck to you, the SSP can't risk backing you up financially but I hope you win, now please don't tell me anything that you think I'd be better of not knowing; because I don't want to have to tell the court anything bad about you, and if they ask and I know, then I will, okay?'. It wouldn't have mattered to me if I liked Tommy or disapproved of what he was supposed to have been doing. What he was accused of was a private matter and not a criminal offense and it didn't involve the party. Politics is not about liking and approving of people, it's about uniting behind a set of common goals to try and get the country to take some steps towards becoming the kind of society you want to live in and choosing a leader who is able to delivery the best results. What did these idiots do -

Ditch the only person capable of leading them to decent election results.
Ask questions the answers to which could (and did) land them up in court
Give info to the press (Backstab).

Those incompetent idiot can't even run a party, if they were ever given the chance to run the country they'd no doubt fuck that up too, so I'm glad they'll never get the chance to wreak the place.

 

[Sue]

If they'd have had any sense they'd have done what any other party in that situation would do, they'd have asked the leader not to tell them anything about his or her private life that could result in them being placed in a situation they probably wouldn't want to be in, and they'd have lent the leader moral support only.

That's what every other party (or anyone with half a brain) would do! Give them moral support (not risk the party) and ask not to be told anything that they and/or the party would be best of not knowing, we are after all talking about someone's private life here so it's perfectly acceptable to say 'I don't want to know anything'. If I were on the SSP exec I'd have said something like: 'if you're going to court good luck to you, the SSP can't risk backing you up financially but I hope you win, now please don't tell me anything that you think I'd be better of not knowing; because I don't want to have to tell the court anything bad about you, and if they ask and I know, then I will, okay?'. It wouldn't have mattered to me if I liked Tommy or disapproved of what he was supposed to have been doing. What he was accused of was a private matter and not a criminal offense and it didn't involve the party.

...

What did these idiots do -

Ditch the only person capable of leading them to decent election results.
Ask questions the answers to which could (and did) land them up in court
Give info to the press (Backstab).

Those incompetent idiot can't even run a party, if they were ever given the chance to run the country they'd no doubt fuck that up too, so I'm glad they'll never get the chance to wreak the place.

Bear, with hindsight, yes, maybe from a legal point of view people shouldn't have discussed the situation but in the real world, of course they were going to, if only to try and find out what the hell was going on. I suppose maybe they also thought that Tommy would listen to what seemed to be the overwhelming opinion -- that he shouldn't pursue the libel action.

As it is, I don't pretend to know all the 'who did what to who' thing (I'm not an SSP member or that) but it seems there was backstabbing and lies told on both sides. And the casualty in all this is the party. I feel really sorry for those who've put in all the hard work over the years that it should end like this.

 

[Wilf]

This is interesting.

Do we have 'Political Scabs' online?

Get a fecking vote!

You people are well fucked and well you know it.

Socialism?

You would not even know it if it kicked you up the arse.

I would guess from all this arm waving and shouting that you are one of the people trying to get Sheridan back as leader...

Just wondered though, who you think we are? Are you assuming that all the people questioning Sheridan's strategy and motives are active members of the SSP anti-Sheridan faction?

 

[Bear]

Bear, with hindsight, yes, maybe from a legal point of view people shouldn't have discussed the situation but in the real world, of course they were going to, if only to try and find out what the hell was going on. I suppose maybe they also thought that Tommy would listen to what seemed to be the overwhelming opinion -- that he shouldn't pursue the libel action.

As it is, I don't pretend to know all the 'who did what to who' thing (I'm not an SSP member or that) but it seems there was backstabbing and lies told on both sides. And the casualty in all this is the party. I feel really sorry for those who've put in all the hard work over the years that it should end like this.

No in the real world politically aware party members wouldn't discuss it. Remember that minister who asked her husband not to tell her things about their finiances that she'd be better of not knowing? You'd find most politicans have the sense to take steps like that, it's just that bunch of hopeless fuckwits who didn't.

Yeah, of course there was backstabbing from all sides, they're a total joke.

 

[anybodygotapen?]

I would guess from all this arm waving and shouting that you are one of the people trying to get Sheridan back as leader...

Just wondered though, who you think we are? Are you assuming that all the people questioning Sheridan's strategy and motives are active members of the SSP anti-Sheridan faction?

Well for a start. I'm pretty sure that the Sheridan fella (as did many others) was cringing at the sight of the SSP's leader running about, a la fathers 4 justice stylee, dressed up as Robin Hood and calling for what exactly? Pure mince from start to finish.

As for me assuming that you are a member of the SSP for questioning 'Sheridan's strategy'?

WTF?

Why dont you tell me what this so called 'Sheridan strategy' is meant to be. Someone who kicks the Murdoch press right between where the eyes dont meet? Someone who at long fecking last has brought to the public view that the party has been hijacked by an unelected and unrepresentitive cult out to do their own bidding at the expense of others?

If the SSP is ever to survive, only a major cull at the very top and genuine grass roots democracy (one member one vote) will save it.

OH and I'm not a member of the Scottish Socialist Party btw, Kick the parasitic cabal out and I may very well reconsider my position.

 

[Bear]

Well for a start. I'm pretty sure that the Sheridan fella (as did many others) was cringing at the sight of the SSP's leader running about, a la fathers 4 justice stylee, dressed up as Robin Hood and calling for what exactly? Pure mince from start to finish.

