Hundreds of women assaulted in German NYE celebrations

[Casually Red]

I meant trolled by bluescreen ... which I thought was pretty clear from the context ...

Ok then .

My apologies . I was wrong and uncharitable in that instance . I took you up wrong there .

 

[DotCommunist]

Well quite.

Thing is there are only 3 or 4 of them doing this mendacious shit. I'd put money on there being shit loads of onlookers to this thread on Bimble's side, thinking they're being wankers, but staying out of it!

numerous PM's about it I recon

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Casually Red

Don't worry about it.

 

[Spymaster]

numerous PM's about it I recon

Almost certainly!

 

[Pickman's model]

Twice iirc. Once to Liamo, who I apologised to . And to Redsky, who didn't get an apology but got a belated compliment instead in its place .

Which is more than you've done from what I can see.

But then again if your never wrong you don't have to I suppose .

Eta

3 now

yeh, you're right: there's no need to say sorry if you've not done anything wrong. and i haven't done anything to say sorry for.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Well quite.

Thing is there are only 3 or 4 of them doing this mendacious shit. I'd put money on there being shit loads of onlookers to this thread on Bimble's side, thinking they're being wankers, but staying out of it!

It's certainly a highly divisive thread.

I believe bimble used the word 'poisonous' earlier and I can agree with that. I'd also go with 'profoundly depressing' ...

 

[Casually Red]

Almost certainly!

Almost definitely. All depends in ones definition of a lot.

Mind you " a lot of wankers " only totals about 5 or 6 .

 

[Casually Red]

Casually Red

Don't worry about it.

Thank you. It's probably fair to say you copped some other people's flak there too .

 

[bluescreen]

bimble

Can I suggest just refraining from using those misrepresentation tactics?

However well they've worked for you elsewhere, you must have realised by now that they're *really* pissing a number of people off here.

I don't know about anyone else, but I'd much rather get back to the still unanswered question of how mass sexual assaults emerged from what seems to be a recent street crime formation with links to people smuggling networks, and why the cops response to it has been so ineffectual etc.

As for why the cops' response has been so ineffectual: perhaps there's a ready excuse that dumps it on political correctness. It's bollocks, as it was in Rotherham, but it's a handy (and temporarily useful) excuse for inaction, that for a while appears unassailable.

 

[Casually Red]

yeh, you're right: there's no need to say sorry if you've not done anything wrong. and i haven't done anything to say sorry for.

Of course , you're never wrong . like a few others . It's awesome .

 

[Spymaster]

It's certainly a highly divisive thread, I believe bimble used the word 'poisonous' earlier and I can agree with that. I'd also go with 'profoundly depressing' ...

Well it all went tits-up when people started trying to win on the internet, and attack the individual rather than attempting to deal with the points being offered.

Surprise surprise.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

As for why the cops' response has been so ineffectual: perhaps there's a ready excuse that dumps it on political correctness. It's bollocks, as it was in Rotherham, but it's a handy (and temporarily useful) excuse for inaction, that for a while appears unassailable.

I think you've got a point there if I understand you correctly.

In Rotherham, my strong impression was that the cops basically didn't give a shit what happened to girls they regarded as 'sluts' pretty much, but fell back on 'ooh we were scared to act due to political correctness' bullshit when they realised that such an internal perspective was untenable in the light of public scrutiny. Trouble is that sort of excuse sounds much more plausible to a racist than it does to a normal person.

The German cops were making what sounded like similar noises after the fact, but we know from various accounts linked earlier in the thread that they regard the street criminals in question as a whole lot of trouble with a low chance of getting a 'worthwhile' result, and we may infer from stuff like Oktoberfest that there's a certain level of toleration for drunken sexual assaults at public events.

So quite possibly they're using political correctness as an after the fact justification for being disinclined to act as effectively as they might have done on the night.

 

[Casually Red]

Well it all went tits-up when people started trying to win on the internet and attack individuals rather than attempting to deal with the points being offered.

Surprise surprise.

Nobody likes smug bullies, except fellow smug bullies. Personally I hate them .

 

[alfajobrob]

Nobody likes smug bullies, except fellow smug bullies. Personally I hate them .

Quite - If I had just joined, I'd think you were personally responsible for the Syrian crisis.

 

[bluescreen]

I think you've got a point there if I understand you correctly.

In Rotherham, my strong impression was that the cops basically didn't give a shit what happened to girls they regarded as 'sluts' pretty much, but fell back on 'ooh we were scared to act due to political correctness' bullshit when they realised that such an internal perspective was untenable in the light of public scrutiny.

The German cops were making what sounded like similar noises after the fact, but we know from various accounts linked earlier in the thread that they regard the street criminals in question as a whole lot of trouble with a low chance of getting a 'worthwhile' result, and we may infer from stuff like Oktoberfest that there's a certain level of toleration for drunken sexual assaults at public events.

So quite possibly they're using political correctness as an after the fact justification for being disinclined to act as effectively as they might have done on the night.

