Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion

[littlebabyjesus]

Fully agree, it very much feels like being seen to do something. I'm not sure about the exercise thing, I've been out walking for the last 3/4 days, mainly in the afternoons. There are probably more walkers/joggers/families on bikes and sometimes it's quite difficult to get more than a pavements's width away. Hard to say if that's risky or not. But yeah, on the wider point I'd prefer to see more effort to get existing measures working properly. That's not just stopping idiots acting as if nothing had happened it really is about getting a mindset out there. TBH, at the moment, the shops and supermarkets are the riskiest areas of life in the UK, for shoppers and, even more so, staff. To make real changes in terms of the layout of shops, improving online services and getting more vans/drivers is very 'logistical', but is probably the one single thing government could do to make a difference.

Thing is we don't yet know how well existing measures are working. We can know that they have reduced social contact massively already. We can't know if reducing it a bit more by being draconian will make much more difference. The govt could stop treating people like idiots and try explaining the time lag between effective social distancing and the numbers coming under control.

 

[Wilf]

In about 10 years, just as johnson decides to go and spend more time with his families, there'll be a report finally coming out after being long grassed for 3 or 4 years. Somehow, written as it will be in civil service language, it will manage to say they got every fucking thing wrong without blaming anyone in government.

 

[DaveCinzano]

Looks like we are heading for a stricter lockdown:

Boris Johnson to warn UK: tougher lockdown may be necessary

Outbreak will get worse before it gets better, PM tells nation as death toll hits 1,000

www.theguardian.com

Our hand shaking PM will be writing to us.

Prick will probably lick the envelopes too

 

[agricola]

I'd like to see the evidence base for a stricter lockdown, tbh. Stopping construction, etc, sure, that's going to reduce social contact, but stopping people going for walks? Is that going to add anything? This was always going to get worse before it got better even where social distancing measures are working. We've known that for a while now. Getting tough now strikes me as mostly about looking tough as the numbers get bad rather than actually making a material difference. There was too little early on, now there's a danger of too much too late.

Indeed, and we will probably see a much more effective lockdown as the death rate spikes anyway.

 

[weltweit]

For me, working from home, the greatest risk of infection has to be shopping for food.

But for others that can't work from home I imagine their risks are partly from food shopping and also from mixing with people in the workplace. I know many employers are trying to enforce the 2m social distancing but that does not cater for the possibility of picking up the infection from surfaces.

A tighter lock down could be stopping non essential working at workplaces.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Partly about being seen to be doing something, definitely. Partly perhaps fear that we're going to end up as bad as Italy. But if we do end up as bad as Italy, that will be due to decisions taken weeks ago. Nothing done now can change that. Something else they're hardly likely to be honest about.

 

[xenon]

From that Guardian article.
"33%) think there should be a ban placed on all public transport."

Stupid fucking cunts. Not realising how many NHS staff, social carers, supermarket workers etc have to use public transport.

 

[weltweit]

..
Stupid fucking cunts. Not realising how many NHS staff, social carers, supermarket workers etc have to use public transport.

In Wuhan they stopped public transport and instead got volunteers to drive medical staff to hospitals.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

In Wuhan they stopped public transport and instead got volunteers to drive medical staff to hospitals.

Don't want to sound too London-centric, but there is zero chance of that working in London. atm when I've been out for walks, I've seen very empty buses with people sitting nowhere near one another. Not been near the tube so I can't say how that is, but the buses are not so bad.

And I can only really repeat the question - how much difference would such a measure make? test-trace-isolate is still the best strategy here. They're still only testing 5,000 a day I believe. This is mostly just deflection from their serial failings.

 

[xenon]

In Wuhan they stopped public transport and instead got volunteers to drive medical staff to hospitals.

Yeah and supermarket workers social carers? Did they do all that or just leave vunrible housebound people to starve?

It's bullshit.

Stop construction workers having to travel to build cunt hutches by supporting zero hour contracters and self employed now, not in June.

 

[xenon]

Sorry I'm a bit sensitive about this as some of my dad's carers in greater London get the bus.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Sorry I'm a bit sensitive about this as some of my dad's carers in greater London get the bus.

Yep there is a real risk to people from measures for a tougher lockdown. And for what benefit on top of what there is? Around London atm a very large proportion of the people on the streets are construction workers. That needs to change first.

