Greek elections

[brogdale]

Accepted that this is Tele/AEP...still pretty depressing...

Greece has vowed to shake up labour markets and push through far-reaching reforms to avert a fresh showdown with eurozone creditors this week, hoping to stave off bankruptcy within days as cash runs dry.

The radical Syriza government submitted a five-page list of measures to EMU officials in Brussels in time for a deadline on Monday, including an assault on trade union powers that risks setting off a revolt by the movement's Communist and hard-left factions.

Failure to reach an agreement would lead to yet another round of crisis talks, backed by the threat that the European Central Bank could at any time cut off emergency liquidity support for Greek lenders and effectively force the country out of the euro.

 

[DotCommunist]

Sandi Toksvig has done two series of it in the last year

yeah but they fucked with the format. It was called 15-to-1 but it wasn't the real deal. I call faux on it

 

[butchersapron]

Come on.

 

[J Ed]

Any idea exactly what the anti-trade union BS is? Depressing

 

[Patteran]

I'd suggest we're seeing a war of position right now - because there hasn't been time to prepare for a war of manoeuvre. Those preparations are hopefully ongoing. Effectively, moving from the Varoufakis position to the Lapvistas one via social mobilisation (for those see here).

Lapavistas responds to today's events with some concrete numbers (if numbers can be concrete?) - it's headlined 'scathing', but it's five specific questions about the impact events will have on Syriza's mandated platform.

 

[DotCommunist]

Accepted that this is Tele/AEP...still pretty depressing...

d'ye recon you could give them a few months to position themselves before unleashing epic riot dog, they've been in charge for five minutes ffs

 

[butchersapron]

Assault on union powers =journalese for a range of things. The unions (KKE control the key ones - the ports and productive areas) are to be split from syriza- KKE from syriza. Or more importantly, a split class.

 

[brogdale]

d'ye recon you could give them a few months to position themselves before unleashing epic riot dog, they've been in charge for five minutes ffs

the dog is dead.

 

[butchersapron]

Lapavistas responds to today's events with some concrete numbers (if numbers can be concrete?) - it's headlined 'scathing', but it's five specific questions about the impact events will have on Syriza's mandated platform.

Here's then the moment of polarisation. Or it may be the splitting off of a left - we need to know what the people are doing/acting/organising.

 

[DotCommunist]

the dog is dead.

I never died, woofed he.

but no, give syzria some chance-wait for it. We are still in bollocks and bullshit stage, we can't start crying 'sell out cunts' this early

 

[danny la rouge]

Long live the dog.

 

[butchersapron]

Let's all wait though.

 

[brogdale]

Let's all wait though.

Yeah, I know...but...the banks open in the morning, (after the 'Clean Monday'), and that's how long they've been given to come up with the banker-acceptable shite. If the Eurobankers don't accept tonight's homework, then the run would be on.

 

[butchersapron]

Yeah, I know...but...the banks open in the morning, (after the 'Clean Monday'), and that's how long they've been given to come up with the banker-acceptable shite. If the Eurobankers don't accept tonight's homework, then the run would be on.

Let's see if the picture painted is true first.

 

[phildwyer]

If I remember right after the collapse of the peso, wiping out people's money - obviously good and revolutionary for them - you ended up with armies of people in major cities collecting cardboard to recycle. 'Cartonistas' or some such.

Why not visit Greece or indeed Spain and check out the people looking in bins right now for food/scrap/paper/card and give them a talking to about how its good for them.

The reason Greeks and Spaniards are going through bins now is austerity, not anti-austerity. Or to put it another way: because of capitalism, not anti-capitalism.

 

[phildwyer]

another useful thread marches toward an inane and boring death

"Useful." Twat.

 

[Diamond]

Yeah, I know...but...the banks open in the morning, (after the 'Clean Monday'), and that's how long they've been given to come up with the banker-acceptable shite. If the Eurobankers don't accept tonight's homework, then the run would be on.

It's not just the "Eurobankers", it's the democratically elected representatives of the Eurozone who decide what to do on the basis of the assessed will of their electorate.

Your "Eurobankers" are analogous to the famous Swabian house-wives.

 

[phildwyer]

Any idea exactly what the anti-trade union BS is? Depressing

The Communist unions would be considered on the "right" compared to Syriza's "left," if the terms still had any validity. The fact that the Communists can be called "right-wing" proves that they don't.

 

[brogdale]

It's not just the "Eurobankers", it's the democratically elected representatives of the Eurozone who decide what to do on the basis of the assessed will of their electorate.

You actually believe that? And no, the eurobankers are not at all analogous to Merkel's Swabian 'housewife' meme; they don't believe in balanced budgets; they live, breath and dream of debt and little else. Debt is their power, and that is used to police the so-called sovereign states.

 

[Diamond]

You actually believe that? And no, the eurobankers are not at all analogous to Merkel's Swabian 'housewife' meme; they don't believe in balanced budgets; they live, breath and dream of debt and little else. Debt is their power, and that is used to police the so-called sovereign states.

That is a truly incoherent post.

 

[Diamond]

Worthy of inclusion on Private Eye's bulletin board parody.

 

[Diamond]

"Great stuff guys!"

 

[brogdale]

That is a truly incoherent post.

OK, suit yourself. If you can't/don't want to defend what you said, then stick with this type of lark, eh?

 

[Diamond]

OK, suit yourself. If you can't/don't want to defend what you said, then stick with this type of lark, eh?

"...they live, breath and dream of debt and little else..."

Absurd.

 

[brogdale]

"...they live, breath and dream and dream of debt and little else..."

Absurd.

No, that's a (mis) quote of what I said. You claimed that..

the democratically elected representatives of the Eurozone ... decide what to do on the basis of the assessed will of their electorate.

and that the actions of financial capital are somehow analogous with the Swabian 'housewives' of Merkel's myth-making.

Care to justify those extraordinary positions?

 

[Diamond]

No, that's a (mis) quote of what I said. You claimed that..

and that the actions of financial capital are somehow analogous with the Swabian 'housewives' of Merkel's myth-making.

Care to justify those extraordinary positions?

Care to define "financial capital" first and explain its direct representation by the Eurozone group?

 

[brogdale]

Care to define "financial capital" first and explain its direct representation by the Eurozone group?

So that's a no, then.

 

[Diamond]

So that's a no, then.

I'm just trying to help but it seems that you prefer to evade.

 

[brogdale]

I'm just trying to help but it seems that you prefer to evade.

Yeah, obviously...I prefer to evade. What an interesting discussion.

 

[phildwyer]

That is a truly incoherent post.

No it isn't. It says that banks lend money to sovereign states, charge them interest, and then use the leverage the loan gives them to ensure they are repaid, by insisting on anti-social policies that contradict the democratically expressed will of the people.

Not even the banks would deny that. And politicians like Merkel are the banks' debt collectors. I doubt if they'd even bother denying that these days, it's pretty damn obvious--and they don't see anything wrong with it anyway. The last bit is the really scary part.