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My electricity bill has just tripled: how about yours? Alternative suppliers?

It's OK the CEO of Scottish Power has put forward a scheme whereby the energy supply companies would be given access to £100 billion in commercial loans backed
by the government backed. They would use these to buy energy at full market prices while not passing on the increased costs to consumers.

So the banks and the energy producers would be quids in, billions of quids in. The energy suppliers would remain solvent and in private hands.

And...oh we would be paying back the debt over the next 20 or 30 years either in our bills or through taxation. So which is it to be, a mortgage or a student loan to keep your lights on, your home warm, your fridge cold and your food cooked? They must think we are really really stupid.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice
 
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alex_ said:
No - because gas shortage is real
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You could argue that the price for the last 10 years did not recognise that.
But Kindleberger's point is that pricing is a phenomenon of crowd psychology.
You doubtless are not old enough to remember the oil price shock of 1973 and the subsequent 10 year inflation.
But you might remember Enron Enron - Wikipedia and possibly even WorldCom WorldCom scandal - Wikipedia

Surely a visitor from Mars might be forgiven for asking how the British energy market these last few years differs from those two scandals.
30 "energy providers" "left the market" i.e. went bust in 3 years. And that is normal? And that is BEFORE Ukraine.

What has happened is the British consumer has been taken to a Switchback Ride - and now the chickens have come home to roost it's all the fault of Russia and Ukraine. How convenient!
 
Louis MacNeice said:
It's OK the CEO of Scottish Power has put forward a scheme whereby the energy supply companies would be given access to £100 billion in commercial loans backed
by the government backed. They would use these to buy energy at full market prices while not passing on the increased costs to consumers.

So the banks and the energy producers would be quids in, billions of quids in. The energy suppliers would remain solvent and in private hands.

And...oh we would be paying back the debt over the next 20 or 30 years either in our bills or through taxation. So which is it to be, a mortgage or a student loan to keep your lights on, your home warm, your fridge cold and your food cooked? They must think we are really really stupid.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice
Click to expand...
This is probably the most viable idea so far, it certainly beats tax cuts or having the GP writing a prescription for energy which is what Loopie Lizzie and her mates are offering. Even if the energy companies were nationalised though they would still have to pay full market prices for the gas or it wouldn't get sold to them so it would still end up being paid by the taxpayer (or going on the national debt) at some point.
 
MickiQ said:
This is probably the most viable idea so far, it certainly beats tax cuts or having the GP writing a prescription for energy which is what Loopie Lizzie and her mates are offering. Even if the energy companies were nationalised though they would still have to pay full market prices for the gas or it wouldn't get sold to them so it would still end up being paid by the taxpayer (or going on the national debt) at some point.
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It is just the energy supply companies kicking the can down the road in a way that protects them, loads debt onto consumers and guarantees levels of demand that the energy producers are unable/unwilling to meet. Handily for finance capital it also puts £100 billion of business the banks' way.

Much better to bring the suppliers into social ownership as a necessary public utility, charged not just with the provision and maintenance of supply but also with the promotion and development of energy efficiency.

The government doesn't need to borrow at commercial banking rates, indeed it could use other methods to raise finance e.g. issuing bonds or god forbid printing money! Also as a single unified purchaser it would be in a stronger market position to make deals with producers. And rather than seeking to recover costs from many impoverished consumers, the government could tax the profits and wealth of those who far from suffering at the present time are actually filling their boots.

It's all about political will and choices. We made economics, economics needn't control us; rather if the current system doesn't meet our needs then we can/should/must remake the system.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

p.s. Post War the notion of making/limiting/remaking the market to better meet society's needs was a common place of politics...it just sounds weird in these increasingly weird times.
 
Louis MacNeice said:
It is just the energy supply companies kicking the can down the road in a way that protects them, loads debt onto consumers and guarantees levels of demand that the energy producers are unable/unwilling to meet. Handily for finance capital it also puts £100 billion of business the banks' way.

Much better to bring the suppliers into social ownership as a necessary public utility, charged not just with the provision and maintenance of supply but also with the promotion and development of energy efficiency.

The government doesn't need to borrow at commercial banking rates, indeed it could use other methods to raise finance e.g. issuing bonds or god forbid printing money! Also as a single unified purchaser it would be in a stronger market position to make deals with producers. And rather than seeking to recover costs from many impoverished consumers, the government could tax the profits and wealth of those who far from suffering at the present time are actually filling their boots.

It's all about political will and choices. We made economics, economics needn't control us; rather if the current system doesn't meet our needs then we can/should/must remake the system.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

p.s. Post War the notion of making/limiting/remaking the market to better meet society's needs was a common place of politics...it just sounds weird in these increasingly weird times.
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Agree totally as do indeed about 80% of the population however nationalism has been ruled out not only by the Govt but bizarrely by the Labour Party has well who you would think would seize the chance to have a popular policy that is radically different from the Tories.
It's a bit like England (men naturally, the ladies have a chance) winning the next World Cup. It's possible and lots of people want it but it isn't going to happen
 
MickiQ said:
Agree totally as do indeed about 80% of the population however nationalism has been ruled out not only by the Govt but bizarrely by the Labour Party has well who you would think would seize the chance to have a popular policy that is radically different from the Tories.
It's a bit like England (men naturally, the ladies have a chance) winning the next World Cup. It's possible and lots of people want it but it isn't going to happen
Click to expand...