 

[SheilaNaGig]

Apparently, blood group seems to be a factor in susceptibility and symptomology.

The paper has not yet been peer reviewed though.

"The results showed that blood group A was associated with a higher risk for acquiring COVID-19 compared with non-A blood groups, whereas blood group O was associated with a lower risk for the infection compared with non-O blood groups. This is the first observation of an association between the ABO blood type and COVID-1"

Relationship between the ABO Blood Group and the COVID-19 Susceptibility

The novel coronavirus disease-2019 (COVID-19) has been spreading around the world rapidly and declared as a pandemic by WHO. Here, we compared the ABO blood group distribution in 2,173 patients with COVID-19 confirmed by SARS-CoV-2 test from three hospitals in Wuhan and Shenzhen, China with that...

www.medrxiv.org

Coronavirus: are people with blood group A really at higher risk of catching COVID-19?

There’s no need to panic if you are in this blood group.

www.google.com

 

[weltweit]

Apparently, blood group seems to be a factor in serious symptomology.
..

Yes, I remember reading about this. Very interesting.
And of course now I can't remember what my own blood group is

 

[two sheds]

Apparently, blood group seems to be a factor in susceptibility and symptomology.

The paper has not yet been peer reviewed though.

"The results showed that blood group A was associated with a higher risk for acquiring COVID-19 compared with non-A blood groups, whereas blood group O was associated with a lower risk for the infection compared with non-O blood groups. This is the first observation of an association between the ABO blood type and COVID-1"

Relationship between the ABO Blood Group and the COVID-19 Susceptibility

The novel coronavirus disease-2019 (COVID-19) has been spreading around the world rapidly and declared as a pandemic by WHO. Here, we compared the ABO blood group distribution in 2,173 patients with COVID-19 confirmed by SARS-CoV-2 test from three hospitals in Wuhan and Shenzhen, China with that...

www.medrxiv.org

Coronavirus: are people with blood group A really at higher risk of catching COVID-19?

There’s no need to panic if you are in this blood group.

www.google.com

I saw that but someone pointed out that the Chinese go a bit over the top with blood groups. I'm blood group A and year of the snake for example:

Strong Points: They are stable and upright, sometimes heroes in other people’s eyes. They have sufficient patience and persistence. As long as the goals are set, they will try their best to fulfill them. They are bold and capable in work, and they are always the people who come up with new ideas. Good at inspiring people to work together, they can easily stand out in career circle. With acute sense for chance and broad horizon, their talk is full of humor and wit, which can touch other people easily.

which is uncannily accurate as it happens

 

[xenon]

Yep there is a real risk to people from measures for a tougher lockdown. And for what benefit on top of what there is? Around London atm a very large proportion of the people on the streets are construction workers. That needs to change first.

Yep, it's a fucking joke. Whilst people are being told not to go to parks, quite rightly IMO, that those companies employing people to build luxury apartments, hotels are implicitly told to carry on.

 

[xenon]

How do you know what blood group you are anyway, is it on your birth certificate?

 

[SheilaNaGig]

I saw that but someone pointed out that the Chinese go a bit over the top with blood groups. I'm blood group A and year of the snake for example:



which is uncannily accurate as it happens

I'm a snake too! A wood snake.

But blood groups are science. Biochemistry. Well, haematology. But anyway not philosophy or metaphysics or theory.

So if they're finding that cases are skewed amongst blood groups that could give a clue to a way to interfere with the way the virus attaches to cell proteins.

But it's one study, not peer reviewed, so might not be useful at all.

 

[SheilaNaGig]

How do you know what blood group you are anyway, is it on your birth certificate?

Not in the UK. You have to either ask when they check you before having surgery or donate blood, or pay to get a test.

 

[gosub]

In about 10 years, just as johnson decides to go and spend more time with his families, there'll be a report finally coming out after being long grassed for 3 or 4 years. Somehow, written as it will be in civil service language, it will manage to say they got every fucking thing wrong without blaming anyone in government.

Exercise Cygnus uncovered: the pandemic warnings buried by the Government

Exercise Cygnus dramatically exposed the gaps in Britain’s pandemic response but its ‘terrifying’ findings have yet to be published

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[farmerbarleymow]

How do you know what blood group you are anyway, is it on your birth certificate?

