ska invita
back on the other side
I guess they could but I don't think that would do their diplomatic relationship with the "Mother country" much good
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Jamaican removal flight
- Thread starter ash
- Start date
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
sir cliff richard left voluntarily
Manter
Lunch Mob
I don’t have direct experience of the wider deportation regime, so this is anecdotal: Rarely to Europe, as far as I am aware. But that will change with the end of free movement, I’m sure. Europe I think where it happens it’s one or two people rather than a charter flight- anecdotally some polish homeless men have told me they’d go if they could but they can’t afford a plane ticket: but I know there were charter flights to Poland as it blew up at the point where homeless charities were giving data to the home office.
Of course there has always been the option to refuse to allow an EU citizen to stay here, because of a conviction or poverty for example- but we’ve used it very sporadically
Manter
Lunch Mob
They are paid by our government. Quite a lot I think.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Not sure on what legal basis they could refuse landing permission to a plane full of their own citizens either.
ska invita
back on the other side
well this is hypothetical on top of hypothetical but it does happen that people land in a country and then get sent immediately back for whatever visa/legal reasons might be claimed against them. Not worth talking about though really.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Manter
Fascinating subject this. Found this FOI request for a period covering Jan 2016 to May 2018 which lists the charter flights https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/489809/response/1182364/attach/3/FOI 48932 Scott.pdf
Looking at other data 2004-17 it seems that since the seminar that I attended ( must have been about 2006/7) more EU citzens (Poland and Romanian) and Albanians are deported via charter flights, over taking Jamaica/Nigeria etc that I listed. About a third are Asian ( India, Pakistan and Bangledeshi ) and Middle East. Other countries worth mentioning Lithuania , Nigeria China, Jamaica , and Vietnam . Only about a fifth of deportations are for criminal offences.
ska invita
back on the other side
"The largest number of “enforced removals” are of European nationals: 5,375 in 2015. In particular, this included 1,269 Albanians and 1,028 Romanians. Asian nationals are next (4,195 for all of Asia, but not including the “Middle East”), and above all “South Asian” people (2,877). South Asians are also by the far the most targeted for “voluntary return”, 13,847 in 2015. 1,468 Africans were “forcibly removed” in 2015, and 658 people from “Central and South America”, including 303 Jamaicans. NB: these figures do not include “criminal” deportations, for which the Home Office does not provide a breakdown by nationality. "
Deportation Charter Flights: Collective Expulsion in 2017 - Corporate Watch
[responsivevoice_button] Profiling the UK’s mass deportation charter flights and some of the companies that profit from them. In 2013, Corporate Watch published a research report titled “Collective Expulsion: the case against mass deportation charter flights”. Three years later, not much has...
corporatewatch.org
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Few years old but this is a snap shot of Foreign Offenders in the Prison Estate
Manter
Lunch Mob
That is interesting. The france/Austria/Bulgaria/Switzerland and Germany ones will be Dublin 3 cases (where people who claim asylum who have been registered elsewhere in Europe are returned there). No criminal cases.
Albania is non-EU, lots of people come here, quite a lot of gangs, trafficking, national referral mechanism etc, so not surprised by those.
Pakistan are often either Pakistanis who don’t meet £ bars for family visas, Pakistanis who claim to be refugees and are almost without exception returned, and afghans who can’t be returned to Afghanistan easily but are considered to functionally live in Pakistan. Many say that the Pakistani authorities then deport them back to Afghanistan (Pakistan is tying to get afghans to leave at the moment). Who is Afghan and who is Pakistani is a hot topic in the border regions,especially where births are not consistently registered (similar issues on Eritrean and Sudanese borders and the government has refused some claims I know about by saying people aren’t the nationality they claim, eg saying people are Ethiopian and so safe to return.
worth bearing in mind these are charter flights not returns as many returns are done on commercial airlines.
