two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
By - for example - whether he/she's going to sell off the NHS cheaply to the people who funded his/her party and election campaign?
You know, something important rather than just trivia.
Jeremy Corbyn's time is up
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By - for example - whether he/she's going to sell off the NHS cheaply to the people who funded his/her party and election campaign?
You know, something important rather than just trivia.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Ah, the old competence chestnut. Tell me, do you think the coup plotters are a competent bunch? Each attempt they've made to oust Corbyn has made the Keystone Kops look like shit-hot criminologists. From what I've seen the coup plotters couldn't run a proverbial piss-up in a brewery. The current government isn't exactly competent either, yet the focus of this 'competence' narrative is on Corbyn. Funny that.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Eh?
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Lol. I used to remember Reg Race being in just about any platform that Socialist Organiser organised.sure he used to contribute to their paper and some other Trots in the Labour Party's paper. Was definitely on the Bennite left. Anyone else remember him?
It's the only reasonable response to Desmond's shit trolling. Telling him to fuck off.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
John Crace? I'm splitting my sides.
Only for his company Quality Health making millions from the NHS.
The treacherous, turncoat swine.
He and Owen Smith should get along well
andysays
Love and solidarity
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
He's the person that has been selected to be the face of Saving Labour. It is highly likely he was chosen due to his previous of being left wing and thus a more credible opponent of Corbyn. I highly doubt he is the main man, just one of the plotters.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
Yes. I would take your opinion more seriously if you had a history of competent political analysis instead of which every time you pop up and start posting in P&P you end up looking like a superficial, ignorant idiot. This outing of yours won't be any different
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
My brain momentarily confused him with Reg Prentice who was, from memory and before the SDP, one of the first MPs to cross the floor from Lab > Con. Woodward went the other way. But yes, I remember him from the 70s, appearing in Tribune and on various Bennite platforms. Haven't heard of him for years, surprised he's still above ground.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
... and for what it's worth, having just looked on wiki, Prentice was motivated to defect to the Tories after being deselected (which was quite difficult in the 70s, before some changes made circa 81/2). Whether any future deselections will lead to right wing MPs dashing to the Tories (rather than some as yet unformed new-New Labour party) will be interesting. To be honest though the Tories are in such a strong position they'd be wise to tell any aspiring defectors to fuck off.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
factory system. Replicated through social life, imposed on social life
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
I've worked in factories that still had the punch cards. Cross thread perhaps but it ties in with workplace discipline. If that card stamp was a minute late you got docked 15 mins pay. Guess what you got for staying 15 mins later at request. Shit all.
and sadly these places not only still exist, but are more numerous every year!
ItWillNeverWork
Messy Crimbobs, fellow humans.
We had the electronic punch cards at one of my workplaces. Was easy to get someone to clock your card in for you though, so fuck em.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
1000+ in Ramsgate, pretty good going.
update, organisers are saying well over 2000
of course many will be from surrounding areas, but still.
Voter turnout in 2015 was 70.4%. Tories got 38% of the vote. Labour got 24% of the vote. UKIP got 32% of the vote. Greens got 2% of the vote.
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that is a fantastic article, read it ages ago.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Yes, it is good. I've meant to read some of his other stuff, must get round to it.
I considered asking for this thread to be closed as the appearance of this name as tainted and corrupted a decent thread. This weasel is unforgivable, he made Thatcher and Blair look trustworthy.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Yeah, he was a watchword for treachery in the Labour movement - till the SDP came along and took it to another level. Rhodes Boyson was another one, labour councillor and possibly mayor (?) before heading Torywards. Oh fuck, I've done it again...
Vintage Paw
dead stare and computer glare
Since the thread was talking about the women's initiative stuff, as well as working class stuff, I don't know if Angela Rayner's mini-speech was linked to or not, but I thought it was really good.
It showed how to talk about women's issues without it being empty, and tied it to class and poverty and education, and issues that will be far closer to most people's experiences than the stuff some other politicians come out with.
If we want more working class politicians, we want them to sound like her (not just in accent - but accent of course has an effect), and not Alan Johnson, for example. She spoke with a passion that showed she absolutely understood what it is to struggle and be ground down. Can you imagine her talking to constituents about their problems, and contrast it to someone like Tristram talking to his? Just that initial impression has an impact. But beyond that, for someone like Tristram those struggles are abstract. For someone like her they're a reality. (I'm not suggesting she's the second coming, I don't know much else about her tbh.)
