Many dead in coordinated Paris shootings and explosions

[Pickman's model]

You do now.

missed this before i made the same comment

 

[Pickman's model]

My heart goes out to the people of Paris, I'm wondering if the Israeli Palestine crisis were to be resolved it would go a long way towards diffusing tensions and reducing the validity of IS?
Is it even possible?

no it isn't, it would be too late

 

[mauvais]

I agree with a lot of what you say, here. But I suspect that the ban on the veil was very much a specific reaction to radical Islam, albeit the conditions precedent which allowed such a measure to gain traction in a way that it might not in, say, the UK, are complex and long-standing.

Aye possibly, I think there's a bunch of factors behind it but I'm not qualified to apportion them. If radicalised Islam were not such a threat then it possibly wouldn't have come about, but no guarantees. Numbers alone might have done it. Remember that this is a country where until comparatively recently you had to choose your child's name from a list. That's just one example of cultural protectionism and you don't have to be a Muslim or even religious to be affected by it.

 

[1%er]

you do now.

So because I posted it I believe it, that's an interesting view on a board like this. Do you believe all the stuff in the links you post?

 

[moon]

no it isn't, it would be too late

I don't believe that..

 

[Pickman's model]

So because I posted it I believe it, that's an interesting view on a board like this. Do you believe all the stuff in the links you post?

no, i said you now have a history of posting racist stuff. i didn"t say you believed it.

 

[Pickman's model]

I don't believe that..

be that as it may it is still too late.

 

[chilango]

Enough. Back to the posts with points.

moon i agree with pickman's here. Its far too late. As I said upthread somewhere, jihadism has evolved a lot. Its not about Israel or the US anymore.

 

[Athos]

So because I posted it I believe it, that's an interesting view on a board like this. Do you believe all the stuff in the links you post?

 

[teqniq]

My heart goes out to the people of Paris, I'm wondering if the Israeli Palestine crisis were to be resolved it would go a long way towards diffusing tensions and reducing the validity of IS?
Is it even possible?

In light of this, interesting piece in Haaretz

Before the Israeli right rejoices over Paris - Opinion

 

[Idris2002]

no it isn't, it would be too late

I agree, but we need to say "too late for what?"

The actual members of Daesh are a lost cause. Even after their inevitable unconditional surrender they will remain unrepentant.

Their military strategy and political also doesn't need much "water for the fish to swim in", and they don't actually care about the Muslim communities that will get it in the neck now, in fact that suits them down to the ground. I doubt if they even care much about the Palestinians (E2A: in fact, I know for a fact they don't - if all Muslims should move to Daeshland, why should anyone worry about Palestine, or Tunisia, or anywhere else?).

 

[1%er]

no, i said you now have a history of posting racist stuff. i didn"t say you believed it.

One post is a history? The cartoon makes a clear political point as do the Charlie Hebdo cartoons, mybe that should be addressed rather than attacking the poster. Because this happened in Europe it gets 100's of posts if it had happened in Africa it would have got about 10, what does that say about this board?

 

[Dandred]

In light of this, interesting piece in Haaretz

Before the Israeli right rejoices over Paris - Opinion

Can you put it up here, needs subscription.

 

[DrRingDing]

I don't believe that..

Define 'resolved'.

 

[SpineyNorman]

Even the Nazis didn't bomb Paris. It's an awful dirty beautiful city and an achievement of humanity.

ISIS are going to destroy Paris and Rome and the lot, and that will be an achievement of humanity but you won't even care. Have you noticed that, like the Chinese, they don't have anything to replace it with? They want the big throne, but they don't have any plans beyond the big throne.

Except the French (and more specifically French who'd have plenty in common with you politically) pretty much destroyed Paris with a little bit of help from what went on to become Germany at the back end of the 19th century.

You historically illiterate ignoramus.