Manter
Lunch Mob
Albania is not EU. Didn’t know so many Romanians were returned, but not a surprise I guess. If you look at that other link, there is a breakdown of criminal cases per flight."The largest number of “enforced removals” are of European nationals: 5,375 in 2015. In particular, this included 1,269 Albanians and 1,028 Romanians. Asian nationals are next (4,195 for all of Asia, but not including the “Middle East”), and above all “South Asian” people (2,877). South Asians are also by the far the most targeted for “voluntary return”, 13,847 in 2015. 1,468 Africans were “forcibly removed” in 2015, and 658 people from “Central and South America”, including 303 Jamaicans. NB: these figures do not include “criminal” deportations, for which the Home Office does not provide a breakdown by nationality. "
That report was published in Jan 2017Deportation Charter Flights: Collective Expulsion in 2017 - Corporate Watch
[responsivevoice_button] Profiling the UK’s mass deportation charter flights and some of the companies that profit from them. In 2013, Corporate Watch published a research report titled “Collective Expulsion: the case against mass deportation charter flights”. Three years later, not much has...
Most voluntary return is on commercial flights- the Home Office basically meet you at the airport with a ticket and escort you through security with your passport (so you can’t take your passport and go somewhere else or just leave the airport and disappear). Friend of mine had a massive drama with a voluntary return because the HO lost her passport, then turned up for the wrong flight, then took her into immigration detention because she had failed to leave as agreed, even though it was their fault. Fucking shower, they really are.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Dublin 3 cases ie EU legislation ?
stuff_it
Too skool for cool
Not sure Jamaica would have him...
Manter
Lunch Mob
It’s an EU law with non- EU signatories. Views are split (ie proper immigration lawyers, not just randoms with opinions) over whether they will let us stay as is post brexit or whether we will have no renegotiate. I wonder whether other countries will take returns post brexit, partly because we have behaved quite badly over it. We are quick to return people ( I know Germany and NL have refused to accept some returns for procedural, medical and compassionate grounds) but slow to take family members to reunite them which is the converse of the claim in first country stuff. And we have refused to take part in the relocations Greece requested (basically they said people ended up there because of geography but those with valid claims should be shared across Europe. We said- predictably- no.)
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
You are miles off - the Tories want to draw attention to this. They think, correctly, that a message of 'we are taking tough action against foreign criminals' plays well with voters. They also benefit from the protests as it advances the insiders v outsiders war they recognise as central to their success and which they will seek to provoke at every opportunity.
ash
Inittogether
Good point !
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
You support rapists.
Manter
Lunch Mob
Looking at this again, I am struck by how many people activists, lawyers etc manage to get off these flights.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
Cummings briefing today indicates that this is a merely a starting point for a series of constructed dividing lines between ‘insider, woke, liberals’ and ‘the rest of us’.
This isn’t merely about political dividing lines. It’s about fuel and oxygen for a much wider and lasting political realignment strategy.
Sasaferrato
Super Refuser!
Sasaferrato
Super Refuser!
Or anywhere else.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Interestingly Spain, Germany , France and Italy have more foreign offneders in prison than we do. Across Europe trend is higher number in Western and Central Europe less in the Eastern states. As a general issue deportation of foreign offenders seems to be widespread across Europe.
yes , going back through the years there were a number of case scenarios and case studies under both Labour and Cons governments about disruption in enacting legislation deporting foreign offenders
ska invita
back on the other side
"deportation of foreign offenders " is not the issue here though - the issue is deporting of people who should not be treated as "foreign"
Manter
Lunch Mob
Not strictly true. I posted this thread by an immigration barrister earlier: it’s a good explanation.
Manter
Lunch Mob
Yeah, 39thstep and I had segued into a slightly different conversation because there was some really interesting stuff in the FOI he found earlier. I think we both agree with you (I certainly do) we’d just gone off on a bit of a tangent
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
That’s why I said as a general issue Ska.
ska invita
back on the other side
apologies, dipped in
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