Jeremy Corbyn's time is up

[free spirit]

As I say, none the wiser.

isn't this really the nub of the issue though? Those who're being randomly accused of bullying and abuse online are equally non-entities, yet they're being used as the main reason to halt all CLP meetings, hold secret ballots and attack corbyn for not controlling these people.

Even when it turns out that the worst example is from a far right troll, that's still held up as an example of how bad momentum / corbyn are with their online bullying.

 

[DotCommunist]

all the while using a dead young womans brutal murder to justify themselves. Out the sides of their mouths. My horse has more religion than ye etc

 

[free spirit]

Not sure if this has been posted yet, on my day off from politics as well as work but...



Apparently from the NEC Procedures Committee, judge the provenance for yourself. Warnings going about too, keep an eye on your personal posts, new Facebook requests, Twitter followers etc. Paranoia inducing, but had some odd requests myself so who knows. Add it on to the routine requests for 'civil' discourse from the right and you've got a potent atmosphere to keep people quiet. 'Civil' in this case meaning don't say anything that suggests any disdain or disagreement with the orthodox narrative of course.

e2a: Applies to registered supporters, but not full members, apparently. Presumably because so many on the wrong side have form for abuse.

So, that means any members or supporters of the Green Surge who've jumped ship to Labour, any supporters of TUSC or Left Unity are barred, and anyone who's got riled up and attacked the PLP plotters in anything other than the politest of terms.

This is nuts, they'll happily accept defecting MPs from other parties straight away, but not former members or supporters of those parties even if they've given up their memberships in order to join Labour to help them defeat the tories under Corbyn.

Basically unless you've been entirely apolitical, or entirely supportive of the previous austerity light Labour Party prior to Corbyn, then you'll be lucky to get through the scrutiny process, and even if you do then you'll need to keep your head down because anyone from the hierachy of the party at any time can just do a trawl of your social media activity and get you kicked out if you've ever shared more than 1 facebook post from another party.

This is really undemocratic McCarthy style witch hunt stuff, and completely counter productive in terms of the key task of winning elections and kicking the tories out.

Not unexpected though, I had a feeling they'd still not allow me to join even if I resigned from the Green Party. I hope Corbyn wins through, and the momentum backed reps get elected to the NEC and they can start to properly assert themselves on the party to stop this crap and start welcoming new members properly rather than viewing them all as the enemy.

 

[Santino]

As I say, none the wiser.

She kidnapped baby River Song.

 

[Wilf]

Not sure if this has been posted yet, on my day off from politics as well as work but...



Apparently from the NEC Procedures Committee, judge the provenance for yourself. Warnings going about too, keep an eye on your personal posts, new Facebook requests, Twitter followers etc. Paranoia inducing, but had some odd requests myself so who knows. Add it on to the routine requests for 'civil' discourse from the right and you've got a potent atmosphere to keep people quiet. 'Civil' in this case meaning don't say anything that suggests any disdain or disagreement with the orthodox narrative of course.

e2a: Applies to registered supporters, but not full members, apparently. Presumably because so many on the wrong side have form for abuse.

A tad ironic that you can be excluded for calling someone scum, but Tony 'father of a million dead' Blair still gets a vote. Manners, that's what's important, yeah.

 

[free spirit]

A tad ironic that you can be excluded for calling someone scum, but Tony 'father of a million dead' Blair still gets a vote. Manners, that's what's important, yeah.

Does calling blair a war criminal count as abuse?

That'd be pretty much every corbyn supporter fucked.

 

[danny la rouge]

I just looked up who France's Barber is and, to be honest, I'm none the wiser. So why does it matter what nonsense she spews into the vacuum that is Twitter?

What gets said on Twitter makes even less difference to the country than what gets said on here.

She's a real zoomer. She was all over Twitter threads during the indyref calling people anti-English racists for supporting independence. Including people who were English. And using hateful language, then calling others hateful when they called her on it. Bizarre person altogether.

But you're right: it's Twitter. It's the place that anyone can post ill considered garbage before they've had a chance to think about it.

