Mentally ill people to get 'job coach' visits...

[mentalchik]

Mental health patients to get job coach visits, says minister

Pensions Secretary Liz Kendall says trials of the idea have produced "dramatic results".

www.bbc.co.uk

Is it just me but i find this idea quite grotesque...there appears to be a determined push to stigmatise the sick, disabled, fat people and now the mentally ill....this is something i would expect from the Tories but shameful that it's coming from Labour

 

[SpookyFrank]

Clearly unethical. If I'm working on that ward I'm not letting those fucking ghouls past reception.

 

[LakieLady]

Fucking hell, the very first sentence in that article has sent my rage levels through the roof:

"Job coaches will visit seriously ill patients on mental health wards to try to get them back to work, the government has said."

Have they any fucking idea how very unwell people have to be to be admitted to a psych unit? The first time I had to visit a client who'd been admitted, they were so unwell that they could do little more than rock backwards and forwards and giggle, they couldn't even give permission to the DWP to talk to me about their benefits. My brother is bipolar, and gets sectioned every few years. He's totally away with the fairies when he's that unwell.

If people with longstanding mental health conditions were well enough to consider working, they wouldn't be on mental health wards, for fuck's sake. This idea is so bonkers, if Liz Kendall is really serious about this she's probably unwell enough to get admitted herself.

 

[Boris Sprinkler]

Yeah good luck with that. The times I’ve spent on psych wards, we were not discussing jobs we could be doing when / if we got out. I did meet a man who said he was an admiral, but I guess he’ll just go straight back to his boat.

 

[Epona]

Aye, people have to be seriously unwell to be admitted, it's difficult to get help for those who are in a bad way, do they really think people who have been admitted for reasons of mental health are just feeling a bit down and engaging with the job market would cheer them up or something?

 

[lazythursday]

A friend of mine is currently having a manic psychotic break, sleeping in his car, turning up at friends houses randomly around the country, being arrested. There are zero services prepared to do anything to help him it seems. But he can learn to write a CV? Cool I'll let his traumatised and worn out partner know.

 

[Boris Sprinkler]

Another great idea, from the nobheads that brought you the National record of Achievement

 

[Elpenor]

Another great idea, from the nobheads that brought you the National record of Achievement

At least that had a shiny red case

 

[LakieLady]

Aye, people have to be seriously unwell to be admitted, it's difficult to get help for those who are in a bad way, do they really think people who have been admitted for reasons of mental health are just feeling a bit down and engaging with the job market would cheer them up or something?

I'd love Kendall to come to work with me or one of my colleagues for a day. She'd at least have some idea of how significant mental illness affects people, and I'd enjoy asking her what job she thinks some of my clients could do. And none of our clients are in-patients.

 

[Epona]

I'd love Kendall to come to work with me or one of my colleagues for a day. She'd at least have some idea of how significant mental illness affects people, and I'd enjoy asking her what job she thinks some of my clients could do. And none of our clients are in-patients.

Yeah, N used to be a psychiatric nurse, I think shadowing him or another for a week doing that is something Kendall might find interesting and educational.

 

[Serge Forward]

My local MP is at it again! She used to be referred to as "lazy Liz" by Labour activists round here, so it's ironic that she's now telling ill people to get back to fucking work.

 

[mentalchik]

I'd love Kendall to come to work with me or one of my colleagues for a day. She'd at least have some idea of how significant mental illness affects people, and I'd enjoy asking her what job she thinks some of my clients could do. And none of our clients are in-patients.

Well yes, being blunt can you imagine going to an interview and when asked why you haven't been working and telling them you've been in a mental hospital for a while.....not a chance in hell. People with serious mental health issues should not be being hounded to go to wok ffs

 

[Derek S-H]

All governments are obsessed with work and the economy.

I know this appears reductionist and simplistic, but the direction of travel since 1979 has been all about "aspiration" and "wealth creation" and if you're not on that bandwagon then there's something wrong with you.

It doesn't matter if you're working all hours, running yourself into the ground, ruining your relationships and making yourself ill, you're earning and spending and therefore a valuable member of society. If you're not, then you're a "burden."

And the penny still hasn't dropped:

"Kendall said she believed British society had become “sicker” and the UK was “the only G7 country whose employment rate has not gone back to pre-pandemic levels”."

Well, Lizzie, I'd suggest that many people took the time to re-evaluate their lives, their priorities, and probably came to the conclusion that the work treadmill was no longer for them. This is a good and healthy decision to take for your well-being, especially if you can afford to do it.

