That’s a bait and switch. You asked about my preference and then switched to what the nation as a whole is doing. There are many things about the nation as a whole I disagree with. But when it comes to my personal preference, I prefer to eat meat that comes from a known source that I am comfortable with, rather than some laboratory-produced, patented and IP-protected process
Bye bye MEAT! How will the post-meat future look?
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littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Capitalism has produced this horrible thing. Now it is producing another thing to replace it. Don't worry, capitalism will work this time.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
Its not a bait and switch, I asked 'do you think lab meat is preferable to factory farming'? I didn't mention individual consumption habits at all. If it wasn't clear I am talking about preferences for how food is produced.
What a childish total misrepresentation of what I said and refusal to engage with the substance of my points. Utterly pathetic.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
I gave you my answer to your question. The question is way too simplistic to be answered 'yes/no'. Try asking better questions.
Well, if you’re persisting, I guess I need to spell out that I’m also not falling for your clumsy excluded middle.
Either this is a structural question, in which my structural response is that I don’t have to just pick between two bad options. Or it’s a personal question, in which I guess I need to note that I don’t eat factory farmed meat and won’t eat synthetic meat.
Either way, the answer is “neither”, if you insist on one.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
No you didn't, . You snarkily wrote 'Don't worry, capitalism will work this time.' Looking at my prior response to you, do you think its an even remotely fair summary of what I think?
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
I'd try synthetic meat out of curiosity.
I don't cheer on this government's proposal to relax food safety standards in order to boost the synthetic meat industry, though. That's an odd thing to cheer on.
I don't cheer on this government's proposal to relax food safety standards in order to boost the synthetic meat industry, though. That's an odd thing to cheer on.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Hang on. I know you read this post because you replied to it.
Do you perceive the introduction of synthetic meat by this food industry at this time in this political context as having any problems at all? Do you imagine down sides, or is it all just wonderful?
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
instead of posting something irrelevant and dodging my question, do you think 'Don't worry, capitalism will work this time' fairly represents what I said previously?
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
I said this a few posts ago (responding to LBJ): 'I share many - possibly all - of your concerns about lab meat. I wont be buying it.'
I hope that answers your question.
I didn’t ask about your personal consumption
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Your post starting 'Let's go!' shows an extreme political naivety. That's about the kindest thing I can say about it.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
Okay, so you won't answer my question after three requests then. Happy to just throw out what you know to be a total misrepresentation of what I said.
I won't be consuming it, so by definition my concerns about it aren't related to my personal consumption.
No you don't, you could have just ignored the question instead of wasting both our times with your sophistry.
There is a practical issue of political importance here though. Lab meat is on its way. How do we feel about this? Despite you and LBJ deliberately ignoring this, I do share many of your concerns (not really the health one to be honest though) about it. But I genuinely don't see a feasible alternative to replacing factory farming. Of course, meat consumers could just stop eating it, or the government could ban it, just like meat consumers could all go vegan and the government could ban all meat. But is it realistic to think either of things will happen? If yes, if there is a feasible political path in either of those directions, I'm all ears. If you have an alternative - one with a plausible chance of success - let me know. If you don't then the structural dilemma I posed between factory farming and lab meat isn't an arbitrary one. My working hypothesis at this stage is (1) that lab meat offers the best chance for replacing factory farming and my normative claim is (2) that it would be good if it did. If you disagree with (1) and/or (2) state why and we can have a conversation, but there's really no need for you and LBJ to act like cunts about it.
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
In today's edition of "false dichotomy" - Factory farmed meat or industrially manufactured meat substitute..........
Who has said that? The closest is Jeff's lesser evilism but he acknowledges there are other options even though he thinks them unlikely especially under capitalism.
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
They exist under capitalism - no lamb you buy will have been in any way factory farmed in the UK, its not probable for beef, you can find decent pork if you look. Chicken is the only one where you'd have trouble finding a non-intensive bird.
The average farm size in the UK, whilst bigger than elsewhere in the EU is 85ha (210ac).
editor
hiraethified
Which, surely, is something that every balanced and caring person would want to happen eventually. Unless they're big fans of cruelty, suffering and ruthless animal exploitation, of course.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Who is this aimed at? There isn't a single poster here defending factory farming.
I don't think Jeff is ambitious enough. To produce meaningful change requires a lot more than cheering on dubious trade deals with big businesses.
If you ask the wrong questions, you inevitably come up with bad answers.
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
That's one of the things that makes this thread somewhat annoying - nobody had supported factory farming (unless you take my explanations of how the relationship between the poultry and arable industries works has been construed as "support".
I don't think that highly processed industrial food is the answer to anything, especially when it comes to human health. People deserve wholesome, nutritious food.
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Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
This is the quality of debate we currently have on agricultural policy:
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
Not such a bad thing, insomuch as I've never known as many farmers disillusioned with the Tories in my life.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
More torture and abuse on an RSPCA-assured farm:
editor
hiraethified
Fucking scum. And this from a company who say that they are "BRC A GRADE ACCREDITED, RSPCA AND RED TRACTOR ASSURED."
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bcuster
Well-Known Member
more evidence eating flesh is not good for you
www.yahoo.com
Eating red meat twice a week may increase type 2 diabetes risk, study finds
Experts claim latest research from Harvard University adds a greater level of certainty about the link
bcuster
Well-Known Member
One of the biggest drivers of the climate crisis, accounting for a third of the planet’s greenhouse gas emissions, is food production, with meat – particularly beef – at the top of the list.
www.yahoo.com
High steaks society: who are the 12% of people consuming half of all beef in the US?
Beef production is a huge climate crisis driver, and a new study says only a small percentage of the country does most of the eating
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Aquamarine
Well-Known Member
Some old bones for the sausage and burger brigade to pick over.
www.theguardian.com
Ex-officials at UN farming body say work on methane emissions was censored
Pressure from agriculture lobbies led to role of cattle in rising global temperatures being underplayed by FAO, claim sources
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