Bye bye MEAT! How will the post-meat future look?

[WouldBe]

Franken chicken

 

[bcuster]

 

[Funky_monks]

Here is a bit of a deep dive into agriculture, livestock and emissions - whilst I appreciate it is a blog, I believe it's edited by Prof Frederik Leroy. It is also well referenced, as you'd expect:

Livestock and greenhouse gas emissions

 

[Cid]

Yes, Nara has a park where visitors can feed the (sacred-ish) deer. Their numbers grew post war and their populations are really too high for the park to sustain. It only supports that many because of the aforementioned feeding, which also leads them to have nutrition problems, and of course problems associated with semi-domesticated animals. They've had to be culled too. Deer are a problem in Japan; they eat tree bark and low vegetation, encroach on rice paddies etc. That's the reality of poorly managed large herbivore populations.

 

[nuffsaid]

 

[WouldBe]

 

[CNT36]

View attachment 385483

How shit.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

The raw foodist and fruitarian movement has nothing to do with veganism really. There's no concern for the environment or animals. It's largely a hotbed of orthorexia and fad diet scams.

 

[zedr]

This thread has reminded me of this article by Simon Fairlie (lol at the unfortunate name) about becoming a self sufficient island. Tbh I don’t know how legit it is and obviously things have changed a lot since 2005, but I’m sure someone who knows a bit more could replicate it for now.

https://www.thelandmagazine.org.uk/sites/default/files/can_britain_feed_itself.pdf

 

[Funky_monks]

This thread has reminded me of this article by Simon Fairlie (lol at the unfortunate name) about becoming a self sufficient island. Tbh I don’t know how legit it is and obviously things have changed a lot since 2005, but I’m sure someone who knows a bit more could replicate it for now.

https://www.thelandmagazine.org.uk/sites/default/files/can_britain_feed_itself.pdf

I posted quite a good piece by him in The Guardian somewhere on this thread.

Utterly not convinced by the permaculture figures, especially as regards cereals.

Oh, and these days we import 56% of our food, and our government doesn't actually have a food policy at all.....

 

[zedr]

I posted quite a good piece by him in The Guardian somewhere on this thread.

Utterly not convinced by the permaculture figures, especially as regards cereals.

Oh, and these days we import 56% of our food, and our government doesn't actually have a food policy at all.....

I remember seeing that article when it came out! Good to read that he's influential, hope more ppl start listening.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

Weird framing from the BBC

River Wye: Pollution not caused by farming, says NFU

The river's status is downgraded to "unfavourable" due to poultry farming concerns.

www.bbc.co.uk

See also 'earth not round claims flat earther'. 'Burning fossil fuels does not cause climate change claims Esso'.

River ‘dying’ after farmers lobbied to weaken protections

Exclusive: National Farmers’ Union boasted about months of lobbying to weaken enforcement of environmental regulation

www.opendemocracy.net

 

[8ball]

The raw foodist and fruitarian movement has nothing to do with veganism really. There's no concern for the environment or animals. It's largely a hotbed of orthorexia and fad diet scams.

Looks like anorexia in this case to me.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

There was a thread on here about some grifters claiming to basically not eat apart from occasionally 'tasting fruit'. Those cunts have blood on their hands for this kind of shit.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

Mother pig and her piglets rescued by sanctuary feel grass for the first time after being kept in a concrete pen for three years

Mother pig and her piglets feel grass for the first time after being kept in a concrete pen for three years

This is the moment a mother pig and three of her piglets felt grass, sunlight and fresh air for the first time. The pig and her three piglets were allegedly kept in a concrete pen as the mother was kept alive for breeding - with most of her young slaughtered. The footage recorded on the 25th of...

uk.news.yahoo.com

 

[bcuster]

Mother pig and her piglets rescued by sanctuary feel grass for the first time after being kept in a concrete pen for three years

View attachment 387324

Mother pig and her piglets feel grass for the first time after being kept in a concrete pen for three years

This is the moment a mother pig and three of her piglets felt grass, sunlight and fresh air for the first time. The pig and her three piglets were allegedly kept in a concrete pen as the mother was kept alive for breeding - with most of her young slaughtered. The footage recorded on the 25th of...

uk.news.yahoo.com

I love stories like this. Thank you for posting it.

 

[iona]

Can you not start a separate thread for the aaw cute animals stuff so we can keep this one on topic?

 

[bcuster]

 

[WouldBe]

If you can't find a "aww, cute animals" thread you could always start one.

 

[bcuster]

If you can't find a "aww, cute animals" thread you could always start one.

animals saved from unnecessary death

 

[iona]

Can't see whatever that was meant to be

 

[Pickman's model]

Yes, it's not like I've posted up hundreds of peer reviewed scientific journal articles or anything like that.....

As we've seen posting up lots of stuff doesn't necessarily prove your point, if it did editor would have won this argument hands down

 

[bcuster]

 

[editor]

As the world burns....

The “gigantic” power of the meat and dairy industries in the EU and US is blocking the development of the greener alternatives needed to tackle the climate crisis, a study has found.

The analysis of lobbying, subsidies and regulations showed that livestock farmers in the EU received 1,200 times more public funding than plant-based meat or cultivated meat groups. In the US, the animal farmers got 800 times more public funding.

The money spent on lobbying the US government by meat producers was 190 times more than for the alternatives and was three times higher in the EU. The researchers also found that almost all dietary guidelines avoided highlighting the environmental impact of meat production and bans on alternative products using terms such as “milk”.

Cutting meat consumption in rich nations is vital to tackling the climate crisis. Livestock production causes 15% of all global greenhouse emissions. Cutting meat and dairy consumption also slashes pollution, land and water use, and the destruction of forests, with scientists saying it is the single biggest way for people to reduce their impact on the planet.

