Post-referendum HandWringo™!
- Thread starter DaveCinzano
- Start date
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
They have people for that sort of thing. This is their debut.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Steel Icarus
we move
This one's doing the rounds at the moment
two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
The original quote:
How can you take 'access to a large pool of cheap labour' personally? The original statement one obviously referred to the 1900s before WW1 when 'Britain was Great'. At that time there was a large pool of cheap labour.
Are you offended by that statement? If so, please explain.
'Oh hang on ..' is clearly enough asking whether the person making the quote wants Britain to be Great by having employment conditions like those in Victorian times.
You want to know whether to be offended by this? It's a lighthearted throwaway comment. Get a fucking grip both of you.
i think that quote is from me. If so I would've appreciated you tagging me or something if you're going to take it out of context and use it in an argument I'm not participating in tbh.
If I remember rightly I was responding to another poster's use of the term, which is why I said 'those'. I've got a feeling I might have added the angry bit.
two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
Yes, sorry I should have tagged you - I didn't because what you've put is clearly not offensive to anyone with half a brain.
alright cheers
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I am awaiting izz's explanation. Your understanding is not yet 'obvious.' Of course people are more than belonging to a large pool of cheap labour. Also, labour shouldn't be paid cheaply, from either here or abroad. I understood her post as being in relation to the EU leave vote partly based on the prospect of immigration restrictions (that large pool of cheap labour). What a horrible (and liberal) view of humanity. My personal feelings are not that important when looking at it like that.
Signed
two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
where did she say they weren't?
where did she say they should?
Fair enough, it looks a bit of a leap to me though. We'll see what she responds.
And isn't that how companies have actually used immigration, though, to force down wages and conditions? I couldn't see anything in her post that suggested she thought it was a good idea.
Yes, by the companies doing it. Where is the problem with just commenting that this is happening which is all I see her post actually did?
seventh bullet
sovietwave
It's not the reality of people's economic place/role I am denying but how people see it as alright, something good socially. Usually by those who aren't in those positions. I am waiting for her. Right now, though, I am off out to watch a giant evil alien mothership thousands of miles across attack earth.
two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
Errm
izz
Did you mean that you feel that the way to make Britain Great again is to have access to a large pool of cheap labour? I'd choose your words carefully
See I get confused. People from the left have for years been expressing the belief that diversity in makeup of the country's population has generally good effects and that we welcome immigration.
In reality, the way neoliberal governments and businesses have implemented it has forced down wages and conditions for workers and put pressure on housing and services that are anyway being starved out.
When workers have suffered from and objected to this, they have often by the left been labeled racist. They therefore see what they'd class as the 'liberal' left (i.e. including most people on urban) still encouraging a policy that - in reality - has forced down their wages and conditions, and abusing them when they object.
The 'liberals' are accused of abusing working class people when they associate a leave vote with immigration. But when anyone comes on urban who expresses that opinion they get told to fuck off.
izz
Did you mean that you feel that the way to make Britain Great again is to have access to a large pool of cheap labour? I'd choose your words carefully
See I get confused. People from the left have for years been expressing the belief that diversity in makeup of the country's population has generally good effects and that we welcome immigration.
In reality, the way neoliberal governments and businesses have implemented it has forced down wages and conditions for workers and put pressure on housing and services that are anyway being starved out.
When workers have suffered from and objected to this, they have often by the left been labeled racist. They therefore see what they'd class as the 'liberal' left (i.e. including most people on urban) still encouraging a policy that - in reality - has forced down their wages and conditions, and abusing them when they object.
The 'liberals' are accused of abusing working class people when they associate a leave vote with immigration. But when anyone comes on urban who expresses that opinion they get told to fuck off.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I am not anti-immigration. I am anti-boss use of immigration to divide people. The w/c (not poshos wanking on about their relationship to MoP) is as diverse as you like, ime. Something the m/c liberals might not like.
I think there are less liberals in the politics forums, which is not representative of the site generally. Still got socialists/anarchists/communists knocking about.
I think there are less liberals in the politics forums, which is not representative of the site generally. Still got socialists/anarchists/communists knocking about.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Don;t want to derail too much (and I equally don't want to re-run old arguments) but how are you defining w/c then?
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I thought you would show up.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
I thought you might be thinking that. Here I am. Well? The w/c how you defining it?
seventh bullet
sovietwave
We have aready been over this. We are in agreement. Still can't take it seriously when the poshos do it, though. It's another reason why the 'left' isn't taken seriously by working class people. Maybe it has something to do with there being a material basis to cultural differences and stratification within the working class. Also, the relative but very real privileges/advantages that are invisible to those holding them but stick out very clearly to others. Who gets to decide what is important. The actual real-lived experience of who is and who isn't on the sharp end of neoliberal politic/economics in this society.
Are you taking something personally, perhaps?
Are you taking something personally, perhaps?
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Thanks.
No, nothing personal. I just worry that class could become reduced to yet another purely culturally defined identity to be chucked into the wheel of intersectionality. And on a vastly reduced basis to its actual size. That's all. It's the relationship to MoP that provides the foundation for what makes class different form cultural identities, and what gives the w/c a unique power to change stuff.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
You've known me long enough on here.
The 'left' needs purging of middle class scum, though.
The 'left' needs purging of middle class scum, though.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
..and yes, on a thread about liberal m/c handwringing, and where there is discussion to be had about material interests and voting direction and the the whole thing referred to earlier about the confusion of the re-proletraianisation of middle-class millenials with generational stuff, I think this stuff is interesting.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Yeah. Sorry. Maybe I'm feeling guilty about voting remain!
I wouldn't know. i don't meet any m/c lefties.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I don't know any w/c ones. The left doesn't exist in my life or in the lives of anybody I know. It would be good if there was one that is actually relevant.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Yeah.
...is true for me too these days. It did in Italy. It had a real, concrete, presence in my neighborhood and my workplace. But since moving back here its been utterly absent in my everyday life. In fairness, this is the first time in the 4 years that anybody has been interested in discussing politics. Interesting times.
Steel Icarus
we move
It would appear not, Grayson
