ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
Why don't they also print stickers of other things Helen Hayes did or didn't vote for. It's hardly showing solidarity, is it?
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CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
I can't see why Helen Hayes is picked out for following the party whip.
The problem is the Labour Party's ultra cautious policy stances these days - and not only on Gaza.
It wouldn't be that surprising if Sir Starmer thought tent sleeping was a lifestyle choice in the UK - as well as Gaza!
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
She's the one not showing solidarity
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
With whom?
With what is morally right.
then vote for it..
It's not my fault Helen Hayes and many other Labour MPs do not have the courage of their conviction. My vote has had nothing to do with this.
the fact you loose you job / title / role still boggles my mind, how can that be! What should really happen is party leadership should just take the view / decision regardless of the "vote" and be transparent. Its not a vote in any way shape or form.
I'm clearly way too out of touch with the political machine
I'm clearly way too out of touch with the political machine
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
On a closer note my Cllr Rachel Heywood got kicked out by the party machine for actually representing her constituents in my ward. Leaving me with two loyalists who put party first.
Having to deal with these people grinds me down. I try my best. But the party machine thing is imo , after experience of dealing with it, a form of management.
Its not that you are out of touch. Its that the whole party machine thing goes against imo representation of the people by the people.
totally agree, it feels like smoke and mirrors.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
It was actually worse than that. Their was a gagging order to stop internal discussion of Gaza in local parties.
Of course Starmer says he had no knowledge of this. But he would wouldnt he. This is the man who made ten pledges and then backtracked on them.
Confusion as Keir Starmer 'disagrees with Labour's Gaza gag order'
KEIR Starmer has said Labour members SHOULD be allowed to discuss the war between Israel and Hamas – despite party high command banning branches…
What is interesting to me is that the mainstream media have been portraying Starmer as this strong leader.
Gaza comes along and it all fell apart.
So many rebelled that he could not get rid of all of them.
TBF I think my MPs stance on this has been pathetic.
This was the moment she could have shown local people she stands for something.
And she sat on the fence.
This is the whole problem with Right and centre right of party. She loathed Corbyn. He's gone and what does she do? Sit on fence when Israel is bombing Gaza. Pathetic imo.
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
Maybe - but the reality is this is a UN matter and it's the government that calls the tune.It was actually worse than that. Their was a gagging order to stop internal discussion of Gaza in local parties.
Of course Starmer says he had no knowledge of this. But he would wouldnt he. This is the man who made ten pledges and then backtracked on them.
Confusion as Keir Starmer 'disagrees with Labour's Gaza gag order'
KEIR Starmer has said Labour members SHOULD be allowed to discuss the war between Israel and Hamas – despite party high command banning branches…www.thenational.scot
What is interesting to me is that the mainstream media have been portraying Starmer as this strong leader.
Gaza comes along and it all fell apart.
So many rebelled that he could not get rid of all of them.
TBF I think my MPs stance on this has been pathetic.
This was the moment she could have shown local people she stands for something.
And she sat on the fence.
This is the whole problem with Right and centre right of party. She loathed Corbyn. He's gone and what does she do? Sit on fence when Israel is bombing Gaza. Pathetic imo.
If you want Helen Hayes to vote against the party whip that's fair enough - but it wouldn't affect the UN security council if she lost her junior Labour spokes job (or didn't).
Do you remember when Lambeth Council declared Lambeth a "Nuclear Free Zone"?
Can't say British Rail paid that much attention when shipping nuclear waste on what is now the Overground line through Brixton.
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
Perhaps she didn't agree with the systematic sexual brutalisation of Jewish women and girls by the invading Palestinian forces.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
So you are smearing all Palestinians with the actions of Hamas.
Btw she says she supports a ceasefire.
I've got her email about this and fyi she didn't say anything like this.
As a human and a Jew myself, I don't think this justified killing masses of innocent people and children.
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
No. I didn’t use the word all. But are you saying it was only Hamas who brutalised women?
The death toll in Gaza is now 20 000 with 70% of that women and children. What exactly are you defending here?
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
See comments above. Seems to be clear
So the targeting of thousands of innocent women and children as reitribution for another terrible act done by others.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
You said Palestinians.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
If I said Jewish forces attacking Gaza I would rightly be told that's no on.
The Same applies for Palestinians
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
So what would you say is adequate sanction for the deliberate and systematic sexual brutalisation of scores of Jewish women and girls?
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
So it wasn’t Palestinians who carried out these atrocities against Jewish women and girls?
editor
hiraethified
Is 14,000 women and children dead not enough for you? What number would you view as suitable retribution? 20,000? 50,000? Or total genocide?
Not the murder of any innocent people. The Israelis are killing civilians, not soldiers.
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
What do you think is adequate sanction then?
editor
hiraethified
You answer first. Manners, and all that.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
In the same way I don't blame Jews for the bombing of Gaza I also don't say Palestinians attacked Israel on 7th October.
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
Classy. Playing party games with sexual assault. You can do better than that…..
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