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Extinction Rebellion

Rupert Read on immigration and Green politics:

We need to move beyond thinking of real economic strength as having anything to do with GDP growth. High levels of immigration create a more divided society, socially and economically, and ecologically weaker and less resilient.

We Greens need to be absolutely and resolutely pro-immigrant - while turning against large-scale immigration.
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If we do not rein in immigration, that means that we are not taking a host of important issues seriously, like: being on the side of working-class Britons; equality; limits to growth; building a sense of society and community; future generations
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High levels of immigration create a more divided society, socially and economically, and ecologically weaker and less resilient
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.

Love immigrants, rather than large-scale immigration

One side of Green politics is this anti immigration stuff. But its not all Greens.

I heard Farage on any questions say he once voted Green.

The Green / environmental movement has many wings. The anti immigration section I don't like at all.
 
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I’m a bit uncertain about the length of this protest being a good thing. There is more than maximum media exposure to an effective protest, in particular if it risks alienating the public.

IMO shorter-lived stunts but held more frequently would achieve similar media exposure while less likely to annoy and inconvenience people to the point where they switch off XR or even dismiss the urgency of their claims, even when they firmly believe there’s a major environmental problem that needs sorting out. In other words, two weeks of chaos that often include massive disruption to bus routes and even the Underground might be too much and not a good idea I reckon.
 
T & P said:
I’m a bit uncertain about the length of this protest being a good thing. There is more than maximum media exposure to an effective protest, in particular if it risks alienating the public.

IMO shorter-lived stunts but held more frequently would achieve similar media exposure while less likely to annoy and inconvenience people to the point where they switch off XR or even dismiss the urgency of their claims, even when they firmly believe there’s a major environmental problem that needs sorting out. In other words, two weeks of chaos that often include massive disruption to bus routes and even the Underground might be too much and not a good idea I reckon.
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they're doing it the wrong way for the right reasons
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Gramsci said:
Rupert Read on immigration and Green politics:





.

Love immigrants, rather than large-scale immigration

One side of Green politics is this anti immigration stuff. But its not all Greens.

I heard Farage on any questions say he once voted Green.

The Green / environmental movement has many wings. The anti immigration section I don't like at all.
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In fairness that’s not an anti-immigration position; rather anti-mass-migration. Very few political ideologies expound unfettered access for immigrants. Even the Green Party immigration policy, probably the fluffiest of the mainstream, isn’t an open borders one. His views are undoubtedly shared by many other ER supporters. Concern for climate change and concerns regarding large scale immigration may not be obvious bedfellows but they’re hardly mutually exclusive.

Inevitably you have a situation among many Extinction Rebellion supporters where the only common ground is climate change. Therefore you have such diametrically opposed views as those of the idiots who patronisingly and damagingly single out “black people and ethnic minorities” for special attention, and the likes of Rupert Read, walking hand in hand down Oxford Street. A fair few nazis are likely concerned about global warming too.
 
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teqniq said:
*unsurprised*

Police seek tougher powers against Extinction Rebellion
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Yes no surprise. I read the letters linked to that article. Good to see John McDonnell and others criticising Met on use of Section 14 and defending right to protest.

For years environmental groups have been trying to bring climate change to governments attention. The Green New Deal was written ten years ago. And ignored.

If XR hadn't blocked roads and taken over for short periods central London the issue would still be largely ignored.

This time I've heard more of the "they've made their point" line of argument. Which means can XR go away so I can drive my car around.
 
I dispute the idea that XR have greatly inconvenienced the public.

Oxford Circus for example. As long as tube isn't disrupted most people weren't inconvenienced by XR occupation of Oxford Circus.

It actually made area more pleasant for pedestrians and cyclists as traffic was reduced in West End.

XR occupation of Bank for a day- City of London had made Bank car free for some time from 7am to 7pm.

I don't think a two week protest about an issue that will endanger everyone's future is unreasonable.
 
Gramsci said:
Yes no surprise. I read the letters linked to that article. Good to see John McDonnell and others criticising Met on use of Section 14 and defending right to protest.

For years environmental groups have been trying to bring climate change to governments attention. The Green New Deal was written ten years ago. And ignored.

If XR hadn't blocked roads and taken over for short periods central London the issue would still be largely ignored.

This time I've heard more of the "they've made their point" line of argument. Which means can XR go away so I can drive my car around.
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I remember being involved in climate change protests back in the early 90s. My eventual decision to stop protesting was based on the way the police were responding in increasingly extreme ways, the press hysteria, the fact that my involvement had come to the attention of my bosses at work, and the fact that my family were worried about me and were asking me to stop too.

Ironically, the job I have now was offered to me because of my involvement in such protests and am currently involved in a campaign to raise awareness of climate change at work.
 
In a successful individualist action Roger Hallam threatened to hunger strike to get his university to disinvest from fossil fuels i believe. Not advocating a mass 'die in' as any sort of solution to the hellish problems coming our way, but it wouldn't surprise me to see a step in that direction.

Working class involvement is necessary to move thing forward, but 'consciousness raising' will be essential first. i'm not convinced that the ABC of climate change = social disaster, likely very soon, is properly appreciated. Are there any initiatives coming along? punchy pamphlets, speaking programs involving celebs etc, targetted at the TU movement and wc communities?
 
Remember the pamplet 'Protest and Survive' from CND? something sharp about the looming catastrophe could be very popular, a mail shot to each home. XR are wealthy.
 
redcogs said:
Remember the pamplet 'Protest and Survive' from CND? something sharp about the looming catastrophe could be very popular, a mail shot to each home. XR are wealthy.
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i always fear that if we show how truly imminent climate change is, and how horrifying the outcome, we drive people into fear and paralysis. There probably is a middle ground where we give hope, but then too much positivity is when people feel that there isn't actually any urgency here - the *it'll be sorted out by politicians and scientists* idea.
 
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