“The power of the animal farming sector, both in the US and in Europe, and the political influence they have is just gigantic,” said Prof Eric Lambin, who conducted the study with Dr Simona Vallone, both at Stanford University, US.

The researchers concluded that “powerful vested interests exerted their political influence to maintain the system unchanged and to obstruct competition created by technological innovations”.

Lambin said: “We found that the amazing obstacles to the upscaling of the alternative technologies relates to public policies that still massively fund the incumbent system, when we know it’s really part of the problem in terms of climate change, biodiversity loss and some health issues.

‘Gigantic’ power of meat industry blocking green alternatives, study finds

Analysis of EU and US shows livestock farmers receive about 1,000 times more public funding than plant-based and cultivated meat

www.theguardian.com

and...

The US and EU paid £35bn of subsidies to meat and dairy farmers between 2014 and 2020, compared with just £33m of public spending on plant-based alternatives.

US and EU accused of undermining climate pledges with massive multi-billion-dollar meat and dairy subsidies

Livestock farmers received overwhelmingly higher public funding than plant-based protein firms, hindering progress in combating climate change. Urgent intervention and proportional subsidies are necessary, say academics.

www.edie.net

 

[editor]

People need to eat less meat and stop making excuses.

Having big UK meat-eaters cut some of it out of their diet would be like taking 8 million cars off the road.
That's just one of the findings of new research that scientists say gives the most reliable calculation yet of how what we eat impacts our planet.

The Oxford University study is the first to pinpoint the difference high- and low-meat diets have on greenhouse gas emissions, researchers say.
The meat industry said the analysis overstated the impact of eating meat.

Prof Peter Scarborough, of Oxford University, who led the new research, told BBC News: ''Our results show that if everyone in the UK who is a big meat-eater reduced the amount of meat they ate, it would make a really big difference."
"You don't need to completely eradicate meat from your diet."

Eating less meat 'like taking 8m cars off road'

A new Oxford University study pinpoints for the first time how high- and low-meat diets impact the planet.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Karl Masks]

IT's a shame then that you vegans do fuck all to help people move away from meat, instead of hectoring and trying to shame people. You constantly ignore the fact that for some a vegan diet isn't possible or practical.

 

[klang]

'You Vegans' lol

 

[sealion]

As the world burns....

We keep on consuming and consuming,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, it's like certain parts of the world are living in a period of decadence. Everything on tap at the press of a few buttons and fuck the consequences. Over consumption of everything, a materialistic, throw away society that have been conditioned to consume, dump, replace and repeat. We could all go vegan tomorrow but it ain't gonna stop the world burning when large parts of society are conditioned to having the latest mod cons, tech, clothes, cars etc, fast food delivery services that comes with exhaust fumes and all that lovely plastic that we can't dispose of properly. I like and admire your sentiment but it ain't the consumption of meat that's going to finish us off.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

IT's a shame then that you vegans do fuck all to help people move away from meat, instead of hectoring and trying to shame people. You constantly ignore the fact that for some a vegan diet isn't possible or practical.

Funny response to a report showing that our economies are rigged in favour of the meat industry, if anything, it’s meat eaters, via their institutional power, who are shoving their believes down vegans’ throats! We are forced to fund - through our taxes - pigs being gassed, baby chicks being ground up alive and the sexual reproductive slavery of dairy cows because of you lot.

Also, research suggests that one of the barriers to people going vegan and maintaining vegan diets is social stigma and social pressure from family, friends and colleagues;

Veganism, Stigma, And You - Faunalytics

Going vegan carries social stigma that can make it an uncomfortable process. In this blog, we explore social pressures related to being vegan, and how they overlap with other forms of stigmatization.

faunalytics.org

Perhaps you have data showing vegans exercising their social and economic power to strong-arm unwilling meat consumers into being vegan? I wait with baited breath.

As for your ‘practical and possible’ point, well that’s literally baked into the official vegan society definition of veganism:

“Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose”

So yes, veganism is for everyone. There are some people for whom a fully plant-based diet isn’t possible - Inuit communities for example. There are others for whom it isn’t practicable, people struggling to feed themselves and their families at all can’t afford to restrict where they get their calories from. The reason most people in the UK aren’t vegan though is either because they don’t want to be or because they lack a basic grasp of nutrition.

 

[Karl Masks]

Funny response to a report showing that our economies are rigged in favour of the meat industry, if anything, it’s meat eaters, via their institutional power, who are shoving their believes down vegans’ throats! We are forced to fund - through our taxes - pigs being gassed, baby chicks being ground up alive and the sexual reproductive slavery of dairy cows because of you lot.

Also, research suggests that one of the barriers to people going vegan and maintaining vegan diets is social stigma and social pressure from family, friends and colleagues;

Veganism, Stigma, And You - Faunalytics

Going vegan carries social stigma that can make it an uncomfortable process. In this blog, we explore social pressures related to being vegan, and how they overlap with other forms of stigmatization.

faunalytics.org

Perhaps you have data showing vegans exercising their social and economic power to strong-arm unwilling meat consumers into being vegan? I wait with baited breath.

As for your ‘practical and possible’ point, well that’s literally baked into the official vegan society definition of veganism:

“Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose”

So yes, veganism is for everyone. There are some people for whom a fully plant-based diet isn’t possible - Inuit communities for example. There are others for whom it isn’t practicable, people struggling to feed themselves and their families at all can’t afford to restrict where they get their calories from. The reason most people in the UK aren’t vegan though is either because they don’t want to be or because they lack a basic grasp of nutrition.

It wasn't intended to address that specific post, as I suspect you know. But to address the overall proposition o fthis entire discussion: people should stop eating meat. Or do you think that isn't what this thread is about