 

[teqniq]

Can you put it up here, needs subscription.

oh, sorry i dunno why I can see it then

Spoiler: Haaretz article

Just before the right in Israel begins to celebrate, we must tell them: There is no connection whatsoever between the child with a knife from Hebron and the French Muslim with a suicide bomb in Paris.
Just before the right in France and all of Europe starts to celebrate, we must tell them: Don’t you dance on the blood as well. The nationalism, hatred of foreigners, racism, deportation of refugees, isolationism and the war against Islam — your magic solutions will not solve anything. The rejoicing calls of “we told you so” from Israel and the European right are already being sounded loudly.
Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Marine Le Pen are once again those who are profiting the most from the terror. We must not fall into their trap.
The Israeli right will say: We told you so. That is how the Palestinians are, that is how the Arabs are, and that is how the Muslims are - bloodthirsty animals. The conclusion: There is no partner. We will forever live by our swords. Now Europe is experiencing what we have been experiencing for years. Now Europe will take steps toward a war on terror — the same steps which it condemned when we took them. Now Europe may leave us alone; after all we have a common enemy. Let’s see them labeling products now, let’s see it condemning the settlements.
Our daring raids on the al-Ahli Hospital in Hebron and the primary school in Silwan in Jerusalem are part of the war of civilizations which West is fighting, and which Israel is so proud to belong to. Whoever does not invade al-Ahli is not fighting terror. Whoever does not shoot a young woman holding a knife at a checkpoint gets Paris. The law for Ahmed Manasra (the 13-year-old Palestinian boy who stabbed an Israeli boy) is the same law as that for Jihadi John. Hamas is the Islamic State organization and the same goes for Hezbollah, Mahmoud Abbas, (Islamic Movement leader)Sheikh Ra’ad Salah, Joint List Members of Knesset Ayman Odeh and Ahmad Tibi —and all of them are ISIS, all the Arabs.
This is of course a propagandist house of cards, which is completely unrelated to reality. The goal of the knife wielder from Hebron is completely different from that of the jihadist from Stade de France, and so is their worldview. Here the Palestinian is battling for his land and country, for his liberation from occupation, for self-determination and freedom — and there the game is destroying Europe and taking control of it. Here the main motive is national and political, and there it is religious fundamentalism.
But the truth is that the Israeli right is not completely wrong. In the end, its prophesy will be self-fulfilling. If Israel continues with its policies, the child stabber from Hebron will turn into the adult suicide bomber of ISIS. Already today he is looking with eager eyes at the success of his big brothers. His despair leaves him little other hope.
ISIS is still not here yet, but it is possible to count on Netanyahu and his ilk to bring them here. The occupation has already given birth to Hamas and the Islamic Jihad. A desperate West Bank and an imprisoned Gaza Strip are the appropriate fertile grounds for growing them. The storm troopers of the occupation and the assassins in the hospitals provide the particle accelerators for ushering in jihadists.
The European right is wrong too. After all, the tens of thousands of the Muslim refugees knocking on the gates of Europe are trying to flee for their lives, escaping the very terror of the jihadists who are now attacking Europe. They are fleeing from the people who earlier destroyed their homelands and are now perpetrating a massacre in the Bataclan Theater. Closing the doors in their faces, inflaming the hatred of foreigners in Europe, along with the continued Islamophobia and the rise of the extreme right, will only play into the hands of ISIS.
There are now quite a few Israelis who are rejoicing in their hearts (or on the social networks) in light of the events in Paris. In addition to the perverseness of rejoicing over the death of other human beings, this is also a celebration of the blind. The correct lesson from what happened in Paris is that there are no longer any local wars. The world cannot continue to shut its eyes in the face of what is happening in Syria, and also not in the face of the Israeli occupation. When the world pulls itself together from the shock, maybe it will also free itself from the paralysis and understand that it must harness itself to find a solution to these conflicts, both in war-torn Syria as well as in the occupied Palestinian territories. Then let's see the Israeli right.
read more: Before the Israeli right rejoices over Paris - Opinion

E2a it's by Gideon Levy in case anyone was wondering

 

[2hats]

it's too late to recall the dm (etc) coverage

Not unsurprisingly poisonous organ spews venom. The Fail doesn't provide coverage of anything other than their own commentators' odious, twisted convictions.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

One post is a history? The cartoon makes a clear political point as do the Charlie Hebdo cartoons, mybe that should be addressed rather than attacking the poster. Because this happened in Europe it gets 100's of posts if it had happened in Africa it would have got about 10, what does that say about this board?