 

[Oriole]

Well yes, being blunt can you imagine going to an interview and when asked why you haven't been working and telling them you've been in a mental hospital for a while.....not a chance in hell. People with serious mental health issues should not be being hounded to go to wok ffs

Yep, those plans are always in denial about employers not being down with hiring people who aren't in tip top health and if people were hired before being sick, starting the ball rolling super fast on disciplinaries when people's illness starts affecting attendance.

 

[SpookyFrank]

Fucking hell, the very first sentence in that article has sent my rage levels through the roof:

"Job coaches will visit seriously ill patients on mental health wards to try to get them back to work, the government has said."

Have they any fucking idea how very unwell people have to be to be admitted to a psych unit? The first time I had to visit a client who'd been admitted, they were so unwell that they could do little more than rock backwards and forwards and giggle, they couldn't even give permission to the DWP to talk to me about their benefits. My brother is bipolar, and gets sectioned every few years. He's totally away with the fairies when he's that unwell.

If people with longstanding mental health conditions were well enough to consider working, they wouldn't be on mental health wards, for fuck's sake. This idea is so bonkers, if Liz Kendall is really serious about this she's probably unwell enough to get admitted herself.

And as always they're waving the stick of stopping people's benefits. Threatening people who are already in psychological distress with homelessness and penury is a level of cruelty I can't even begin to process.

I doubt this will ever happen tbh. But Kendall should be sacked for even suggesting it.

 

[friendofdorothy]

What evidence do they have for saying over and over that work helps? Sounds suspiciously like 'work makes you free.'

As for writing CVs. Some time ago, nearly 20 years ago, when signed off with depression and anxiety (grief related) aka 'a bit bluesy' I was desperate to return to work but couldn't talk to anyone without weeping and couldn't stop crying everyday , I voluntarily went to see the careers advisor at the job centre. He looked about twelve . He soon got stuck with my very practical questions ( in-between sobs) about how to list overlapping paid and voluntary roles. Nor how to explain why I left my last job because of bullying, partner at deaths door, followed by the death of my father and then two close friends (lots of weeping). He advised me to list my hobbies (did grown ups even still do that then?) he suggested I put 'listening to music ' and was incredulous when I said I didn't. It was a one off session and I didn't come out of it with a CV.

Wonder what AI would have advised.

Can you imagine a CV chat between a seriously mentally ill patient and AI? Really? Why would govt minister imagine that would help?

 

[Boris Sprinkler]

Also bare in mind the ones in hospitals are the “ lucky ones” - there’s probably a few more in their houses or on the streets who deserve the gulags.

What are our glue exports like, statistically compared to other nations?
Bear in mind, these fuck knuckles keep sending weapons to Israel because “contracts have been signed”.
They literally cannot think of anything but the dollar.

 

[The39thStep]

Has anyone seen any summaries of the evaluations of the pilot schemes in Leicester or South London?

 

[Chilli.s]

I think this kind of pressure on already sick people will only worsen their situation. its borderline abusive and not therapeutic at all. Investing the budget that's been allocated for it into already stretched MH services would be better use of the money.

Smells like a way to cut service to some and refuse benefit to others

 

[emanymton]

What evidence do they have for saying over and over that work helps? Sounds suspiciously like 'work makes you free.'

As for writing CVs. Some time ago, nearly 20 years ago, when signed off with depression and anxiety (grief related) aka 'a bit bluesy' I was desperate to return to work but couldn't talk to anyone without weeping and couldn't stop crying everyday , I voluntarily went to see the careers advisor at the job centre. He looked about twelve . He soon got stuck with my very practical questions ( in-between sobs) about how to list overlapping paid and voluntary roles. Nor how to explain why I left my last job because of bullying, partner at deaths door, followed by the death of my father and then two close friends (lots of weeping). He advised me to list my hobbies (did grown ups even still do that then?) he suggested I put 'listening to music ' and was incredulous when I said I didn't. It was a one off session and I didn't come out of it with a CV.

Wonder what AI would have advised.

Can you imagine a CV chat between a seriously mentally ill patient and AI? Really? Why would govt minister imagine that would help?

Work can definitely help, while having a job is crap not having one is oftern worse. I've had periods of depression where I turned down the offer of a sick note because sitting around at home on my own all day sounded so much worse than going to work.

I do have an issue with the mentality sometimes that people with physical or mental disabilities can't work, when in many cases they can it's just a question of finding the right job for them, so in theory I'm not against the idea of help for people to find work for their own sake. But I mean help, the government just use help when they mean coerce, and they do nothing to address the contradiction at the heart of their own policy. They want to push people into work but many employers will not be willing to make the adjustments necessary and they of course do nothing to help balance that side of the equation.

