#occupy London....

[ska invita]

I think so Ymu. What little cheering he is doing is for the fact there is visible protest and anti-capitalism, but in fact he sneers at occupy

So we should see in this development also a challenge: it is not enough to reject the depoliticized expert rule as the most ruthless form of ideology; one should also begin to think seriously....

Occupy aren't being "serious", he's set them up as frivolous (anarchist) dreamers, there to "party"

...about what to propose instead of the predominant economic organization, to imagine and experiment with alternate forms of organization, to search for the germs of the New. Communism is not just or predominantly the carnival of the mass protest when the system is brought to a halt; Communism is also, above all, a new form of organization, discipline, hard work.

there's what he wants, Communism to spearhead the movement. Who will be doing the "discipline" and the "hard work" he quotes? A vanguard for sure.

The protesters should beware not only of enemies, but also of false friends who pretend to support them, but are already working hard to dilute the protest.

dilute the process from serious communist organisation. Not interested in the 99% populism approach who "dilute", a smaller clique is needed

We do not vote about who owns what, about relations in a factory, etc – all this is left to processes outside the sphere of the political. It is illusory to expect that one can effectively change things by "extending" democracy into this sphere, say, by organizing "democratic" banks under people's control.

This reads like a swipe at autonomism in workplaces, another enemy tendency of centrist Communism.

democratic mechanisms – which, one should never forget, are part of the state apparatuses of the "bourgeois" state that guarantees undisturbed functioning of the capitalist reproduction.

"Democratic mechanisms" like the general assemblies of Occupy.

You may or may not agree with what he is saying, but the point is what he is saying sounds like: Occupy = naive anarchist populism, should instead be being "serious" and calling for non-democratic dictatorship of the proles, or something like that.

 

[ymu]

I don't read the article like that at all. I don't think he's suggesting that there are any ready-made solutions out there, he's saying that the movement shouldn't rush to adopt pre-existing templates under pressure of the empty criticisms of the media and the liberal left, and is broadly right in the way it has conducted itself so far.

 

[AKA pseudonym]

tbh: hacks opinions more than bore me....

Whats happening now?

 

[ska invita]

I don't read the article like that at all. I don't think he's suggesting that there are any ready-made solutions out there, he's saying that the movement shouldn't rush to adopt pre-existing templates under pressure of the empty criticisms of the media and the liberal left, and is broadly right in the way it has conducted itself so far.

have to agree to disagree. I could well be wrong, usually am, but mark my words the hardened marxists hate all the horizontalism going on, . And as a rule all the frustrated marxists who end up as academics tend to be great at trying to slip their message in without being clear cut about it - its what they do for a living, often flying somewhat under the radar to keep their jobs safe. I cant stand crypto-chat - the fact that we have both taken different meanings from this shows he is being (i think deliberately) unclear.

tbh: hacks opinions more than bore me....
Whats happening now?

yeah, but not a hack though, a highly influential celebrity 'intellectual', whose name alone carries weight - hence my bothering to refute it.

as to whats happening now, there's meant to be lots of activity through May around the world...12th and 15th key dates - see 2nd wave thread. How much will happen in London is far from certain.... Spain looks promising I hear.

 

[Blagsta]

The lack of politics is/was a problem with occupy, as it let in fascists and fascist ideas.

 

[butchersapron]

Wow, that is one hell of an extended misreading ska, you are way off track here.

 

[AKA pseudonym]

*Morning - Occupy the tube!
*11.30am - Assemble at Paternoster Square for May Day march
*2.30pm onwards - Against Workfare
More details here: http://on.fb.me/Ign6x1

 

[Brixton Hatter]

Finsbury Square was evicted last night about 2 or 3am. Lots of riot police and bailiff heavies.

There's some photos here: http://blog.julesmattsson.co.uk/2012/06/14/photos-occupy-finsbury-square-eviction/

 

[nino_savatte]

 

[claphamboy]

Sadly, it was bound to happen at some point, they have done well to last so long IMO.

 

[gunneradt]

about time - the place was looking quite disgusting

 

[ddraig]

about time - the place was looking quite disgusting

in what way?
you do know they had hygene ratings better than most long established bricks and mortar businesses don't you

 

[Orang Utan]

It was a very tidy site.
Did you ever go there, gunneradt?

 

[ddraig]

the twat will only come back with some crap like "riff raff"

 

[gunneradt]

Walked past it every day. I'm afraid all the mud wasn't very tidy. It was always going to happen as the Olympics approached.

 

[ddraig]

so a bit of mud??

 

[Citizen66]

about time - the place was looking quite disgusting

For someone who doesn't like activists, you spend an incredible amount of time posting on a bulletin board some frequent.

 

[gunneradt]

I never said I didn't like anyone. I was just making an observation about the state of Finsbury Square - which can hopefully now be repaired.

 

[Citizen66]

Ok, change 'activists' to 'activism'.

 

[gunneradt]

My point was the place had become an eyesore - it was bound to go. I enjoyed looking at the books.

 

[nino_savatte]

My point was the place had become an eyesore - it was bound to go. I enjoyed looking at the books.

Tbh, you're a bit of an eyesore.

 

[Pickman's model]

I never said I didn't like anyone. I was just making an observation about the state of Finsbury Square - which can hopefully now be repaired.

yeh but it's needed something doing to it for bloody years. strange how just as the olympics approach they find the money

 

[Pickman's model]

Finsbury Square was evicted last night about 2 or 3am. Lots of riot police and bailiff heavies.

There's some photos here: http://blog.julesmattsson.co.uk/2012/06/14/photos-occupy-finsbury-square-eviction/

you'd have thought the police could get some yellow bits that fit them, wouldn't you.

 

[8ball]

you'd have thought the police could get some yellow bits that fit them, wouldn't you.

I think maybe they did at the start, but there's a Dunkin' Donuts right by there.

 

[AKA pseudonym]

I never said I didn't like anyone. I was just making an observation about the state of Finsbury Square - which can hopefully now be repaired.

repaired how?

 

[gunneradt]

repaired how?

well they were starting on quite a clean up yesterday

hopefully laying some new grass and making it look a bit more like a square that everyone can enjoy again

 

[butchersapron]

This is, of course, a long stand burning desire to allow public access to areas we own.

 

[Citizen66]

hopefully laying some new grass and making it look a bit more like a square that everyone can enjoy again

everyone?

it's not a park, it's just a square that is slap bang in the heart of the financial district. Somewhere for the office bods to sit and have their sandwiches. I doubt anyone else makes a special journey to visit it. Perhaps errant tourists who have wandered the wrong direction from St Pauls might get to 'enjoy' it.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

I was wondering when that went - I passed the site this afternoon. (Normally I don't come up that way.)

Tell you what, it looks a damned site worse now. "Beautification of the area" doesn't seem to have been the motive, amazingly enough.

 

[Treacle Toes]

All 16 defendents found not guilty today for #Xstrata case.