Yeah. Although raised with a high regard for the polis, I've grown cynical.

 

[DotCommunist]

Nobody likes smug bullies, except fellow smug bullies. Personally I hate them .

guess you'll just have to stand that civil defense squad down and hang your jackboots up then old boy

 

[Spymaster]

Nobody likes smug bullies, except fellow smug bullies. Personally I hate them .

Well if that lying, shit-stirring, redsquirrel, fuckwit, keeps his nose out, the thread might get back on track now.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Which track is that?

Someone's victory lap?

 

[Casually Red]

Well if that lying, shit-stirring, redsquirrel, fuckwit, keeps his nose out, the thread might get back on track now.

Sadly it's like busses, there'll be another , lying , shit stirring, fuckwit along..oh hold on.

 

[Spymaster]

Which track is that?

That'll be you lot explaining why you think people were sexually assaulted en masse on NYE, rather than just robbed, by the perpetrators of these attacks.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Yeah. Although raised with a high regard for the polis, I've grown cynical.

The problem is, you've got a whole bunch of people with various axes to grind who are just going to lap that 'political correctness' stuff up.

If you look at google, you can see that the racist / conspiraloon parts of the internet were actively ranting about 'refugee rape gangs' and 'left-wing cover ups' for months before the event, so stories like that were readily taken up and amplified by that crowd because it confirmed the stuff they'd been saying to each other beforehand, and by the right wing press because they are predisposed to get worked up about political correctness and by various other groups for various other reasons.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

That'll be you lot explaining why you think people were sexually assaulted on NYE, rather than just robbed, by the perpetrators of these attacks.

Are you claiming that at any time I disbelieved the victim statements and claimed that robbery was the *only* thing that was happening?

If so, produce your evidence ...

 

[Spymaster]

Are you claiming that I disbelieved the victim statements and claimed that robbery was the *only* thing that was happening?

If so, produce your evidence ...

No.

Are you suggesting that is what I am trying to claim in order that you may then accuse me of lying?

If so, get fucked.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Did you see the squiggly thing at the end of my post? That's called a question mark.

 

[Pickman's model]

Of course , you're never wrong . like a few others . It's awesome .

yeh yeh. now, get some kip or you'll be all cranky in the morning

 

[Spymaster]

Did you see the squiggly thing at the end of my post? That's called a question mark.

And what a fucking question!

Pulled straight out of your arse with absolutely no basis in anything that I've posted here.

A transparently dishonest response to what you quoted. Perhaps I should call you a liar.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Oh OK, I get you. I'm happy to cop to misunderstanding you, but you'll notice I did ask rather than assume.

As to the explanation for why a bunch of street criminals suddenly decided to go in for mass sexual assault, I'd be really interested in getting to one instead of doing all this chest-beating tarzan shit quite frankly.

 

[Casually Red]

That's neither here nor there in the grand scheme of who the German right are getting pissed off with. As far as they're concerned refugees are refugees. Syrians and Iraqis just happen to form the majority of those currently seeking safe haven.

I think even that's doubtful though . There'd be a stewards enquiry on that one .

 

[xenon]

Well quite.

Thing is there are only 3 or 4 of them doing this mendacious shit. I'd put money on there being shit loads of onlookers to this thread on Bimble's side, thinking they're being wankers, but staying out of it!

I've agreed with some of the stuff she's posted on this massive thread. Not the strawman stuff. I also don't get this accusation of her being a returner, or a troll. Cheap character assassination I MO. She is clearly neither as far as I can tell.

The rest, is just going around in circles.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Here are some tentative ideas about such an explanation.

First off, I don't think a bunch of guys violently sexually assault a woman because they're lonely and want a girlfriend. If you read some of the horrible shit linked on the Roosh thread or some of the Gamergate stuff, I think you can get a bit of insight into the mind of people who might want to do things like that. That stuff reads like a bunch of very fucked up people having abusive fantasies about power and acting as an echo-chamber for each others justifications of doing so. So what may be happening is a similar mechanism among the street criminal networks from which the majority of perpetrators appear to have been drawn.

Secondly, I'd suggest that there's a kind of crossover between robbing people and demonstrating power over them. Outrage at being sexually assaulted is distracting and hence facilitates robbery, so there's a potential synergy in the other direction too. There are any number of well-documented cases of violent rapists and serial killers who started out doing minor stuff like robbery, got a taste for the power rush and escalated from there. Richard Ramirez is an obvious example but there are plenty more, so what may have been happening is a sort of self-organising mass version of the same escalation.

Thirdly, there are widely circulated videos of stuff like Tahir Square and other accounts of apparently similar behaviour ("Eve teasing" etc) which may have acted as patterns. It's not entirely clear what mechanisms by which such patterning might have occurred would be however and this is an area where it's very hard to sift real evidence from racist right / hasbara propaganda.

Now I'm not claiming that these are the only strands of an account of why a bunch of muggers / pickpockets escalated to sexual assault, but I think each is a reasonable candidate as part of an explanation.