Car owners in routine outbreak of extreme selfishness

[8ball]

It not that we know it wouldn't work, we just don't care. The power is with us and the private car ownership lobby so we can just ignore everything you say and take the piss.

It's good to get this sort of thing out in the open.

 

[Spymaster]

Did you think you'd changed that quote just enough to obscure the source?

It's well known enough to defy obscuration. Say what you like about her but she knew a thing or two about transport.

 

[teuchter]

Unless I’m missing something, the only part of your strategy that deals with that aspect is the following:



Yeah, I’ll keep the car thanks. The wife will keep hers too. Appreciate the offer, bye.

Yup, you selectively quoted so as to miss out the bit that explained it would not be more expensive than at present. But you want to keep your cars all to yourselves, I get it. I know what I'm up against.

 

[8ball]

It's well known enough to defy obscuration.

And it was over 30.
By 40 you should have a chauffeur, loser.

 

[ignatious]

Yup, you selectively quoted so as to miss out the bit that explained it would not be more expensive than at present. But you want to keep your cars all to yourselves, I get it. I know what I'm up against.

It’s not the money, it’s the hassle. We live a 20 minute walk to a bus stop, we live up a very steep hill, we have two kids who go to different schools, I’m self employed and need a vehicle for work and my wife drives to the station and commutes into London every day. Life under your system would be a logistical nightmare.

 

[teuchter]

It's just like Americans getting in a panic about any moves to move away from their bonkers private healthcare system. It's the same thing. If it had never been the case that a privileged majority of people owned their own transport, didn't have to share it with anyone and could use it at will on publicly funded infrastructure to the point where millions of people sit stuck in traffic jams every day, our car dependent culture would seem just as nuts as the american healthcare system. But that's not where we are, unfortunately.

 

[Spymaster]

And it was over 30.
By 40 you should have a chauffeur, loser.

Chauffeurs are for talentless non-drivers who get lucky. SpookyFrank and teuchter dream of having them every time they buy their lottery tickets.

 

[kebabking]

Yup, you selectively quoted so as to miss out the bit that explained it would not be more expensive than at present. But you want to keep your cars all to yourselves, I get it. I know what I'm up against.

I'm genuinely bemused as to why you're so puzzled that people would be unwillingly to go from a model that is convenient to a model that is inconvenient in order to alleviate a problem that has limited impact on their lives.

What next? Knife crime in London is at epidemic proportions so people in Cumbria should be banned from chopping up onions...

 

[teuchter]

It’s not the money, it’s the hassle. We live a 20 minute walk to a bus stop, we live up a very steep hill, we have two kids who go to different schools, I’m self employed and need a vehicle for work and my wife drives to the station and commutes into London every day. Life under your system would be a logistical nightmare.

Nothing would change except that you wouldn't be the owners of the cars you used, and there would be greater incentive for local public transport to improve. Quite possibly starting with school transport.

 

[teuchter]

I'm genuinely bemused as to why you're so puzzled that people would be unwillingly to go from a model that is convenient to a model that is inconvenient in order to alleviate a problem that has limited impact on their lives.

What next? Knife crime in London is at epidemic proportions so people in Cumbria should be banned from chopping up onions...

Just carry on ignoring the points about the people who don't have access to their own private transport.

But what's the inconvenience? What exactly are you scared of?

 

[8ball]

Life under your system would be a logistical nightmare.

i) You don't really know what "their system" is, there really isn't enough detail.
ii) Even if your current way of life wouldn't be possible, others would. If technology had developed differently you'd likely be going on about how you couldn't survive without your jetpack.

 

[8ball]

What exactly are you scared of?

People spend a lot of money on cars, which lends them a special emotional significance.

 

[T & P]

I had to take my old banger to the garage a few weeks back and had to drive across town between 7 and 8 in the morning (that was the plan at least). Took over an hour to get there - arseholes snarling up junctions because they don't understand what a red light means.

Bloody miserable hour.

Drove back well after rush time - 15 minute drive.

Glad I don't commute (well, not in a car).

I am lucky that I start work late enough to miss the rush hour, but whenever I have had to cycle in early during peak morning rush, rush hour cyclists have always been every bit as aggressive and angry-looking as their car-driving counterparts. Sometimes more so. Perhaps it's a London thing though.

 

[8ball]

I am lucky that I start work late enough to miss the rush hour, but whenever I have had to cycle in early during peak morning rush, rush hour cyclists have always been every bit as aggressive as angry-looking than their car-driving counterparts. Sometimes more so. Perhaps it's a London thing though.

I see some dickish ones, but not many. Everyone in London is angry most of the time.
I'm trying to spend less time being angry. Not sure I picked the best time to be born tbf.

 

[teuchter]

Took until page six before mention of "aggressive cyclists"

 

[teuchter]

People spend a lot of money on cars, which lends them a special emotional significance.

Yup.

It comes from dependence as well, which is exactly what I want to reduce.

 

[T & P]

Took until page six before mention of "aggressive cyclists"

Sorry. I'm clearly a self-loathing cyclist

 

[kebabking]

Just carry on ignoring the points about the people who don't have access to their own private transport.

But what's the inconvenience?

For my trip to work?

1. Walking to the local hub - I live in a village of about 50 houses and a pub, we're about 2 miles from an A road: quite how local do you think my local hub is going to be? At 6.30am, in the pissing rain.

