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Kicking Off In Tottenham

Really sad seeing the poor woman on BBC who lost her flat and all her belongings in the building that was set on fire.
 
Really sad seeing the poor woman on BBC who lost her flat and all her belongings in the building that was set on fire.
Yes when a face and personal story is put on it, it just makes it all the more depressing.
 
But again, thse morons are in the tiny minority. Is it poverty that leads to violence or is it the case that individuals who are spiteful, ignorant bullies become/remain impoverished? It might not be particularly reassuring to think that some people are just nasty cunts rather than a product of their environment, but what else is there to separate these dozens of people from the millions of others raised in similar circumstances really?
Noodles, look again - this is a LOT more than 'dozens', taken in the round.
 
of course it is! However, it's different in each and every individual case, and difficult to quantify - so it makes more sense to focus on the bit we can do something about - the wider socioeconomic context.

Well, but I don't agree that there is nothing that can be done in terms of the "nature" element. We're not talking eugenics or anything before more words are stuffed into my mouth. Sure, more work can be done on "prevention" re: the nurture element but a healthy dose of "cure" is surely in order re: nature for some of these cunts - i.e. long custodial sentences.
 
Noodles, look again - this is a LOT more than 'dozens', taken in the round.

Sure, but proportionally speaking - tiny. Like I said before, I think some people are keen to lump a whole generation in with thse twats. And I don't think that that is correct or desirable.
 
This is Thatcher's legacy. This is what happens when you let an idiot like Maggie slash education spending in the 1980's.

This is Cameron's shit to deal with. Castrato Clegg can fuck off. Education was and still is as vital an industry as any manufacturing base. She killed it along with mining.

Yeah great work. Now look.
 
I didn't say that it was "all because some people are naturally violent" - see my reply to Strathamite. So you don't think some people are naturally violent and thuggish? Why not? Because it's not something which is particularly pleasant to contemplate? Or are there other reasons?

Why is it "either" nature or nuture? It it not possible to be some combination of the two?

You're being deliberately obtuse for the sake of arguing now. No thanks.
 
Where the fuck are the teargas/watercannon? This is basic stuff. News of the World would have loved this.

A quantum of anger in these youths must surely be from watching the likes of Wade/Brooks and Murdoch get away with crimes that they would be on lockdown for...
 
You're being deliberately obtuse for the sake of arguing now. No thanks.

I don't think that I was being particularly obtuse, I have to say. You were, or at least were very close to, misrepresenting what I actually posted though so I won't apologise for trying to bring you up on those points.
 
speculate away.meanwhile your fucking precious working classes are suffering and scared.I'm off to Croydon.Fuck anyone nearby who isn't trying to help the most vulnerable in this chav looting shit.

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pk - the half-baked crusader.
 
Wonder if there'll be anyone done afterwards for deliberately torching there shop for the insurance. Failing businesses etc.

I'm pretty sure they'll be out of luck.

Most insurance policies exclude claims for damage caused by civil unrest/rioting.

Chances are these people whose homes and businesses are going up in smoke are losing everything, even if they were insured.
 
Where the fuck are the teargas/watercannon? This is basic stuff. News of the World would have loved this.

I don't think we have water cannon on the mainland, at least that's what some 'expert' was saying on the BBC.
 
I'm pretty sure they'll be out of luck.

Most insurance policies exclude claims for damage caused by civil unrest/rioting.

Chances are these people whose homes and businesses are going up in smoke are losing everything, even if they were insured.

I think they can going get out of paying if it's officially declared a riot, then the state picks up the bill.
 
I'm pretty sure they'll be out of luck.

Most insurance policies exclude claims for damage caused by civil unrest/rioting.

Chances are these people whose homes and businesses are going up in smoke are losing everything, even if they were insured.

Nope. Most home policies (not sure re: commercial) do not exclude loss arising from riot damage - there is no reason to, as if they indemnify a policyholder for riot damage then they can recover their outlay through subrogation under the Riot (Damages) Act 1886. Those who are uninsured can also recover their losses under the same Act.
 