This is a tired argument. It says that most of the posters on this board live in Europe, that's all.

But the point is idiotic. There is a big long thread about Syria, there were huge threads about Tunisia and Egypt and Libya. The idea that posters here as a general rule ignore stuff happening in other parts of the world is demonstrably wrong, but yes, something happening very close to home will get big interest - as did the Breivik attack in Norway.

 

[8den]

So I posted up a cartoon without any comment, Charlie Hebdo was famous for its cartoons, or infamous depending on which side of the fence you sit on. I posted it as I thought it would be amusing to see the judgmental malcontents jump up and down, what was it people were saying about the political significance of flags above.

The hypocrisy here is just fucking unbelievable, get over yourselves

Ah so you're an asshole attempting to stir up controversy in lieu of having anything of substance to contribute.

 

[Ax^]

well this is not turning into a car crash


can we have Jesus back from earlier in the day?

 

[Pickman's model]

One post is a history? The cartoon makes a clear political point as do the Charlie Hebdo cartoons, mybe that should be addressed rather than attacking the poster. Because this happened in Europe it gets 100's of posts if it had happened in Africa it would have got about 10, what does that say about this board?

boring whataboutery. fuck off and read the fucking thread where this has been addressed. your cartoon makrs a clear political oint, but it's not the one you claim here.

 

[1%er]

Ah so you're an asshole attempting to stir up controversy in lieu of having anything of substance to contribute.

Pointing out the hypocrisy is controversial? Only if you are the hypocrite.

 

[existentialist]

I think this has only just emerged: footage of a shootout between the police and one of the gunmen at the Bataclan theatre.

Shootout between police and gunman outside Bataclan – new video emerges

 

[1%er]

boring whataboutery. fuck off and read the fucking thread where this has been addressed. your cartoon makrs a clear political oint, but it's not the one you claim here.

I have read the thread, that is how I understand what people were saying about flags and there political significance, shame they don't hold the same view about all flags.

Do you hold the same view as all the links you post up?

 

[Teenage Cthulhu]

I think this has only just emerged: footage of a shootout between the police and one of the gunmen at the Bataclan theatre.

Shootout between police and gunman outside Bataclan – new video emerges

BBC has been broadcasting that footage for the last 24 hours or so. I wonder why the Guardian are reporting it as new footage. Have to admire the police in the video for their bravery.

 

[Pickman's model]

I have read the thread, that is how I understand what people were saying about flags and there political significance, shame they don't hold the same view about all flags.

but you thought you'd derail it for the lols anyway.

 

[1%er]

but you thought you'd derail it for the lols anyway.

Again with the derail, that cartoon doesn't address some issues raised here, really? I thought you were smarter than that (disappointed smiley)

Edit. To be honest I thought you would be one of very few of the posters that would understand why I posted it

 

[bimble]

There's film too of when the shooting started at the concert, someone obviously filming the gig on their phone. One of the things that makes events like this what they are, how they're covered by thousands of people on their phones not a tidy narrative on bbc.

 

[xslavearcx]

Remember that this is a country where until comparatively recently you had to choose your child's name from a list. That's just one example of cultural protectionism and you don't have to be a Muslim or even religious to be affected by it.

Really good point that - I never knew that before. Dead easy to see how without having that understanding one can interpret such policies (in regards to wearing religious symbols) so differently ...

Any book suggestions on different conceptions of multiculturalism anybody?

 

[8den]

And greatly amused by the double standards of some here

Nearly a hundred people are dead and hundreds more injured there are more appropriate ways to find your jollies.