Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion

[Kaka Tim]

I don't think that Labour would have been any better.

This is unprecedented, no government in pretty much living memory has had to deal with something like this.

There are a huge number of unknowns, and it is inevitable that as knowledge grows, government advice and action will change. That isn't something to be critical of, what would deserve criticism is not responding to increasing knowledge.

Any previous government would have done the same as all the other european countries have done - testing and wide ranging restrictions and following WHO advice. Thats whats so glaring about the actions of these murderous fucking clowns

 

[planetgeli]

One of the top 'liked' comments btl in the Guardian live blog at the moment ('JamesinDerbyshire') states we are not far short of needing martial law and that looters should be shot on sight.

A reminder.

Looters, so far, 0.

Hoarders, so far, many hundreds of thousands.

This governing in a crisis lark is a piece of piss.

See.

Net government approval rating hits highest level since 2010, poll suggests

Andrew Sparrow

Voters are more likely to approve of the Boris Johnson and the government’s handling of the coronavirus outbreak than disapprove, according to some new polling from Ipsos MORI. Some 49% of people think the government is handling it well, against 35% who think it is handling it badly (a net rating of +14), and Johnson’s rating are 47% v 38% (a net rating of +9).

 

[bimble]

the idea of 20K troops arriving in London on the eve off lockdown just for cross services / civil purposes is a tough one to swallow

Thugs smash doors of London Sainsbury's as capital approaches lockdown

A gang of thugs smashed a Sainsbury's shop front in south London in a nighttime raid as supermarkets come under huge pressure amid coronavirus fears (pictured, crime scene).

www.dailymail.co.uk

Agree with your point but that link in the Dm is about a few blokes trying and failing to nick some booze in elephant. Dont think thats got a lot to do with the bug or the army tbh.

 

[Grace Johnson]

have we had any reminders about avoiding socialising? any official social media stuff? a poster? cos i have seen nothing. If they aren't shutting pubs and cafes etc - they could at least give some advice on "safer" socialising - and point out that things like karaoke at not a good idea right now. And are bingo halls still running? Its bizarre. Is it "herd immunity" on the quiet?

Bingo halls and casinos still going. Everyone under the age of about 50 have stopped going and they are all full of older folk who don't want their routines disrupted. At least here anyway. One of my friends is one of the older folk who still insist on going

Cinemas and some restaurants shutting here though.

 

[Grace Johnson]

I’d take Gordon the Gopher even - fucking anyone other than this shower of shite.

I laughed but in a dark, fuck it all kind of way because your right.

 

[elbows]

Any previous government would have done the same as all the other european countries have done - testing and wide ranging restrictions and following WHO advice. Thats whats so glaring about the actions of these murderous fucking clowns

No, all the european countries had about the same approach as the UK, up until recently. Which is not surprising, because they still share basically the same pandemic protocols.

This is why most of them are starting to experience their own epidemics. If some of them had taken a very different approach from the start, they might be in a situation more akin to South Korea right now. But no, most countries went down the same old path, ignored the lessons from China and elsewhere.

The containment phase of EU countries was not a genuine attempt at total containment, it was just like the UKs approach. Only once epidemics have started to emerge in their individual countries have they started to abandon the orthodoxy, think the unthinkable and lock things down far more substantially. The main UK difference is that we tried to carry on with the orthodox approach for a bit longer, and we had the weird spectacle of the public burning of the orthodoxy via awkward political and public health communications failures. And then the UK gov decided to stick with some of the language from the orthodox approach, even when a u-turn had clearly happened. So despite the Imperial College report going on about needing to switch to the suppression strategy, we are still going on about pushing down on the curve, which is same language as used in the previous delay/mitigate approach. But in other areas, some of the specifics do suggest we have switched to a suppression strategy, and its down to the detail of measures and timing as to whether we do that properly or not. Issues relating to testing of healthcare workers, and getting everyone on the front lines the PPE they need, are some of the areas where the UK will likely find itself in the spotlight in the coming weeks. A proper switch to a suppression strategy requires test capacity we havent got yet, and the mistakes most countries made during the 'containment' phase means we cannot dodge the first wave of trouble for the healthcare system, no matter what we do now. Any strong lockdown measures taken now will take some weeks to show their effect on hospital burden, and in the meantime we, like other countries in europe, will have to try to cope with the consequences of doomed orthodox thinking in January and February.

 

[Kaka Tim]

But when other european countries decided to act - they seeked to have all gone for a decisive tactic of containment - whilst the UK is all over the place. And we had more warning than many countries.

 

[belboid]

ha yeah, the only family colour on Whitty is that his dad was obviously a spook, and involved in stuff heavy enough to get dead for it.

dad was probably wrongly targeted, he'd just bought his car from from an MI6 officer.