I honestly don't know - yet.
but I do know how we DON'T deal with them - by writing a whole generation of inner city kids off as 'scum', by demonising and vilifying them, or turning their estates into a Police State, and seeing this purely as a law & order problem, and sending the cops in to tame them (this problem was started by the police!)
because they aren't scum; they're simply youth who have grown up at the hard end, with fewer reasons to adhere to the rules of a society that offers them diddly, and less to lose by raising two fingers to the whole damn lot.
My heart breaks when I see kids here, or in Tottenham - no-one's ever given a fuck about them, paid them attention, given them opportunities, or simply made them feel they're someone or something.
Plus - endless harassment by the cops.
And now these cuts hit their families hardest.
We really shouldn't be surprised when they riot.

chances of shitemaster actually coming back with a coherent response to this ? low I'd guess....
 
Generally speaking :
Happy people with something to lose don't riot.
People who have the piss taken out of them get angry.
People scared of losing their status don't want change.

Also
Worst speech ever from home secretary this evening. How not to connect people. Was almost like she was purposely trying to bait people.
 
Pointless pointless looters. Where's the real politics? Southern Europe and North Africa put us to shame, they have just as much disaffection but they don't express it by helping themselves to poxy fucking trainers. I may change my tune if gangs of hoodies emerge from Waterstones with Kropotkin biographies.
 
I lived in 'poor' East London as a kid in multi-cultural Waltham Forest, people dealt with it, no youth centres in the late '70s/'80 and very little crime to be honest. Fuck all this shit, looting and the like, shitting on their own doorsteps is pathetic.

It's a far deeper problem that needs to be addressed, and I have no explanation or answer to it, but there are parts of London that are really fucked, and it's a problem that's going to need a lot of work, gangs etc. The whole lack of aspiration apart from a mobile/pair of trainers ideal is just disturbing.

Worriying to even hear on the news of 'bringing the army in'.

Serious shit that needs sorting out.

:confused:
 
I'm pretty sure they'll be out of luck.

Most insurance policies exclude claims for damage caused by civil unrest/rioting.

Chances are these people whose homes and businesses are going up in smoke are losing everything, even if they were insured.
I was wondering about that. The state needs to sort them out if this is the case, they're the ones we pay to protect us from having our homes torched.
 
I honestly don't know - yet.
but I do know how we DON'T deal with them - by writing a whole generation of inner city kids off as 'scum', by demonising and vilifying them, or turning their estates into a Police State, and seeing this purely as a law & order problem, and sending the cops in to tame them (this problem was started by the police!)
because they aren't scum; they're simply youth who have grown up at the hard end, with fewer reasons to adhere to the rules of a society that offers them diddly, and less to lose by raising two fingers to the whole damn lot.
My heart breaks when I see kids here, or in Tottenham - no-one's ever given a fuck about them, paid them attention, given them opportunities, or simply made them feel they're someone or something.
Plus - endless harassment by the cops.
And now these cuts hit their families hardest.
We really shouldn't be surprised when they riot.

Hold on though, some are, some aren't, you said that yourself. So what should be done immediately to stop the violence and looting?

Heavier policing? Let them get on with it?

It's all very well and noble seeking to understand the reasons behind the violence, but what about the people who aren't rioting who are being fucked by it?

What should the police do NOW?
 
I think they can going get out of paying if it's officially declared a riot, then the state picks up the bill.
Nope. Most home policies (not sure re: commercial) do not exclude loss arising from riot damage - there is no reason to, as if they indemnify a policyholder for riot damage then they can recover their outlay through subrogation under the Riot (Damages) Act 1886. Those who are uninsured can also recover their losses under the same Act.

Gotcha. Cheers.
 
chances of shitemaster actually coming back with a coherent response to this ?

Did you type that one handed while wanking over YouTube videos of burning buildings, Catshit? :)

Shouldn't you be threatening people by PM anyway, you keyboard warrior nonce?
 
'A gang of vandals broke the windows of an Islamic bank in Whitechapel but were chased off by a rival gang of 100 Muslim youths who are standing guard outside the East London Mosque. Local shops have been attacked'

along with the post above this is a very worrying development
 
Did you type that one handed while wanking over YouTube videos of burning buildings, Catshit? :)

Shouldn't you be threatening people by PM anyway, you keyboard warrior nonce?

I've said it on here, + said it by PM, I'll say it again, if you ever want to meet up and call me a nonce to my face, plse say - if not, leave if out, it's repulsive, even for you, and as the poster pointed out, offputting for everyone.
 
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