Galloway returns to Parliament in sensational win in Bradford West - Labour/Coalition smashed

[jakethesnake]

Yes, I thought it might be possible to create a Socialist Alliance outside the party, and saw Stop the War/Respect emerge, and even at the height of Blair's unpopularity it wasn't possible to create a viable alternative. I don't see any evidence of why it should be possible in circumstances when *on a national basis* Labour can position itself as the only alternative to the hated coalition. Yes there's unhappiness with Labour, and this is hefty defeat. But it is one by-election.

Can someone please explain why this won't be just another "defeat of Oona King" moment?

Because the Labour Party can't even provide effective opposition against the open goal of the current government. They can't provide effective opposition because they hold, more or less, the same neo-liberal voodoo economics beliefs. People are waking up to this and will vote accordingly when given the opportunity, ie, not for the three main parties.

 

[articul8]

Labour has had embarrassing by-election upsets before without the roof crashing in.

 

[butchersapron]

Labour has had embarrassing by-election upsets before without the roof crashing in.

It's all fine - vote labour. Cheers H.

 

[Pickman's model]

Of course, but we are talking about a credible challenge from the left to Byrne for the elected mayor of Birmingham.

no reference to that in my post or your earlier reply: the hazards of not being at the internet when i'd like to be

 

[Pickman's model]

Labour has had embarrassing by-election upsets before without the roof crashing in.

like one of the bourbons they forget nothing and they learn nothing

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Labour has had embarrassing by-election upsets before without the roof crashing in.

Has it had an upset involving a 37% swing to the left before?

 

[articul8]

that isn't what I said - I'm not even planning to vote Labour myself in the GLA elections! But I can't imagine voting anything else at the General.

 

[articul8]

Has it had an upset involving a 37% swing to the left before?

are you predicting this will be repeated across the country?

 

[Pickman's model]

that isn't what I said - I'm not even planning to vote Labour myself in the GLA elections! But I can't imagine voting anything else at the General.

so you wouldn't inflict them on us in london but you would across the country

what sort of a position is that?

 

[Bernie Gunther]

are you predicting this will be repeated across the country?

That isn't what I said

 

[butchersapron]

that isn't what I said - I'm not even planning to vote Labour myself in the GLA elections! But I can't imagine voting anything else at the General.

I'm in the labour party v i think you should join the labour party. I'm not voting labour btw. Strong message.

 

[Pickman's model]

I'm in the labour party v i think you should join the labour party. I'm not voting labour btw. Strong message.

it's like 1997-2010 never happened. fuck 1752, give us back our 13 years.

 

[Delroy Booth]

It's worth pointing out that in Scotland galloway only got 3% of the vote, beacuse in Scotland there is already a viable left-of-labour alternative for people to vote for, the SNP. In England this massive political vacuum still exists, and Galloway was able to exploit that.

If a clown like Galloway can do it then there's just no excuse for the left. There's a massive potential for some left-wing populism right now, and it's a mood that that Labour would rather crush than build. It's right there for the taking if you ask me.

 

[butchersapron]

That isn't what I said

Is this your first interaction with a8

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Is this your first interaction with a8

Can't recall to be honest.

I do think it's interesting that we're seeing so much denial from both PR wings of the neo-liberal party though, about the uncomfortable implications of the (apparent) fact of a 37% left swing.

 

[articul8]

so you wouldn't inflict them on us in london but you would across the country

what sort of a position is that?

I totally understand people voting for an alternative. I will do so myself. What I can't see is this developing into a national alternative to Labour at a General Election. The electoral system is one key factor here.

 

[Pickman's model]

It's worth pointing out that in Scotland galloway only got 3% of the vote, beacuse in Scotland there is already a viable left-of-labour alternative for people to vote for, the SNP. In England this massive political vacuum still exists, and Galloway was able to exploit that.