It's not as easy as Corbs saying "right, 75% of all MPs must have worked in a factory" or whatever. As I wrote in another post, while he has some power, the party machinery (NEC and McNicol, and then region below them) have substantially more when it comes to things like shortlists and the like. It's easy for Corbyn to make his pledges about all-women shortlists - not least because Labour already has them (not sure what's so different about his conception of them) - because that's the way the wind is already blowing and there are few who would disagree with the general point. But all-working class shortlists? Quite apart from the impossibility of deciding what the criteria would be, it would be a policy based firmly in class, and the wind very much is not blowing in that direction in wider politics/society. It's pushing back against it, in fact. So it would require one heck of a lot more manoeuvring before it could be a manifesto point or party policy, or even a vague intention. For a start, McNicol needs to go, and then regional officers. But they're all employed, and not elected, so the way it's done would have to be very delicate to say the least. I hope the new NEC starts that work when they come in after conference, but the new 6 on the NEC aren't the only ones on there, so it's not like they suddenly have a clear road ahead of them to do what they want. McNicol's still there, for a start.
I agree he needs to make it clear he wants 'ordinary people' coming into the ranks as MPs and administrative officers. A very overt announcement would be great, but I don't think it's going to happen in the way it did with something like all-women shortlists. This is the stuff of backroom manoeuvring. It's ensuring new members get involved in their CLPs so they can eventually stand for local positions, and it's getting rid of McNicol and regional officers so they can't stitch up selections, and it's getting those local people in a position where they can start standing, and actually have a chance of winning a selection (which is rare precisely because of the stitch-up culture; you'll get some golden boy parachuted in and region will fix it so the only others on the shortlist are really so abysmally dire you wouldn't vote for them even if they are a lefty - that plus other underhand shenanigans). It's the long game, which is incredibly frustrating of course.
It showed how to talk about women's issues without it being empty, and tied it to class and poverty and education, and issues that will be far closer to most people's experiences than the stuff some other politicians come out with.
If we want more working class politicians, we want them to sound like her (not just in accent - but accent of course has an effect), and not Alan Johnson, for example. She spoke with a passion that showed she absolutely understood what it is to struggle and be ground down. Can you imagine her talking to constituents about their problems, and contrast it to someone like Tristram talking to his? Just that initial impression has an impact. But beyond that, for someone like Tristram those struggles are abstract. For someone like her they're a reality. (I'm not suggesting she's the second coming, I don't know much else about her tbh.)
It's not as easy as Corbs saying "right, 75% of all MPs must have worked in a factory" or whatever. As I wrote in another post, while he has some power, the party machinery (NEC and McNicol, and then region below them) have substantially more when it comes to things like shortlists and the like. It's easy for Corbyn to make his pledges about all-women shortlists - not least because Labour already has them (not sure what's so different about his conception of them) - because that's the way the wind is already blowing and there are few who would disagree with the general point. But all-working class shortlists? Quite apart from the impossibility of deciding what the criteria would be, it would be a policy based firmly in class, and the wind very much is not blowing in that direction in wider politics/society. It's pushing back against it, in fact. So it would require one heck of a lot more manoeuvring before it could be a manifesto point or party policy, or even a vague intention. For a start, McNicol needs to go, and then regional officers. But they're all employed, and not elected, so the way it's done would have to be very delicate to say the least. I hope the new NEC starts that work when they come in after conference, but the new 6 on the NEC aren't the only ones on there, so it's not like they suddenly have a clear road ahead of them to do what they want. McNicol's still there, for a start.
I agree he needs to make it clear he wants 'ordinary people' coming into the ranks as MPs and administrative officers. A very overt announcement would be great, but I don't think it's going to happen in the way it did with something like all-women shortlists. This is the stuff of backroom manoeuvring. It's ensuring new members get involved in their CLPs so they can eventually stand for local positions, and it's getting rid of McNicol and regional officers so they can't stitch up selections, and it's getting those local people in a position where they can start standing, and actually have a chance of winning a selection (which is rare precisely because of the stitch-up culture; you'll get some golden boy parachuted in and region will fix it so the only others on the shortlist are really so abysmally dire you wouldn't vote for them even if they are a lefty - that plus other underhand shenanigans). It's the long game, which is incredibly frustrating of course.
Brixton Hatter
Home is south London mate
Just been for after-work drinks with Mrs Hatter. Caned. Can't remember where Little Hatter is. Might have left him in the 3rd or 4th pub.
CORBYN WHERE'S MY BABY??
CORBYN WHERE'S MY BABY??
Puddy_Tat
naturally fluffy
two sheds
Least noticed poster 2007
He's been to Cornwall twice this year.
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