As for this particular policy it just seems daft either way, whether you actually want to help people or just try to force them into work people currently in hospital seem the worst people to target. It seems more like the sort of soundbite policy idea aimed at getting favourable headlines in the Mail than anything of real substance.

 

[brogdale]

That phrase "economically inactive"; how fucking annoying is that?

 

[mentalchik]

That phrase "economically inactive"; how fucking annoying is that?

It's my most hated phrase at the moment....it includes people in the fortunate position of being able to retire early, as if somehow they should just carry on working for the good of the country

 

[wemakeyousoundb]

pretty sure these interviews would come under occupational therapy rather than an actual work search, then again when people get better some will definitely look forward to having activities when discharged but you can't force this on people.

 

[brogdale]

It's my most hated phrase at the moment....it includes people in the fortunate position of being able to retire early, as if somehow they should just carry on working for the good of the country

quite.
also implies that those not in paid wage slavery contribute nothing and consume nothing
I'd like to see their state deal with care needs if all the carers in the country just went and got a job, instead.

 

[StoneRoad]

That phrase "economically inactive"; how fucking annoying is that?

Very annoying.
the only economically inactive are "6ft under"

Benefits are money that gets spent on essentials, so it's STILL spending in the economy.
There would be more if most landlords and mortgage lenders weren't such grasping kunts.

Also, it is useless to penalise someone for not having job{s} - quite often there isn't anything suitable - or safe.
Mind you, some youngsters need to know that you actually have to do the actual work required, and not moon at your phone all day, when you are at work.

 

[izz]

I agree with emanymton in that I think work can be useful to some people, or rather, the correct work, with the correct amount of support, if nothing else it can provide some sort of socialisation, but I trust no government of this country to be able to deliver that as sensitively and delicately nuanced as it should be. Nor indeed do I trust most businesses in this country to be able to offer the right amount of support.

But then, Labour are proving again that they are merely slightly less right-wing than Conservatives.

 

[nogojones]

Mental health patients to get job coach visits, says minister

Pensions Secretary Liz Kendall says trials of the idea have produced "dramatic results".

www.bbc.co.uk

Is it just me but i find this idea quite grotesque...there appears to be a determined push to stigmatise the sick, disabled, fat people and now the mentally ill....this is something i would expect from the Tories but shameful that it's coming from Labour

Really? Of course it's Labour doing this. It was Labour that introduced the Work Capability Assessment in the first place.

 

[Boo Radley75]

Got a cousin who is seriously, mentally unwell. He has schizophrenia, autism and adhd. It took him wandering around outside a petrol station, stinking because he hadn't showered or washed his clothes for god knows how long, no idea where he was, who he was or who anyone else was before he finally got admitted to hospital. Could just see the benefits of Liz Kendall gate crashing his ward the next day to jabber on excitedly about the benefits of working at McDonalds, for him. In fact, I'd have paid good money to see the expression on a McDonalds manager's face if she could have seen her way to take him there for an interview.

 

[nogojones]

I'd love Kendall to come to work with me or one of my colleagues for a day. She'd at least have some idea of how significant mental illness affects people, and I'd enjoy asking her what job she thinks some of my clients could do. And none of our clients are in-patients.

She would come, nod a bit and totally ignore anything you or you service users said.

I had to deal with the cunt Tony McNulty when he was Minister for Employment and Welfare Reform who visited a service I was involved with to get a press opportunity to sell the wonderful concept of Work Capability Assessments. All the service users who were extremely vulnerable and the staff told him that it was a terrible idea that would make everyone's situation substantially worse and would put lives at risk. He didn't even pretend to listen and just got his photo op and trotted out his pre-prepared statement about people on incapacity benefit getting something for nothing.

This was the same Tony McNulty who eight months later was caught claiming expenses on a second home, occupied by his parents, which was 8 miles away from his primary residence and had to resign.

I just checked again and I'm sorry to read that the cunt is still alive.

 

[LakieLady]

I agree with emanymton in that I think work can be useful to some people, or rather, the correct work, with the correct amount of support, if nothing else it can provide some sort of socialisation, but I trust no government of this country to be able to deliver that as sensitively and delicately nuanced as it should be. Nor indeed do I trust most businesses in this country to be able to offer the right amount of support.

But then, Labour are proving again that they are merely slightly less right-wing than Conservatives.

It can be both therapeutic and beneficial for some people, which is why there is already a programme of employment services that support people with mental health problems, established initially under the Integrated Approach to Psychological Therapy initiative. It's funded by NHS money, not DWP money, and participation in it is entirely voluntary.

And it really works for some people, and I suspect that is partly because it is voluntary. Most of my clients are referred by one of these projects, and for some who want to work it turns out not to be the right thing for them at all. Their mental health is just too fragile.