If a clown like Galloway can do it then there's just no excuse for the left. There's a massive potential for some left-wing populism right now, and it's a mood that that Labour would rather crush than build. It's right there for the taking if you ask me.

if he was able to really exploit it he wouldn't have been standing in bradford, he'd have won in poplar.

 

[articul8]

There's a massive potential for some left-wing populism right now, and it's a mood that that Labour would rather crush than build. It's right there for the taking if you ask me.

Where that is the case I'll be on the side of those building not crushing. But I think Labour can and must start to shift to the left

 

[Pickman's model]

I totally understand people voting for an alternative. I will do so myself. What I can't see is this developing into a national alternative to Labour at a General Election. The electoral system is one key factor here.

let's put it this way. after everything that happened under the wilson and the callaghan administrations, after everything that happened under blair and brown, after everything that labour has done in local government: what possible fucking reason can there be to vote for them? and saying that 'they aren't the tories' is not a reason to vote for them: that little baby went out the window within a hundred days of blair getting elected.

 

[articul8]

I'm in the labour party v i think you should join the labour party. I'm not voting labour btw. Strong message.

Campaign for a Labour party worth voting for

 

[Pickman's model]

Campaign for a Labour party worth voting for

for fuck's sake

people have been on about that for at least the last 22 years. if so many people have tried, and failed, then what makes you think you'll succeed where better funded and organised and attempts have foundered?

 

[articul8]

let's put it this way. after everything that happened under the wilson and the callaghan administrations, after everything that happened under blair and brown, after everything that labour has done in local government: what possible fucking reason can there be to vote for them? and saying that 'they aren't the tories' is not a reason to vote for them: that little baby went out the window within a hundred days of blair getting elected.

No, I don't think that's true. There isn't anywhere near enough difference between Labour and the Tories. But if you're saying it makes no odds whether Cameron and Osborne get back at the next election I beg to differ.

 

[butchersapron]

Campaign for a Labour party worth voting for

Christ

 

[Pickman's model]

No, I don't think that's true. There isn't anywhere near enough difference between Labour and the Tories. But if you're saying it makes no odds whether Cameron and Osborne get back at the next election I beg to differ.

it does make a difference, of course it does. between someone like ed balls who tries to make out he's your mate while he shafts you and someone who's at least honest about being a cunt.

 

[articul8]

for fuck's sake

people have been on about that for at least the last 22 years. if so many people have tried, and failed, then what makes you think you'll succeed where better funded and organised and attempts have foundered?

UNITE is very well placed to use its dominance of Labour's funding to bring influence to bear. Neoliberalism is discredited amongst wide sections of the Labour vote - who want an alternative to austerity.

People have been talking about developing left of Labour alternatives since the 30s (at least). What makes you think you'll succeed where better funded and organised and attempts have foundered?

 

[articul8]

it does make a difference, of course it does. between someone like ed balls who tries to make out he's your mate while he shafts you and someone who's at least honest about being a cunt.

So you'd rather have Osborne. You must have been well-chuffed at a Thatcher government then?

 

[Pickman's model]

UNITE is very well placed to use its dominance of Labour's funding to bring influence to bear. Neoliberalism is discredited amongst wide sections of the Labour vote - who want an alternative to austerity.

People have been talking about developing left of Labour alternatives since the 30s (at least). What makes you think you'll succeed where better funded and organised and attempts have foundered?

i'm not looking to develop a left of labour electoral alternative.

 

[Pickman's model]

So you'd rather have Osborne. You must have been well-chuffed at a Thatcher government then?

are you thick or something? i said they're both wankers, only one of them pretends to be your mate. a labour government's a bit like being mugged by someone who makes out they're helping you whereas a tory government's like being mugged by a bully. which would you prefer?

 

[articul8]

i'm not looking to develop a left of labour electoral alternative.

ah, OK...so your strategy is for armed proletarian insurrection?

 

[Pickman's model]

ah, OK...so you're strategy is for armed proletarian insurrection?

before we get there i'll settle for smaller goals, like proper english tuition