I have a mate who worked there. Edited it in fact. So I just know what he has said. Was a while ago so things might have gotten worse.
Keeping tabs on left/alternative news media
- Thread starter Brainaddict
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hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
Yeah, I rate Reel News, the sort of thing I reckon we could use more of, non-sectarian coverage of grassroots-level struggles. Although going by that number above, apparently not that many people agree with me?
Karl Masks
Birds Angel Delight
Why not?
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
No, time will not tell. Obvs.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
I like Novara Media, but Darren Bacardi is the weakest link. He has many dog shit opinions. Here's one example of his dogshittery:
Rob Ray
Weight is meaningless
Building YouTube audience without having either a thorough social media strategy or serious pull elsewhere is difficult, especially if you're not appealing to a US audience. They could do way better if they had the former though imo, the journalism is easily good enough.
Fozzie Bear
Well-Known Member
Interesting that Novara seems to be getting bigger...
Fozzie Bear
Well-Known Member
Also I agree that Bastani is a pain in the arse but it's idealistic to think that Novara is a platform for anything other than the mildest socialist politics and clickbait really.
Of course they do other things, many of them good, but their main driver is being a "big tent" slightly to the left of the Guardian. Their main metrics will be the number of supporters/funders and the number of clicks.
Of course they do other things, many of them good, but their main driver is being a "big tent" slightly to the left of the Guardian. Their main metrics will be the number of supporters/funders and the number of clicks.
Fozzie Bear
Well-Known Member
Also interesting that former Novara contributor James Meadway (who used to work with McDonnell iirc) has set up his own weekly economics/news podcast Macrodose under the organisational banner of Planet B Productions.
Planet B also does the Politics Theory Other and Verso books podcasts...
linktr.ee
planetbproductions.co.uk
Planet B also does the Politics Theory Other and Verso books podcasts...
MACRODOSE | Instagram, TikTok | Linktree
View macrodosepodcast’s Linktree. Listen to their music on Spotify here.
linktr.ee
Planet B Productions
Planet B is a media production company based in London. We specialise in producing audio-visual content that tells alternative stories, with focus on bringing radical ideas, critical histories and original storytelling to wide audiences.
planetbproductions.co.uk
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Fozzie Bear
Well-Known Member
Honorary mention for What The Trans, which is also something that started as a podcast but is now doing the occasional written news on its website. So I think they aspire to being a media org but aren't there yet for understandable reasons.
whatthetrans.com
(I.e. let's not turn this into another thread about podcasts please
)
What The Trans!? – News media for trans people
whatthetrans.com
(I.e. let's not turn this into another thread about podcasts please
)
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They also sell merch, they've been doing it for a while now. £48 for a pair of Novara Media joggers. Left Capitalism in action.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
Also interesting that former Novara contributor James Meadway (who used to work the McDonnell iirc) has set up his own weekly economics/news podcast Macrodose under the organisational banner of Planet B Productions.
MACRODOSE | Instagram, TikTok | Linktree
View macrodosepodcast’s Linktree. Listen to their music on Spotify here.
Planet B Productions
Planet B is a media production company based in London. We specialise in producing audio-visual content that tells alternative stories, with focus on bringing radical ideas, critical histories and original storytelling to wide audiences.
Macrodose is excellent. Well worth listening to if anyone is interested in economics and also the interaction between neo/liberalism and the Anthropocene. PTO is also good. Both actually engaging in ideas, thought and often genuinely informative.
Gave up on Novara a long time ago. It felt like a clunking manifestation of the online soi-disant "left".
Fozzie Bear
Well-Known Member
How comfy have you found them though, GS?
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
Tbf, Bastani is frequently shit, and anyone who uses "cope" as a noun or adjective or whatever he's doing there is very annoying and clearly suffering from internet poisoning, but I dunno if the substance of what he's saying is that objectionable. Mao did achieve things and continues to enjoy quite a big rep in China as a result of his achievements. I don't think that means you have to be a Maoist, far from it, but you can oppose Mao/ism while also recognising that it did have real achievements.
Is it getting bigger or is it just that the one Novara bloke who lives in Leeds* just has a new job title? Actually his article about it looks reasonably decent: Why Novara Media Now Has a North of England Editor | Novara Media
As it happens, somehow I ended up in a conversation about Novara at the pub at the weekend, I kept trying to remember James Butler's name but kept thinking of James Bloodworth, and if I'd gone "you know, the posh one" I don't think it would've narrowed it down too much.
Also fwiw, I did recently set up a thing to give them £3 a month, less out of any great love for them and more from a general sense that it'd be worth supporting some kind of a left media outlet, so as UK stuff goes it's pretty much either them or Tribune. Maybe Tribune would've been a better bet, dunno. Anyway, after I set up they sent me an email with an exclusive chance to buy Bastani live tickets before they go on sale to the public, which was almost enough to make me cancel it on the spot.