2. Ditching my publicly owned car at Worcester parkway at the same time as everyone else within 10 miles of Worcester.

3. Finding a seat on a train.

4. Changing trains - realistically changing trains 2 or 3 times for my current journey.

5. Picking up my people's chariot at the last station - at the same time as everyone else.

Or, I could just drive and go in one fell swoop - no changing trains, no edging away from the freak with bad BO, no having to find a seat (3 or 4 times), no having to listen to other people's choice of music.

Even you can (probably) see that one of these is vastly more inconvenient than the other...

 

[Proper Tidy]

Yup.

It comes from dependence as well, which is exactly what I want to reduce.

Out of interest, would these shared cars have baby seats fixed in back? Trying to figure out if parents would have to cart a baby seat with them everywhere, alongside the pushchair and changing bags, or whether this would be taken care of, resulting in every vehicle having a reduced capacity regardless of whether people need the baby seats or not

 

[8ball]

Out of interest, would these shared cars have baby seats fixed in back?

The foldable car would have a module you could download.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

if the population was evened out more across the geography instead of being rammed into shitholes like London then the kind of congestion you complain about would be vastly reduced.

London wasn't rammed when I were young, it's taken gentryfiers coming in such as the OP to make it so rammed full that it's now unpleasant. Odd that I never saw it as a shithole until he showed up either

 

[teuchter]

For my trip to work?

1. Walking to the local hub - I live in a village of about 50 houses and a pub, we're about 2 miles from an A road: quite how local do you think my local hub is going to be? At 6.30am, in the pissing rain.

2. Ditching my publicly owned car at Worcester parkway at the same time as everyone else within 10 miles of Worcester.

3. Finding a seat on a train.

4. Changing trains - realistically changing trains 2 or 3 times for my current journey.

5. Picking up my people's chariot at the last station - at the same time as everyone else.

Or, I could just drive and go in one fell swoop - no changing trains, no edging away from the freak with bad BO, no having to find a seat (3 or 4 times), no having to listen to other people's choice of music.

Even you can (probably) see that one of these is vastly more inconvenient than the other...

Why not just stick with the car, then, which would remain entirely possible?

If transport options changed, or you changed jobs, in the future, you could re-assess whether the car was still the best option, but the capital investment you'd already made in your vehicle would not be part of the calculation.

 

[bimble]

I'd love to not own my car, would be happy to share it and maybe someone else would check the oil & hoover the crumbs out of the seats and all that crap.
But the only reason I got a car was in order to leave London - Its 20 mins drive from home to the nearest "viable transport hub" (train station). There is a bus stop halfway but it's in a tiny smug village where the locals would not be having a car park on the pond.
If your plan is to charge by the mile obviously anyone living in the sticks is penalised whilst its city dwellers like Spymaster who should course be forced out of their cars first, having plenty of other options as they do and just being selfish bastards.

 

[Pickman's model]

London wasn't rammed when I were young, it's taken gentryfiers coming in such as the OP to make it so rammed full that it's now unpleasant. Odd that I never saw it as a shithole until he showed up either

when teuchter arrived london knew it had jumped the shark, as they still said in those days

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

If your plan is to charge by the mile obviously anyone living in the sticks is penalised whilst its city dwellers like Spymaster who should course be forced out of their cars first, having plenty of other options as they do and just being selfish bastards.

tbf he does use the tube, his car is mainly a pleasure thing; intimidating cyclists and hooting the horn outside teuchter's at 4 in the morning.

 

[8ball]

tbf he does use the tube..

On the subject of the tube - it seems no one has tube mates in London.

 

[Spymaster]

I'd love to not own my car, would be happy to share it and maybe someone else would check the oil & hoover the crumbs out of the seats and all that crap.
But the only reason I got a car was in order to leave London - Its 20 mins drive from home to the nearest "viable transport hub" (train station). There is a bus stop halfway but it's in a tiny smug village where the locals would not be having a car park on the pond.
If your plan is to charge by the mile obviously anyone living in the sticks is penalised whilst its city dwellers like Spymaster who should course be forced out of their cars first, having plenty of other options as they do and just being selfish bastards.

It's not about being selfish, it's just a willingness to accept that which has been bestowed upon me by divine right.

 

[Spymaster]

On the subject of the tube - it seems no one has tube mates in London.

There's nothing to stop you carrying them but it would probably be considered a trifle presumptuous and poor form with total strangers on the underground.

 

[ignatious]

i) You don't really know what "their system" is, there really isn't enough detail.

There’s a fair bit: upgraded public transport and, presumably, a massive programme of new infrastructure, and publicly owned cars for private hire. Plenty to go on and dismiss out of hand.

ii) Even if your current way of life wouldn't be possible, others would. If technology had developed differently you'd likely be going on about how you couldn't survive without your jetpack.

Yes, but ‘others’ here would either have to be equally or more convenient than what is currently available to the discerning country dweller, or offer some as yet undisclosed advantage that overrides any loss of convenience for them to be workable.

Anything that involves carrying two car seats plus whatever else I need down a hill (that is unsuitable for buses) with two young kids to get at least one bus to go to a giant car park to borrow a car to drive somewhere, then somewhere else, then park it in another giant car park and get on at least one other bus to somewhere else in all types of weather before I’ve actually arrived at work is not terribly appealing.

 

[kabbes]

With respect to this thread, which is about the problems with people parking on public roads, and whether or not teuchter’s special idea would solve it, can I refer you to this post from teuchter’s special idea thread?

This is part of the reason for the system working best if it's universal. If you have enough cars in the system things will average out so that such a situation would be very unusual. In reality, it wouldn't just be in the station car park; there would be cars parked in lots of streets nearby too. There could be a couple of hundred cars within ten minutes' walk.