Post-referendum HandWringo™!

[two sheds]

The EU. Oh come on.

you meant me supporting the EU?

 

[butchersapron]

The liberal dog-whistle has been amazing since thursday. They can spot int and call it over 'race' - but anything else...what you on about?

 

[butchersapron]

you meant me supporting the EU?

I mean the people in the article that you asked me about.

 

[two sheds]

Dones anyone remember the French fascist Bloc Identitair video which blamed the older generation ?

Nope not the sort of thing I'd want to watch.

 

[two sheds]

I mean the people in the article that you asked me about.

Ah ok sorry. Yes but as I say they just look like spoiled brats to me.

 

[butchersapron]

Well in that our generation has had it really easy but have now pulled up the drawbridge so they don't get the grants we did etc etc etc.

They sounded like spoiled brats but kids get emotional shocker.

You think that this is true? And that it has something to do with the EU vote? The mass of old people didn't go to university - they were excluded for economic/political reasons.

 

[butchersapron]

Ah ok sorry. Yes but as I say they just look like spoiled brats to me.

Who have a point about non-spoiled people. Ok

 

[The39thStep]

Nope not the sort of thing I'd want to watch.

Soz I edited my post to try and make a point quicker

 

[two sheds]

You think that this is true? And that it has something to do with the EU vote? The mass of old people didn't go to university - they were excluded for economic/political reasons.

Yes true. People I know who didn't get a grant were generally able to get a job, though. Houses were 10 or 12 grand so not just the wealthy could buy. We weren't faced with the unemployment of now, and there wasn't the harassment of people on benefits that there is now.

Wanky language but
Revealed: the 30-year economic betrayal dragging down Generation Y’s income with graphs.

Pensioners have seen significantly higher disposable income growth than young people in almost every wealthy country over the last few decades

 

[butchersapron]

Yes true. People I know who didn't get a grant were generally able to get a job, though. Houses were 10 or 12 grand so not just the wealthy could buy. We weren't faced with the unemployment of now, and there wasn't the harassment of people on benefits that there is now.

Wanky language but
Revealed: the 30-year economic betrayal dragging down Generation Y’s income with graphs.

I'm not on about students. I'm on about non-graduates.

 

[two sheds]

Soz I edited my post to try and make a point quicker

Yes read it and is fair enough. You're using liberal interchangeably with neo-liberal, though. The way it's used on urban Cameron would class as a liberal, in which case the word's become meaningless.

But whatever. people can keep whinging about liberals and I'll keep whinging about people whinging about liberals.

 

[two sheds]

I'm not on about students. I'm on about non-graduates.

Yes, so was I - when I said they didn't get a grant I meant they hadn't been students. There wasn't the unemployment generally.

 

[wheelie_bin]

It wasn't a case of turning their noses up at grants, some older people weren't university students because they couldn't afford to be. My mum for instance. It also wasn't the standard thing to get a degree for so many roles once upon a time.

 

[The39thStep]

The only time you met students then was when they were doing summer jobs

 

[two sheds]

It wasn't a case of turning their noses up at grants, some older people weren't university students because they couldn't afford to be. My mum for instance. It also wasn't the standard thing to get a degree for so many roles once upon a time.

Indeed. Of course there were inequalities, and some bloody atrocious housing and working conditions.

The difference I see is that older people (60 and above say like myself) were beneficiaries of the Post War Social Contract.

Up to the 80s we had fairer social security and unemployment benefits, free NHS and education, council housing plus full employment (below 5% which is generally seen as people just in between jobs) from public ownership of coal, gas, electricity, railways etc.

Bloody heaven compared to cut-throat competition and pressure on rents and income that we've got now. It's been people my age who have taken advantage of all the benefits but have stopped them for the next generations.

Is why I want to see Corbyn back in, he's the only one who I think will try to reverse some of the insane policies since the 80s.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

Yes true. People I know who didn't get a grant were generally able to get a job, though. Houses were 10 or 12 grand so not just the wealthy could buy. We weren't faced with the unemployment of now, and there wasn't the harassment of people on benefits that there is now.