I got mine when I donated blood - common as much O for me.

 

[Wilf]

Exercise Cygnus uncovered: the pandemic warnings buried by the Government

Exercise Cygnus dramatically exposed the gaps in Britain’s pandemic response but its ‘terrifying’ findings have yet to be published

www.telegraph.co.uk

paywall, but i got the gist.

 

[editor]

 

[Part-timah]

Should have locked then in for 2 weeks.

 

[emanymton]

From that Guardian article.
"33%) think there should be a ban placed on all public transport."

Stupid fucking cunts. Not realising how many NHS staff, social carers, supermarket workers etc have to use public transport.

How much do you want to bet every singe person in that 33% has a car?

 

[wayward bob]

Looks like we are heading for a stricter lockdown:

Boris Johnson to warn UK: tougher lockdown may be necessary

Outbreak will get worse before it gets better, PM tells nation as death toll hits 1,000

www.theguardian.com

Our hand shaking PM will be writing to us.

when we all return to sender he'll never be able to dig his way back out of downing street, right?

 

[Azrael]

I'd like to see the evidence base for a stricter lockdown, tbh. Stopping construction, etc, sure, that's going to reduce social contact, but stopping people going for walks? Is that going to add anything? This was always going to get worse before it got better even where social distancing measures are working. We've known that for a while now. Getting tough now strikes me as mostly about looking tough as the numbers get bad rather than actually making a material difference. There was too little early on, now there's a danger of too much too late.

Worse, if could fuel a backlash that sees the whole thing called off prematurely.

See that even the Sunday Boris (nee Telegraph) has articles kicking the govt for ignoring warnings that the NHS wasn't ready for a pandemic, alongside a Jeremy Hunt op-ed demanding mass testing. His libertarian groupies loathe this, and won't be giving him his usual fawning.

 

[bimble]

The bit quoting Jeremy Hunt's piece published in the telegraph surprises me. he is saying mass testing & contact tracing is the way to go . Is he saying that because that is the plan?

"The restaurants are open in South Korea. You can go shopping in Taiwan. Offices are open in Singapore,” Hunt wrote. “These countries learned the hard way how to deal with a pandemic after the deadly Sars virus. They now show us how we can emerge from lockdown..
“Where you find it, you can isolate and contain it,” Hunt wrote “And where you don’t [find the virus], vital services continue to function. With mass testing, accompanied by rigorous tracing of every person a Covid-19 patient has been in touch with, you can break the chain of transmission.”

Is he speaking out of line there or is this the gov line ?

 

[brogdale]

The bit quoting Jeremy Hunt's piece published in the telegraph surprises me. he is saying mass testing & contact tracing is the way to go . Is he saying that because that is the plan? I am confused.

"The restaurants are open in South Korea. You can go shopping in Taiwan. Offices are open in Singapore,” Hunt wrote. “These countries learned the hard way how to deal with a pandemic after the deadly Sars virus. They now show us how we can emerge from lockdown..
“Where you find it, you can isolate and contain it,” Hunt wrote “And where you don’t [find the virus], vital services continue to function. With mass testing, accompanied by rigorous tracing of every person a Covid-19 patient has been in touch with, you can break the chain of transmission.”

Is he speaking out of line there or is this the gov line ??

AFAICS he's ostensibly speaking for himself as chair of the H&SC select committee, but in reality it shows the depth of his resentment at rejection by the party and the degree of his delusion about his future chances. Very much not Johnson.

 

[killer b]

The bit quoting Jeremy Hunt's piece published in the telegraph surprises me. he is saying mass testing & contact tracing is the way to go . Is he saying that because that is the plan?

"The restaurants are open in South Korea. You can go shopping in Taiwan. Offices are open in Singapore,” Hunt wrote. “These countries learned the hard way how to deal with a pandemic after the deadly Sars virus. They now show us how we can emerge from lockdown..
“Where you find it, you can isolate and contain it,” Hunt wrote “And where you don’t [find the virus], vital services continue to function. With mass testing, accompanied by rigorous tracing of every person a Covid-19 patient has been in touch with, you can break the chain of transmission.”

Is he speaking out of line there or is this the gov line ?

Hunt isn't in government - hes been critical of their response and calling for more widespread testing for weeks