As for me assuming that you are a member of the SSP for questioning 'Sheridan's strategy'?

WTF?

Why dont you tell me what this so called 'Sheridan strategy' is meant to be. Someone who kicks the Murdoch press right between where the eyes dont meet? Someone who at long fecking last has brought to the public view that the party has been hijacked by an unelected and unrepresentitive cult out to do their own bidding at the expense of others?

If the SSP is ever to survive, only a major cull at the very top and genuine grass roots democracy (one member one vote) will save it.

OH and I'm not a member of the Scottish Socialist Party btw, Kick the parasitic cabal out and I may very well reconsider my position.

I don't think they'll be able to do one member one vote since the RMT are part of the SSP and can vote at conference. The SSP is still however quite democratic, I believe policy made at conference is binding.

 

[Bear]

As for me assuming that you are a member of the SSP for questioning 'Sheridan's strategy'?

WTF?

Why dont you tell me what this so called 'Sheridan strategy' is meant to be.

The 'Sheridan strategy' was quite a good one. As far as I understand it, it basically goes like this: 'If the gutter press print damaging shite about you, and you know that they can't prove it, then sue their arse off!' That strategy's pretty cool.

But some of the people on his party had a shite strategy that basically seems to me to be going something like this: 'Ask questions that will land you up in court just because you want to know about someone elses private life and stab the only capable leader in the back if you don't like them'.

 

[Sue]

The 'Sheridan strategy' was quite a good one. As far as I understand it, it basically goes like this: 'If the gutter press print damaging shite about you, and you know that they can't prove it, then sue their arse off!' That strategy's pretty cool.

Interesting you say 'If the gutter press print damaging shite about you, and you know that they can't prove it, then sue their arse off!' rather than 'and it's completely untrue....'

No in the real world politically aware party members wouldn't discuss it....

I also think that's nonsense. Surely if it's someone you know and the press is coming out with allsorts you'd want to know what was going on, if only because it's tarnishing your party by association? I don't think it's unreasonable for people to ask what's going on without expecting to end up in a libel court.

 

[tollbar]

Gail Sheridan will be on GMTV in the morning.

 

[Fullyplumped]

Muppet Marxists who couldn’t take the heat

You may have missed Iain Macwhirter's article in today's Herald.

The result is that after the next Scottish parliamentary elections in May, the Scottish Greens could, just conceivably, be participating in government. If Jack McConnell loses as badly as some Labour MSPs believe he could, then there is an opening for a Liberal-SNP coalition, in which the Scottish Greens might hold the balance of power. Especially if, as seems likely, the Greens inherit many of the SSP votes.
​

What it confirms is that parties like the SSP can really only function on the outside of politics as extra-parliamentary organisations. The far left thrives on exclusion from the centres of power. Unburdened by any legislative responsibility, the SSP could devote its time to surfing the alienation of the housing estates of Scotland, backing ethnic minorities and attracting the cameras with its elaborate gestures of nuclear defiance at Faslane. Tommy Sheridan was never happier than when he was in the arms of the police, being carried to the paddy wagon, pursued by the nation's press and TV. Contrast, again, with the Greens, who have largely made the transition from extra-parliamentary politics, and have largely abandoned stunts.​

 

[Bear]

I don't think it's unreasonable for people to ask what's going on without expecting to end up in a libel court.

It might not be unreasonable to want to know but asking in minuted meeting attended by 18 people is exceedingly naive, especially if the person has already said they're taking the matter to court. You wouldn't find the leaders of any of the mainstream parties behaving like that.

 

[danny la rouge]

on now, sex lies, and socialism, news 24

I watched that with interest; it was Tommy's body language, attitude and demeanor that persuaded me that Tommy's version of events was ... lacking. Having read the SSP EC's (un-proof read, in-need-of serious editing*) pdf, I think it has the ring of truth.

(*They should have cut the first three and a half pages, lost all the passages about the SWP and the CWI, and used a spell checker).

 

[Fisher_Gate]

My endangering the site exists only in your paranoid mind. But I will desist from posting part two so as not to cause you further anxiety.

Think about why 3 MSPs have already issued a public statement.

It's clear which side I am on.

The full text is at:
http://www.ssp-ul.org/

 

[tollbar]

If you take the view expressed by Mike McNair in the weekly worker, this site and elsewhere are unlikely to be threatened because TS failed to take out an injunction to stop the allegations being repeated, which seemingly is the usual procedure in these cases.

It seems that TS in sacking his briefs probably failed to get advice to do this.

 

[JHE]

If you take the view expressed by Mike McNair in the weekly worker, this site and elsewhere are unlikely to be threatened because TS failed to take out an injunction to stop the allegations being repeated, which seemingly is the usual procedure in these cases.

Oy! Watch it, you! Big Tommy'll take yous all on - vain, lying, disloyal, party-destroying git though he is said to be.

 

[danny la rouge]

Oy! Watch it, you! Big Tommy'll take yous all on - vain, lying, disloyal, party-destroying git though he is said to be.

He'll come unstuck, though. Like Danny Baldwin he felt he had to keep the lie going once he was found out, no matter who it hurt. But there's going to be a Leanne/Mike's Will moment out there somewhere, isn't there...

 

[Julie]

Just a shame that libel damages aren't more punitive I'd love to see that Vile Aussie(American) tax dodger be put out of business.

Me too! I loathe him