Wanky language but
Revealed: the 30-year economic betrayal dragging down Generation Y’s income with graphs.

"Pensioners" my granny had a shit pension which my mum had to eventually subsidise cause once she went days without eating - true to form she insisted I didn't tell my mum I was about 8 at the time, I ignored her of course. She didn't own a house. Saying those that have taken away what they were given= old people is just wrong headed- many of the workers rights, welfare state etc were fought for not given. Wealth was not evenly distributed at any time. The general ageism I've been hearing last few days not a good road to go down because elderly people are one of the most vulnerable groups in society especially when they start needing help to get dressed, eat, use the toilet....

 

[two sheds]

Fair points all. There are a lot of exceptions and there was a lot of poverty then. Overall, though, there was not the insane pressure to consume and to compete, nor the feeling that there's no safety net.

And yes @ vulnerability now. I think it's important to know why younger people feel the way they do though. When my mate introduced the idea to me my reaction was that no I don't agree with that, but on reflection they have a fucking point.

It's Thatcherism and what's followed that made the difference, but it's been the (powerful, affluent) politicians who are generally now 60 or more who took advantage when they were young but have now pulled up the drawbridge. They've made sure they've given some protection to pensions though, so older people keep voting them in.

Hopefully this will teach young people how important voting can be, and how easy it for the media to distort the arguments.

 

[chilango]

I think what we might be seeing (and this isn't new, Generation X anyone?) is the contraction of the middle class after its post-war expansion. So, young(er) people whose grand parents or great parents were proletarian but who's parents and grand parents were beneficiaries of the post-war settlement talked about above are seeing those (temporary) class advantages begin to recede over the horizon.

 

[butchersapron]

I think what we might be seeing (and this isn't new, Generation X anyone?) is the contraction of the middle class after its post-war expansion. So, young(er) people whose grand parents or great parents were proletarian but who's parents and grand parents were beneficiaries of the post-war settlement talked about above are seeing those (temporary) class advantages begin to recede over the horizon.

I was looking for an old post of mine on greece earlier and found this one.

 

[two sheds]

And the other way of looking at it is that if only 30% of young people could be bothered to vote, then as it was put to me "fuck em".

Difficult argument for someone who spoiled his ballot paper though.

Eta: bloody good post @ butchers. It may have been forced on politicians, but it still took a decision by one person and then agreement of the others for it to happen. And yes those 30 years are different economically or socially from anything before or after.

 

[chilango]

I was looking for an old post of mine on greece earlier and found this one.

Good post. Well worth reading in this context.

 

[Combustible]

The latest plan. Petition the European Commission to force a second referendum! Thank god the EU isn't as horribly undemocratic as those nasty little Brexiters say it is.https://www.change.org/p/eu-petitio...&utm_term=des-md-no_src-no_msg&fb_ref=Default

In contrast to the undemocratic image of the EU portrayed by referendum campaigners, it is a little known fact that every single citizen of the European Union can directly petition the European Parliament and be heard. There is no minimum signatory requirement and every petition will be responded to.

The following petition is therefore being sent directly to the EU Chairman of the Petitions Committee, and is also being filed through the European Parliament petitions portal, where you can express additional support.

 

[butchersapron]

Oh great Tsar, save us from your nasty ministers!

Squalid. Have they no self-respect?

 

[Flavour]

Summer of riots anyone?

 

[butchersapron]

Old people riots with the anti-racist young forming youth battalions to help the police.

 

[chilango]

Old people riots with the anti-racist young forming youth battalions to help the police.

 

[butchersapron]

Exactly the image i had in my head! Broom army!

 

[Flavour]

Old people riots with the anti-racist young forming youth battalions to help the police.

Well, not in Hartlepool. No anti-racist youth there. All fash you see.

 

[treelover]

Mass hand wringing tonight at Trafalgar Square, I reckon its going to huge.

 

[treelover]

A lot of those Brooms look suspiciously unused/new.