*for the trainspotters/file-keepers, I think also arguably one of the most successful careers ever enjoyed by a British (ex-)platformist, although I don't think he talks about those days very much anymore.
editor
hiraethified
*revives idea for top of the range urban75 glowing rave underpants
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
That article is more than decent actually, much better than the largely performative outrage/amused superiority I often saw and listened to on their achingly London social media platforms. Yet again however there is scant detail on how their fabled community organising approach is going to actually work. As he correctly notes, "you have to live there".....
Agree with you as well on that Bastani quote, he's correct in his assessment of Mao's reputation. I also think he's much more interesting than some of their contributors. But, for me, he can never recover from the truly execrable Fully Automated Luxury Communism.
Rob Ray
Weight is meaningless
Bastani's not stupid, his greatest problem is that he built his rep on being radical when he isn't really (I remember him waxing lyrical about the benefits of conservative British democracy from quite early on), and while it was great for building a media position his association with radicalism (that pic of him shirtless at an anti-tax protest) and particularly the way he was labelled as a Corbynist outrider, derailed any early seats in the Commons.
With the exception of maybe James Butler most of that crew were up for talking vaguely about radical socialism but their actual politics, particularly when Corbynism took hold, were pretty standard social democrat. I went to one of their New Year bashes in Hackney when they were still the wunderkind new media centre of the scene and it was notable how badly rinsed on a debate about universal credit their man got by a CPB hack – felt very "students vs actual commie".
With the exception of maybe James Butler most of that crew were up for talking vaguely about radical socialism but their actual politics, particularly when Corbynism took hold, were pretty standard social democrat. I went to one of their New Year bashes in Hackney when they were still the wunderkind new media centre of the scene and it was notable how badly rinsed on a debate about universal credit their man got by a CPB hack – felt very "students vs actual commie".
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
Yeah, in common with a lot of that scene I suspect I probably like them better now that Corbynism's over and they're no longer able to do all that irritating "we're the sensible adults who are going to be holding state power and writing policy any minute now" stuff.
Rob Ray
Weight is meaningless
One thing I will say in their favour though - none of them went turncoat (as of yet). That's not nothing given the temptation will have been there, especially for reasonably well-performing media faces like Bastani and Sarkar. Sticking with a media project when it's past the Sexy New Thing phase involves graft and they have stuck with it.
ska invita
back on the other side
For sure and an amusing example can be found here
In a live Q&A a 24 year old asks him as a young person new to all this "how can i be more involved in politics"
to which he answers
- take out a direct debit, such as to the national trust
- get involved in either Labour or the Greens, maybe become a councilor
Downstream is a good interview show though and I like that he doesnt interview the same old people from the left, and broadly I get something out of his more realpolitik approach which is often missing around the left IMO.
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ska invita
back on the other side
Also interesting that former Novara contributor James Meadway (who used to work with McDonnell iirc) has set up his own weekly economics/news podcast Macrodose under the organisational banner of Planet B Productions.
Planet B also does the Politics Theory Other and Verso books podcasts...
MACRODOSE | Instagram, TikTok | Linktree
View macrodosepodcast’s Linktree. Listen to their music on Spotify here.
Planet B Productions
Planet B is a media production company based in London. We specialise in producing audio-visual content that tells alternative stories, with focus on bringing radical ideas, critical histories and original storytelling to wide audiences.
its hard to find people to trust about economics....fact is we here defintiely dont understand it and so have to put trust in others....how much even experts really do is often far from certain. Larry Eliot in the Guardian continuously gets it wrong for example.
Havent heard James Meadway a lot but in March 2020 before furlough kicked in he was making the case the government should borrow billions to spend on Covid (furlough and healthcare) - which they did. It would create a massive debt BUT he said thats fine because all you need to do in the coming years is increase inflation and reduce the debt that way - as happened after WW2. Seemed reasonable at the time.
Then in 2023 I heard him complaining about how inflation had gone up. I barely ever post on social media but i messaged him to say that I thought he wanted inflation to go up...he said "no, when did i say that?"...I sent him a link to it and he went quiet. I wasn't trying to do a Gotcha, more I genuinely thought what he was saying sounded like good economic sense so was surprised to hear him contradict what he previously said with such certainty ...Now I dont trust him.
Credit to Gary Stevenson who so far at least seems to have an unblemished record on analysis and prediction regarding UK economy at least
Michael Roberts can be interesting but he's a Marxist doom-monger whose blog title basically sums up how he's always predicting the worst and yet the worst never happens as he predicts - still worth a read though from time to time Michael Roberts Blog
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Fozzie Bear
Well-Known Member
Thanks ska invita that's funny about Meadway
Despite that I'd say the podcast is worth a go.
Gary Stevenson is really interesting and I like the way he explains things. His politics frustrate me - he has a brilliant understanding of what a con the economy is for working class people, but he can't make the leap away from higher taxes for the rich to creating a different system entirely.
Having said that, it will be interesting to see what happens when his book comes out and he gets more opportunities to get into the mainstream media...
