Euro Elections: Who are you most likely to vote for?

[frogwoman]

It's worse than that. No other party would get coverage all day if a little rally was cancelled weeks in advance. No other party gets coverage if they win or nearly win a ward bye-election.

The BBC has a vile fetish for fascism, I keep saying it but this seems structural to the establishment especially in times of crisis.

I wouldn't agree that it has a "fetish" for fascism - most journalists and worekrs for the BBC are prefectly decent people and are just doing their jobs. However I really wish that they wouldn't report on it like this. Don't forget that fascism is not an alternative, it is basically a more extreme, more conservative form of retionary conservatism. It follows the general authoritarian tendency of the state and takes it to an extreme. It doesn't challenge the status quo in any way - and they also grab headlines - a story about fash is bound to sell copy/be popular with readers.

Focusing attention on the BNP also removes attention from the mainstream parties and the policies of the state (many of whom are actually copied from the bnp/far right anyway) and thus distracts/removes attention from it

 

[frogwoman]

The fash lurker would still have to be there in numbers. Which still aint good.

Its hardly a surprise that they post here. if anything im surprised there aren't more. this is one of the biggest left wing boards in the country, there are militant anarchists and people involved in antifa and other forms of direct action here, i suppose their view is that is good to keep an eye on the enemy just as there are plenty of people on here who check s**f**t on a regular basis etc.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Its hardly a surprise that they post here. if anything im surprised there aren't more. this is one of the biggest left wing boards in the country, there are militant anarchists and people involved in antifa and other forms of direct action here, i suppose their view is that is good to keep an eye on the enemy just as there are plenty of people on here who check s**f**t on a regular basis etc.

Good point.

*flicks two fingers at all the BNP tosser lurkers*

 

[sABRE]

/ukip FTW... I dont like the EU superstate, i read through the lisbon treaty and thats enough to put me off... Is simply not democratic and i strongly disagree with big central government.

Localisation not Globalisation say i

 

[kabbes]

/ukip FTW... I dont like the EU superstate, i read through the lisbon treaty and thats enough to put me off... Is simply not democratic and i strongly disagree with big central government.

Localisation not Globalisation say i

Bless.

There are two more of you out there too, you know. You should meet up and have a rally.

 

[sABRE]

Bless.

There are two more of you out there too, you know. You should meet up and have a rally.

lol.... must be more though as they were succsesfull last round

 

[joevsimp]

/ukip FTW... I dont like the EU superstate, i read through the lisbon treaty and thats enough to put me off... Is simply not democratic and i strongly disagree with big central government.

Localisation not Globalisation say i

so say most of the greens intriguingly enough

 

[TremulousTetra]

Didn't the SWP issue a fatwa against their members posting here, on the grounds of internal secretacy/confidentiality after someone reported back from their conference once?

no

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Just what would the Greens do if elected?

Return Britain to traditional values ...

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Unfortunately I don't decide their policies ...

Otherwise some nice fat bankers would be crackling over a wicker fire ...

 

[joevsimp]

yep, Fred Goodwin should make a worthy sacrifice to the Gods

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

so say most of the greens intriguingly enough

This is the thing. The Green can't be as definitively anti-EU as UKIP by definition, but are certainly more skeptical than the bigger 3 and PC/SNP (whose case rests on "independence" under the EU)

It's not uniformly the case but GP of england and wales is more skeptic than most EU Greens. So am I, and like sABRE the Lisbon doublespeak is the last straw for me. There is no way in hell we should sign up to anything more till at least the commission is audited. They have the appearance of being institutionally corrupt, they use doublespeak. They cant be trusted.

This is not to say it couldnt be improved rather than us pulling out. But funnily enough it is the Parliament we are voting for which needs more powers over bodys like the Council of Ministers. The EU is profoundly undemocratic.

What happened to the stuff about "subsidiarity"? Nowhere. The exact opposite has happened. But for all this Im not really for pulling out, at least not for now. But no more powers to the elite, more from elite to directly elected reps, and try to reverse neoliberalism.

 

[Gmart]

What happened to the stuff about "subsidiarity"? Nowhere. The exact opposite has happened. But for all this I'm not really for pulling out, at least not for now. But no more powers to the elite, more from elite to directly elected reps, and try to reverse neoliberalism.