As for her fame: she's a well known actor of stage and screen, with an artistic credibility that doesn't match that of her views. I've seen her in many things, and, before I came across her Twitter feed, quite liked her.

 

[Hocus Eye.]

Novara/Mason interview

Brexit, Labour, Immigration & Trident – Paul Mason in conversation

nb: I haven't actually listened to this so have no idea what it's like

This is worth a listen. Lots to think about. It is thoughtfully and carefully optimistic.

 

[kabbes]

She kidnapped baby River Song.

Ah, that one. Now that means something to me.

 

[Wilf]

Why don't you members demand/hold ward meetings and have votes of confidence/no confidence at that level? Like, right now.

Yep, that gets right to it, not just for urban's labour members, but the corbyn left more generally. If you think the corbyn thing is worth doing, if you think it's worth investing your time in, if you think there is a way or running a party that isn't top-down, clique based, now's the time to prove it. And the paradox of the whole thing is that whilst there needs to be energy put into this internal shit, it's just the time when you need to be building outside the party and in the wider class.

 

[free spirit]

Yep, that gets right to it, not just for urban's labour members, but the corbyn left more generally. If you think the corbyn thing is worth doing, if you think it's worth investing your time in, if you think there is a way or running a party that isn't top-down, clique based, now's the time to prove it. And the paradox of the whole thing is that whilst there needs to be energy put into this internal shit, it's just the time when you need to be building outside the party and in the wider class.

but any ward that did this would be placing themselves in the firing line for suspension and being placed under the control / scrutiny of the regional party hierachy for as long as they wanted to.

Which would be a bit of an own goal.

Unless it was co-oridinated and hundreds did it at the same time.

 

[belboid]

Unless it was co-oridinated and hundreds did it at the same time.

which would seem to be the next thing to arrange, then.

 

[free spirit]

which would seem to be the next thing to arrange, then.

or wait for the new NEC elections and new NEC to take over, then overturn it.

This could well backfire spectacularly on them anyway, as in the absence of official meetings the only meetings for new members to attend for the next 3 months are going to be momentum meetings.

 

[Wilf]

but any ward that did this would be placing themselves in the firing line for suspension and being placed under the control / scrutiny of the regional party hierachy for as long as they wanted to.

Which would be a bit of an own goal.

Unless it was co-oridinated and hundreds did it at the same time.

But for those who think that Corbynism/The Labour Party is the right way to go, surely they should have the nous to get something together (I don't mean individuals who have just joined obviously, but the likes of Momentum). The social democrats have had the numbers in the party, if not the leading positions at the CLP/NEC level. FFS, do something about it!

 

[Pickman's model]

or wait for the new NEC elections and new NEC to take over, then overturn it.

This could well backfire spectacularly on them anyway, as in the absence of official meetings the only meetings for new members to attend for the next 3 months are going to be momentum meetings.

yes everyone's thus far assumed the changes were pushed through by the magenta scum: but when you look at it in that light...

 

[free spirit]

But for those who think that Corbynism/The Labour Party is the right way to go, surely they should have the nous to get something together (I don't mean individuals who have just joined obviously, but the likes of Momentum). The social democrats have had the numbers in the party, if not the leading positions at the CLP/NEC level. FFS, do something about it!

it looks like their core plan is to get all 6 members of the NEC who're up for election to be momentum members, which would tilt the balance of the NEC in their favour til the next NEC elections.

That looks like a sensible strategy, keep their eyes on the prize rather than walking into the current NEC's carefully laid trap.

 

[Vintage Paw]

Do leadership elections have any oversight by an external body?

Presumably the electoral commission.

 

[Wilf]

To be fair to momentum.... the blairite's house magazine, the guardian, is reporting 'unofficial' meetings are taking place:
Labour suspends Brighton branch amid accusations of improper ballot

The Guardian has received numerous reports of unofficial meetings in some branches in defiance of an edict from the central party. At the same time, Momentum, the grassroots group of Corbyn supporters, is mobilising to defend the position of the leader.

