Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood and LTN schemes - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists

[sleaterkinney]

Not sure what the etc is, but you can set up a website for next to nothing/free. The OneOval lot are using Wix which offers some free websites/hosting.

Most of these group's activities are on FB anyway.

The etc is all the on brand leaflets, Facebook groups, twitter accounts. It does take money to design, print these things.

 

[Gramsci]

Must be Putin funding it.

 

[DJWrongspeed]

I live off Elm Park Road. The traffic is worse it's ever been. It's really noticeable after lockdown. Wish we could have a LTN here if I'm honest. Much of our traffic is just people using it as rat run etc

 

[Jeanette Moo]

The etc is all the on brand leaflets, Facebook groups, twitter accounts. It does take money to design, print these things.

I saw the flyers at the protest, they were being handed out. I don't know if they are a 'pro job' but looking online at the place I got my wedding invites done you can get 20000 printed for under £200 delivered

 

[Loose meat]

Get back to me when there something sensible to respond to.

 

[teuchter]

I live off Elm Park Road. The traffic is worse it's ever been. It's really noticeable after lockdown. Wish we could have a LTN here if I'm honest. Much of our traffic is just people using it as rat run etc

It's a big problem with the timing of this - hard to disentangle congestion which people believe is caused by the LTNs from the congestion that seems to be going on everywhere since lockdown was eased.

 

[editor]

The etc is all the on brand leaflets, Facebook groups, twitter accounts. It does take money to design, print these things.

You're talking to someone who has done all of these things to promote club nights and they really do cost next to nothing. Twitter/FB/Instagram is all free and mass printing is a cheap as chips these days.

I'm not defending them by the way, but the claims that they must big have money backers because they've got online activity and some leaflets printed are all a bit spurious.

 

[Nanker Phelge]

You're talking to someone who has done all of these things to promote club nights and they really do cost next to nothing. Twitter/FB/Instagram is all free and mass printing is a cheap as chips these days.

I'm not defending them by the way, but the claims that they must big money backers because they've got online activity and some leaflets printed are all a bit spurious.

Can get thousands for 10s of pounds....

delivered straight to me evil lair....

 

[Janeernie]

Jeanette. I'm puzzled by this as it doesn't reflect what I've heard. At both of the Brixton protests I was told someone who supported the LTNs being physically assaulted and someones 'despite some unpleasantness which I won't go into' comment on the Brixton Buzz story suggests there was similar this time.

I know this forum is anonymous and has a policy of not revealing identities even if they are obvious, and that's fine.

However, what really puzzles me is why anti-LTN campaigners would need to be anonymous otherwise. None (or at least very few) of the supporters are. There's nothing illegal about objecting traffic schemes and, unless your protest campaign had a conflict of interest with your day job (in which case it should be declared) why would anyone's employer have any concern that someone was objecting to a scheme in their area? If your'e not doing anything unethical or illegal there should be no issue.

But the reality was that some of the anti campaigners have been physically and verbally abusive to people, there have been photos taken and published of peoples homes and their home addresses published online. There have been videos edited to change their meaning and repeatedly posted online by anonymous accounts.

Now that is illegal - that's defamation and harassment.

Posting bad reviews for traders is shitty and that shouldn't happen whether supporting or opposing but only today I've heard one of the Railton supporters has had multiple instances of pizzas sent to their home that they haven't ordered. Given that the supporters are nearly all open about their identities it would be good if you identified who this has happened to as I'd personally like it to stop.

Basically, anyone operating behind an anonymous account because their afraid their employer would have issues with their behaviour needs to have a hard think about how they are behaving.

 

[Janeernie]

The bit you have quoted from BB , was regarding a bug supporter of Railton LTN turning up to the protest on his bike taking pictures , which is acceptable and it’s a free world , but maybe not idea to come into the crowd . There was no violence

 

[sparkybird]

I've ust seen on Twitter that a key local supporter of the Railton LTN has been threatened. It's been reported to the police

 

[Jeanette Moo]

I've ust seen on Twitter that a key local supporter of the Railton LTN has been threatened. It's been reported to the police

Pictures? I don't use twitter

 

[sleaterkinney]

You're talking to someone who has done all of these things to promote club nights and they really do cost next to nothing. Twitter/FB/Instagram is all free and mass printing is a cheap as chips these days.

I'm not defending them by the way, but the claims that they must big have money backers because they've got online activity and some leaflets printed are all a bit spurious.

tbh the OneRailton one and leaflets were so well designed yet tone deaf it's only something an agency could have come up with, it def was not someone local.

 

[editor]

tbh the OneRailton one and leaflets were so well designed yet tone deaf it's only something an agency could have come up with, it def was not someone local.