Despite that I'd say the podcast is worth a go.
Gary Stevenson is really interesting and I like the way he explains things. His politics frustrate me - he has a brilliant understanding of what a con the economy is for working class people, but he can't make the leap away from higher taxes for the rich to creating a different system entirely.
Having said that, it will be interesting to see what happens when his book comes out and he gets more opportunities to get into the mainstream media...
lazythursday
Averagely-Known Member
Meadway's recent take on inflation, from what I've read / heard, isn't so much that it's a bad thing, but that it's persistent and not caused by the same drivers as previously - and that therefore following the business-as-usual standard economist methods of reducing inflation is unlikely to work. So I'm not sure his past and current views completely contradict each other. I'd rather find a way in my head to explain your anecdote because he's one of the only writers I have much time for at the moment!
ska invita
back on the other side
Well that's it isn't it, he's someone very much interacting with the system as is, down to actually trading and making money off it.Thanks ska invita that's funny about Meadway
Despite that I'd say the podcast is worth a go.
Gary Stevenson is really interesting and I like the way he explains things. His politics frustrate me - he has a brilliant understanding of what a con the economy is for working class people, but he can't make the leap away from higher taxes for the rich to creating a different system entirely.
Having said that, it will be interesting to see what happens when his book comes out and he gets more opportunities to get into the mainstream media...
Agree, I get the impression he's wanting to get into mainstream media as much as possible with this book, so will likely be doing the media rounds. I wish him the best
I think there are a lot of reform of economics that could have a massive impact, not just tax, and post 2008 economic orthodoxy still hasn't had it's comeuppance, current mainstream economics seems to be running on fumes of provenly broken ideas. Sooner or later that has to give
zedr
new but not *that* new
Have enjoyed the new Notes from Below printed format they do. Not sure how much it really counts as news media as it seems to be heavily theory based and won't have a particularly broad appeal. Same goes for Red Pepper. Have some good articles and like the range of stuff they cover but neither are really updated enough to be much use as news outlets.
In terms of the Morning Star, its still stocked in the Tulse Hill Co-op! Not sure what to make of that but I've seen a bunch of those Are You A Communist socialist appeal stickers along that strip of south London.
In terms of the Morning Star, its still stocked in the Tulse Hill Co-op! Not sure what to make of that but I've seen a bunch of those Are You A Communist socialist appeal stickers along that strip of south London.
ska invita
back on the other side
He was actively advocating for continuous years of inflation to allow for borrowing, the opposite of wanting to bring it down!
Anyhow I think with each and every economic commentator it needs taking with salt, seems to me it's more an art than science, doesn't mean people don't have interesting things to say... It's more the tone of certainty that winds me up a bit.
A bit old now but Harry Shutt was someone I thought was closer to truth than most but I can't remember what he was saying now
I haven't checked his work for years
economics too hard for my brain, very little sticks. I still don't understand basics, like what is money, gold standard, all that stuff. Maybe one day
lazythursday
Averagely-Known Member
But I'm not sure he's saying he wants action to bring it down now - he's saying that the standard methods of doing so are unlikely to work because of the changed circumstances of the Anthropocene. I think he's saying we have to live with it. But I am also not great with economics! But regardless of his consistency, I'm glad he seems to be getting a higher profile for his arguments. There seems to be a few different overlapping schools of thought - degrowth / doughnut economics / foundational economy / community wealth building that must be the basis of some kind of new approach to economics on the left, but gets so little attention in the mainstream.He was actively advocating for continuous years of inflation to allow for borrowing, the opposite of wanting to bring it down!
Anyhow I think with each and every economic commentator it needs taking with salt, seems to me it's more an art than science, doesn't mean people don't have interesting things to say... It's more the tone of certainty that winds me up a bit.
A bit old now but Harry Shutt was someone I thought was closer to truth than most but I can't remember what he was saying now
I haven't checked his work for years
economics too hard for my brain, very little sticks. I still don't understand basics, like what is money, gold standard, all that stuff. Maybe one day
Rob Ray
Weight is meaningless
That's despite the Star rather than because of it tbf. Socialist Appeal have their own thing.
Without going into my personal takes the Star's paper sales and income have held up remarkably well compared to the rest of the industry (from a low baseline), largely because its CPB and trade union core is pretty reliable. Online it'd grown to a fairly decent level of reach before taking the same hit on social media as many other outlets when Facebook did their anti news rejig.
Karl Masks
Birds Angel Delight
His entire demeanour during that show was weirdly super defensiveFor sure and an amusing example can be found here
In a live Q&A a 24 year old asks him as a young person new to all this "how can i be more involved in politics"
to which he answers
(also says to become a union organiser)
- take out a direct debit, such as to the national trust
- get involved in either Labour or the Greens, maybe become a councilor
Downstream is a good interview show though and I like that he doesnt interview the same old people from the left, and broadly I get something out of his more realpolitik approach which is often missing around the left IMO.
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