Whitty's main problem is that he looks far too like Chris Grayling, and therefore always freaks me out when he comes on TV.

 

[andysays]

Johnson reckons "we can turn the tide in 12 weeks. I'm absolutely confident we can send the virus packing in this country"

Glad to hear he has it all under control now...

 

[elbows]

But when other european countries decided to act - they seeked to have all gone for a decisive tactic of containment - whilst the UK is all over the place. And we had more warning than many countries.

Yes I'm not defending our approach, I just feel bound to describe the more universal orthodox thinking that set the scene in all these countries.

And there is information overload in this scenario, we probably arent getting a full sense of the picture in some countries.

For example, the widespread closure of schools in various european countries was an obvious difference in policy (and/or timing) compared to the UK. But France then proceeded with a local election, with Macron going on about how democratic life needed to be preserved.

And Germany, although some of their measures have gone further than the UK already, are still attempting to pull something off that is less than a full lockdown. Some aspects of it do remind me of the UKs approach, although there are already signs that compliance isnt high enough and they will feel the need to go further soon:

https://www.thelocal.de/20200318/coronavirus-is-germany-heading-towards-a-full-lockdown

Although some places are undoubtedly quieter, the hustle and bustle continues in many streets, parks and cafes across the country. And it begs the question: is Germany doing enough by trying to reason with people to encourage social distancing?

Or will the government look at more extreme measures such as forced quarantine or curfew (Ausgangssperre) currently being used in nearby countries Italy, France and Spain?

They even have their own version of 'we will do things our way in this country':

"We must take the appropriate measures for Germany," said Schmidt-Chanasit. "The health system, the structures, the cultural backgrounds are different."

In contrast, Lars Schaade, Vice President of the RKI, said "anything that puts distance between people is good."

 

[bimble]

Watching Johnson now, "please please please follow the advice" thats it basically.

oh. Temporary morgues being set up across UK amid rising Covid-19 deaths

 

[killer b]

dad was probably wrongly targeted, he'd just bought his car from from an MI6 officer.

lol right.

 

[elbows]

I've not watched todays UK press conference yet but just to finish off my point in regards Germany, here are some things Merkel said yesterday, spot the similarities?

Merkel calls Coronavirus biggest challenge since WWII – DW – 03/18/2020

In an extraordinarily rare nationwide TV address, German Chancellor Angela Merkel has called on citizens to do their part in helping to overcome the COVID-19 outbreak. Germany is now one of Europe's hardest-hit states.

www.dw.com

"The situation is serious. Take it seriously. Since German unification, no, since the Second World War, there has been no challenge to our nation that has demanded such a degree of common and united action," she said.

"I truly believe that we will succeed in the task before us, so long as all the citizens of this country understand that it is also THEIR task," she said. "I also want to tell you why we also need YOUR contribution and what each and every person can do to help."

Merkel had previously said that up to 70% of Germany's population of roughly 83 million people could eventually be infected.

Anyway I'm aware that this is a UK thread but I did want to point out the similarities, not just the differences. And Germany at this current moment is probably the best example I could find. I'm done with this point now, cheers.

 

[planetgeli]

Watching Johnson now, "please please please follow the advice" thats it basically.

Almost.

What he said was 'we can beat this in 12 weeks' if 'you all follow the advice'.

Politics for 'when this isn't beaten in 12 weeks, I can blame you lot'.

And for this he has a 49% approval from the public apparently.

Cunt. And cunts.

 

[sheothebudworths]

Johnson reckons "we can turn the tide in 12 weeks. I'm absolutely confident we can send the virus packing in this country"

Glad to hear he has it all under control now...

I thought the silence from the other two after he said that, while he desperately cast about to get them to take over and save him confirm it, said loads. They looked pretty horrified.

Pretty fucking pointless that, all round - fuck all of use, just focusing hugely on the potential for the new test. That's obvs great but is not here yet, while there are already immediately pressing problems that need addressing - lack of PPE for NHS staff and job losses etc.

 

[brogdale]

Very upbeat, wasn't he?

 

[belboid]

lol right.

he was a British Council bod putting on plays. He might well, of course, have been a spook as well, but I am pretty sure that, unless you know any other details, Abu Nidal was rather more likely to target an MI6 bugger than him.

 

[blameless77]

This might help people who have been laid off from pubs and restaurants: British supermarkets draft in army of temps to 'feed the nation'

 

[Teaboy]

Yeah, my mate who is a copper in London has heard nothing about city wide shut downs or anything like that which was definitely happening according to this site yesterday. He did mention about the morgues though.