I agree. We should have subsidiarity enshrined in a European Constitution. I can't think of anything which would need to be different for me than anyone else in Europe. We are humans and should have a well thought out list of rights and wrongs to live by, which reflect the world we live in.

The more free and open we are, the better.

Unfortunately any change of the EU to this end is seen as supporting it, and with the world as it is we seem keener on throwing up gated communities and going back to an island mentality.

I share your apprehension about the neoliberalism, but I am also unhappy at the other parties who seem to preach 'control' of the people rather than 'trust'. With lip service at most to say about freedom and quality of life.

 

[lewislewis]

I'm fairly skeptical about the EU but I like the broader idea of 'Europe' and the free movement of people. I'm not confident enough to advocate a platform of withdrawing from the EU because I think it would mean an end to those things- and the parties that want to withdraw from the EU are mostly bonkers.

I don't think they're any more/less corrupt than the Westminster parliament.

 

[goneforlunch]

I'm fairly skeptical about the EU but I like the broader idea of 'Europe' and the free movement of people. I'm not confident enough to advocate a platform of withdrawing from the EU because I think it would mean an end to those things- and the parties that want to withdraw from the EU are mostly bonkers.

But not as bonkers as parties that want to stay in the EU.

I don't think they're any more/less corrupt than the Westminster parliament.

I think you should read this report which came to light after Lib Dem, Chris Davies refused to sign a confidentiality agreement and leaked some of the details.

Still think the same way?

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

I'm fairly skeptical about the EU but I like the broader idea of 'Europe' and the free movement of people. I'm not confident enough to advocate a platform of withdrawing from the EU because I think it would mean an end to those things- and the parties that want to withdraw from the EU are mostly bonkers.

I don't think they're any more/less corrupt than the Westminster parliament.

Thing is Lewis, Westminster corruption is at least OUR corruption, more localised and more potentially accountable. As you will recall, the referendum on a Welsh Assembly was only passed very very narrowly but I think it has become a fairly well accepted institution. There is a similar psychology, it it turned into a mess at least it would be OUR mess, not in a nationalist way but in a localised democratic way.

 

[Isambard]

OUR Westminster corruption?
Jesus, next it will be support OUR boys in Iraq or respect OUR royal family.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

OUR Westminster corruption?
Jesus, next it will be support OUR boys in Iraq or respect OUR royal family.

Perhaps you are deliberatley misunderstanding. Corruption sucks. The more remote the source of corruption, the more it sucks. ETA: I specifically said it was not a question of nationalism

 

[Isambard]

But some stuff is better dealt with at a European level.
And in terms of humand rights and social legislation, what is coming out of the EU is far better than what Westminster is doing.

Critic of the EU as an institution yes, without wrapping oneself in the Union Jack or for that matter any other national or regional flag.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

"But some stuff is better dealt with at a European level."

Ideally, if they can be trusted. Eco legislation is the example often brought up.
But the EU is now fundementally a neo liberal capitalist project ahead of anything else.


"And in terms of humand rights and social legislation, what is coming out of the EU is far better than what Westminster is doing."


This only highlights how disgusting our government are, put in the shade by that lot.

Critic of the EU as an institution yes, without wrapping oneself in the Union Jack or for that matter any other national or regional flag.

Dont need to wrap up in a flag to denounce corruption, doublespeak and anti-democratic practices. Relative localism is one of the best solutions to this problem.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

the EU is now fundementally a neo liberal capitalist project ahead of anything else.

Yes it is, but give me EU-style capitalism, influenced as it is by the likes of Germany and France, over the neo-Thatcherite British variety any day.

 

[Isambard]

Again, "our" government?

It's certainly not mine. It happens to be the government of the state of which I'm an on paper citizen of.
I didn't vote it, I find its legitimacy more than questionable and it belongs in the dustbin of history.

I'm certainly NOT a fan of the EU which is why if I vote, not sure yet, I'll be voting for an EU critical list.

Anyway, thanks for the reminder to contact my local favoured candidates cos as I'm a foreign and speak Vibrant I help them out sometimes with translations of their manifestos and leaflets.