Unite, the party’s biggest union donor, has now also raised the prospect of mandatory reselection, meaning MPs could be under threat of losing the right to stand for Labour at the next general election if they are not in tune with their local membership.

It is understood a series of meetings in Hull have already taken place about a strategy to deselect some or all local Labour MPs – Alan Johnson, Diana Johnson and Karl Turner.

A source told the Guardian of weekly meetings between unions and Labour activists with the objective of promoting Corbyn and working on strategy to pack wards and pick off MPs who were not sufficiently supportive of the leader.

Just listen to the fucking language they use.

But back to Momentum, fair play as I said, but it does seem a bit haphazard and a bit late. If you want to play the dirty game of internal party battles, you need to get moving.

 

[Vintage Paw]

Yeah, sift through this if you are sufficiently interested (((Labour Abuse))) (@LabourCoupAbuse) on Twitter

Apparently this is what politics is now - being victimised and collecting examples of it

That account generally collects examples of people harassing and saying mean things about pro-Corbyn supporters. It throws in the odd one or two in the opposite direction as an attempt at 'balance' to appear more legitimate, but my understanding after following it for a few days is that it is using the language of the #keepitcomradely right in order to obliquely point out their hypocrisy.

 

[DotCommunist]

To be fair to momentum.... the blairite's house magazine, the guardian, is reporting 'unofficial' meetings are taking place:
Labour suspends Brighton branch amid accusations of improper ballot

Just listen to the fucking language they use.

But back to Momentum, fair play as I said, but it does seem a bit haphazard and a bit late. If you want to play the dirty game of internal party battles, you need to get moving.

we've spoken before about the relative inexperience at the game most will have but if loads of old salts from PA, TUSC #insert left vehicle here. They will have had some experience of getting shit organised, right? and many have joined the c-wagon

 

[Wilf]

Just for record, Angela Eagle is scum, Owen Smith is a traitor and Alan Johnson smells of elderberries. Right, that should save me if I ever weaken and think about joining.

 

[Pickman's model]

Just for record, Angela Eagle is scum, Owen Smith is a traitor and Alan Johnson smells of elderberries. Right, that should save me if I ever weaken and think about joining.

alan johnson smells of putrid elderberries. for the record, like.

 

[Sprocket.]

Keep the momentum rolling folks.
Remember.

''It's a movement not a monument.''

Mick McGahey. 1925-1999.

 

[DotCommunist]

Just for record, Angela Eagle is scum, Owen Smith is a traitor and Alan Johnson smells of elderberries. Right, that should save me if I ever weaken and think about joining.

my anti labourism has been sorely tested of late. In a way, jacking it up to 25 quid was a kindness to me personally. I'm not blowing my weed budget just to spite the labour right.

 

[Wilf]

alan johnson smells of putrid elderberries. for the record, like.

Steady on, that's you banned from wasting 25 quid for all of recorded time!

 

[Wilf]

my anti labourism has been sorely tested of late. In a way, jacking it up to 25 quid was a kindness to me personally. I'm not blowing my weed budget just to spite the labour right.

"Corbyn stooges: the link to the drugs trade"

 

[SpookyFrank]

That'd be pretty much every corbyn supporter fucked.

And Mr Chilcott.

 

[J Ed]

That account generally collects examples of people harassing and saying mean things about pro-Corbyn supporters. It throws in the odd one or two in the opposite direction as an attempt at 'balance' to appear more legitimate, but my understanding after following it for a few days is that it is using the language of the #keepitcomradely right in order to obliquely point out their hypocrisy.

Yes, that was my impression too.

 

[Wilf]

And Mr Chilcott.

Shurely, "the thug behind the seven year obsessive hunt to blacken the Dear Leader's name"?

 

[Cid]

Presumably the electoral commission.

I don't think they do... I had a look at the legislation that sets out their remit and their website. They oversee elections that you could define as public; that everyone can participate in (even if it's everyone within a specific geographic area). And party funding. I don't think there's any independent body that oversees the internal running of parties, which seems somewhat ridiculous.