 

[baldrick]

So hundreds of thousands of people are in the process of losing their jobs and livelihoods. Surely to god there's a way of a) giving these people a job they desperately need and in the process b) increasing the capacity of the NHS and their suppliers

Is it just me that thinks there might be a solution here if only we had a competent and forward thinking government that acted rapidly?

 

[redsquirrel]

But when other european countries decided to act - they seeked to have all gone for a decisive tactic of containment - whilst the UK is all over the place. And we had more warning than many countries.

One of the leaders of PD was telling people there was nothing to fear and encouraging them to behave normally, the Spanish government was ok with large marches going ahead, the French had elections in the middle of the outbreak. The39thStep has outlined what's been happening in Portugal. I think the decisiveness of other European countries is not really true. If there was any decisiveness it was probably in Central Europe with countries jumping on this opportunity to shut borders.

 

[SheilaNaGig]

It's delusional fuckwits obsessed by their own, imagined - and mistaken - importance.

Which kind of sums up London tbh....

Yeah, thanks for that.

I’m not bothering to cite examples to prove this is rubbish. But it really really is total bollocks.

 

[klang]

I've not watched todays UK press conference yet but just to finish off my point in regards Germany, here are some things Merkel said yesterday, spot the similarities?

regardless of everything else, Merkel held her speech under the banner of Anarcho-Syndicalism, so there is hope.

 

[weltweit]

Where did I read this?

in 2016 (I think) in London there was a simulated training event, for emergency services, which simulated a virus attack on the UK. There were lessons learnt as a conclusion. One of the key lessons was that Britain did not have nearly enough ventilators.

But it seems no remedial action was taken.

And now I hear in their desire for the manufacture of ventilators that JCB and car makers have been mentioned. Would you really turn to a heavy machinery manufacturer or a car producer to produce medical equipment to medical standards? Especially when there are volume ventilator manufacturers in Ireland whose output could be increased by the application of skills and resources. I would start with existing manufacturers, aiming to find ways to increase their output significantly, then also other makers of medical equipment who already have clean room medical manufacturing in place.

 

[ska invita]

Was this the lockdown thread? Looks like it's been merged? Can someone confirm? I think it was worth having a thread specifically on that topic. This is now on several topics simultaneously.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Yeah, I'd imagine that we'll see them doing pretty much what they're doing in Italy, Spain & France

Others places may be culturally used to the sight of troops on the street. Here in the UK we aren't. Londoners aren't spooked cos they think they're special...people are rightly spooked at the prospect of the army being on the streets, even in a support role because it underlines the seriousness of the situation. It is unnerving to many and would be to those from other places in the UK too if they were facing this reality. It draws on many associations and it's absolutely normal to feel uncomfortable and a bit anxious about it.

 

[Supine]

Where did I read this?

in 2016 (I think) in London there was a simulated training event, for emergency services, which simulated a virus attack on the UK. There were lessons learnt as a conclusion. One of the key lessons was that Britain did not have nearly enough ventilators.

But it seems no remedial action was taken.

And now I hear in their desire for the manufacture of ventilators that JCB and car makers have been mentioned. Would you really turn to a heavy machinery manufacturer or a car producer to produce medical equipment to medical standards? Especially when there are volume ventilator manufacturers in Ireland whose output could be increased by the application of skills and resources. I would start with existing manufacturers, aiming to find ways to increase their output significantly, then also other makers of medical equipment who already have clean room medical manufacturing in place.

You can't get non medical device manufacturerd to make ventilators for a huge number of reasons. Including iso13485 accreditation, design master files, company quality management systems, quality control standards, procedures and personnel and performance validation. It's just desperate measures from an idiotic government that could kill patients easily if not done properly.

 

[Steel Icarus]

Others places may be culturally used to the sight of troops on the street. Here in the UK we aren't. Londoners aren't spooked cos they think they're special...people are rightly spooked at the prospect of the army being on the streets, even in a support role because it underlines the seriousness of the situation. It is unnerving to many and would be to those from other places in the UK too if they were facing this reality. It draws on many associations and it absolutely normal to feel uncomfortable and a bit anxious about it.

I remember going to Rome in May 2002 and being quite unnerved seeing armed forces at the airport and outside. Especially as they looked like they weren't shaving yet.

 

[LeytonCatLady]

Possible cure according to researchers at Queensland University. Fingers crossed.

Researchers set to begin clinical trials on potential coronavirus treatment

Queensland researchers are set to begin clinical trials of a potential treatment for COVID-19 – using two existing drugs.

www.uq.edu.au

 

[ruffneck23]

we had a meeting earlier and due to the nature of my job, we were told to send in our details , passport number etc so we can get a letter from the govt , to show , to prove we are allowed out and about.

It maybe precautionary but the fact it was even said was a bit mad