I think you mean nationalisation not nationalism has been ruled out. And you are right we can't look to the Labour Party; we have to look to ourselves together.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice
 
Louis MacNeice said:
It's OK the CEO of Scottish Power has put forward a scheme whereby the energy supply companies would be given access to £100 billion in commercial loans backed
by the government backed. They would use these to buy energy at full market prices while not passing on the increased costs to consumers.

So the banks and the energy producers would be quids in, billions of quids in. The energy suppliers would remain solvent and in private hands.

And...oh we would be paying back the debt over the next 20 or 30 years either in our bills or through taxation. So which is it to be, a mortgage or a student loan to keep your lights on, your home warm, your fridge cold and your food cooked? They must think we are really really stupid.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice
Click to expand...

Essentially, its "Bail out the Banks 2.0"
 
I haven't received the expected call back from the ombudsman, which is odd as my case handler has been brilliant so far, I wonder if she's on holiday or off sick.

I was thinking of ringing the main number, but thought I would check my OVO account first, my balance was under £70 this morning, now it's...

1w.png

...so something is going on, that's a bit less than I was expecting, but until I receive all the corrected bills from both the company's systems. SSE & OVO, I can't be sure.

But, bearing in mind my correct monthly DD should be £125pm now, but I've only paid £1 for each of the last two months, you can see why I needed this sorted, because otherwise that current balance would £880.98.
 
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cupid_stunt said:
I haven't received the expected call back from the ombudsman, which is odd as my case handler has been brilliant so far, I wonder if she's on holiday or off sick.

I was thinking of ringing the main number, but thought I would check my OVO account first, my balance was under £70 this morning, now it's...

View attachment 339572

...so something is going on, that's a bit less than I was expecting, but until I receive all the corrected bills from both the company's systems. SSE & OVO, I can't be sure.

But, bearing in mind my correct monthly DD should be £125pm now, but I've only paid £1 for each of the last two months, you can see why I needed this sorted, because otherwise that current balance would £880.98.
Click to expand...
If you can I would draw that out pronto before the fuckers lose it again.
 
The cap has been raised to be more than £3500 for the average household. Raised from £1800 in April.

I just don't know how people are going to be able to cope.

www.theguardian.com

Labour calls for emergency budget as energy cap set to top £3,500

Ofgem announcement will ‘strike fear’ into hearts, says Rachel Reeves, amid accusations of profiteering at oil and gas firms
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

Just looking at it from a business sense. It is just going to force more people into debt or for them to refuse to pay. It is going to tank the rest of the economy while one sector gets all the profits. It's crazy.

Looking at it from a moral viewpoint it's disgusting.
 
Storm Fox said:
The cap has been raised to be more than £3500 for the average household. Raised from £1800 in April.

I just don't know how people are going to be able to cope.

www.theguardian.com

Labour calls for emergency budget as energy cap set to top £3,500

Ofgem announcement will ‘strike fear’ into hearts, says Rachel Reeves, amid accusations of profiteering at oil and gas firms
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

Just looking at it from a business sense. It is just going to force more people into debt or for them to refuse to pay. It is going to tank the rest of the economy while one sector gets all the profits. It's crazy.

Looking at it from a moral viewpoint it's disgusting.
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I'm surprised there isn't more of a fuss coming for "business" there bills are going up even more and any business relying on people with disposable income must surely be worried about losing income while there bills are going up.

I guess most business cunts are too stupid and self absorbed to care about the damage being done to the economy as a whole.
 
Elpenor said:
Means testing is notoriously expensive and it’s almost always cheaper to just make it a universal payout

It isn’t ideal in that for the rich it’s money they don’t need or deserve but to slice the data by household would mean referring to huge blocks of data
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Usually means testing is a prelude to trying to end the program. Then they can claim that its only "benefit scroungers looking for a handout" that get it.
 
It's times like this that demonstrate that the real powers that be are giant corporations such as Centrica and Exxon Mobil .In solidarity with Ukraine governments eschew Russian oil and gas putting themselves at the mercy of the energy suppliers who respond promptly by jacking their prices up to exorbitant levels.What can be done about this?bugger all it seems because corporations don't have moral agency and they are above the law.
 
Duncan2 said:
It's times like this that demonstrate that the real powers that be are giant corporations such as Centrica and Exxon Mobil .In solidarity with Ukraine governments eschew Russian oil and gas putting themselves at the mercy of the energy suppliers who respond promptly by jacking their prices up to exorbitant levels.What can be done about this?bugger all it seems because corporations don't have moral agency and they are above the law.
Click to expand...
It's almost as though these corporations don't know we've got our blue passports back.
 
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OFGEM has now officially announced the new price cap, up from £1,971 in April, to £3549 from Oct., that's an increase of just over 80%, on top of the 57% back in April. :mad:

That's my monthly DD up from £125 to £225.
 
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We should be glad to pay the extra. Won't somebody think of the energy companies shareholders? :( ((((shareholders))))
 
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