Again, that's nonsense. It's a piece of piss to create professional looking websites/logos/leaflets from easily available free templates. Or maybe they've got a mate who's a designer. If you want to discredit them, or suggest that they've got big outside funding, pointing out the quality of their leaflets really isn't a productive way to go about it.

 

[Pickman's model]

tbh the OneRailton one and leaflets were so well designed yet tone deaf it's only something an agency could have come up with, it def was not someone local.

no local agencies i suppose. i would be absolutely astonished if there were no professionals in the brixton area who could create leaflets. some of them might even offer their design skills for free. and that's beyond what editor says about ordinary people being able to create well-designed material. what next from you, 'lenin must be hiring bourgeois western artists for his propaganda posters as no russians can paint'?

 

[sparkybird]

Pictures? I don't use twitter

Me neither, I just read it on Mr SBs phone, honestly!

 

[sleaterkinney]

Again, that's nonsense. It's a piece of piss to create professional looking websites/logos/leaflets from easily available free templates. Or maybe they've got a mate who's a designer. If you want to discredit them, or suggest that they've got big outside funding, pointing out the quality of their leaflets really isn't a productive way to go about it.

It could well be, I just think that the way these websites sprang up is shady and doesn’t seem like grassroots efforts to me. I have no solid proof of that but that would be hidden away anyway.

 

[thebackrow]

Pictures? I don't use twitter

Here you go. Someone's also set up an account pretending to be Sarah. This is deeply creepy and unpleasant behaviour.

So I'll ask again, why are the people opposing these schemes worried about their identities being known, or their employers knowing that they are campaigning against the low traffic neighbourhoods if they're not doing anything illegal?

 

[Jeanette Moo]

Here you go. Someone's also set up an account pretending to be Sarah. This is deeply creepy and unpleasant behaviour.

So I'll ask again, why are the people opposing these schemes worried about their identities being known, or their employers knowing that they are campaigning against the low traffic neighbourhoods if they're not doing anything illegal?

So this is the lady that got Pizza?

I think both sides need to grow up. Making it personal doesn't put people off it escalates things and I know there are parody accounts on both sides as someone showed me a parody sites of Onelambeth or Wandsworth? There are likely a few individuals on each side who are instigating this stuff and both sides need come down heavy on them and anyone in their own ranks abusing, ridiculing or any such behavior.

From a personal perspective if I could go back in time a couple of months I would go anonymous. I can have as say and also hide my identity, because there is nothing stopping me doing so and i'm not out to harm anyone. The internet has always been nicknames but if you want to see real support , real peopel they are all on Facebook giving their opinions under their real names, with pictures of their families for all to see.

I can't have letters sent to my employer - even if i've done nothin that stuff gets seen, read, picked up on and actioned. I have a daughter to support and half of our team has already gone because of COVID. No one is hiring and i'm scared by the stories of letters being sent to peoples work. That's just.......no. Just no. That's....I don't have words for my feelings on that.

 

[Loose meat]

So I'll ask again, why are the people opposing these schemes worried about their identities being known, or their employers knowing that they are campaigning against the low traffic neighbourhoods if they're not doing anything illegal?

What's yours, btw?

 

[thebackrow]

I know there are parody accounts on both sides as someone showed me a parody sites of Onelambeth or Wandsworth? There are likely a few individuals on each side who are instigating this stuff and both sides need come down heavy on them and anyone in their own ranks abusing, ridiculing or any such behavior.

From a personal perspective if I could go back in time a couple of months I would go anonymous. I can have as say and also hide my identity, because there is nothing stopping me doing so and i'm not out to harm anyone. The internet has always been nicknames but if you want to see real support , real peopel they are all on Facebook giving their opinions under their real names, with pictures of their families for all to see.

I can't have letters sent to my employer - even if i've done nothin that stuff gets seen, read, picked up on and actioned. I have a daughter to support and half of our team has already gone because of COVID. No one is hiring and i'm scared by the stories of letters being sent to peoples work. That's just.......no. Just no. That's....I don't have words for my feelings on that.

That's not a parody account - that's targeted harassment of a young woman. It's 'I know where you live'. It's trying to scare her.

And I'll ask again - what would anyone write to your employer and say? that "Jeanette Moo was at a protest and held a banner". Your employer isn't going to care. If your'e not doing anything wrong you don't need to hide your identity.

 

[Jeanette Moo]

That's not a parody account - that's targeted harassment of a young woman. It's 'I know where you live'. It's trying to scare her.

And I'll ask again - what would anyone write to your employer and say? that "Jeanette Moo was at a protest and held a banner". Your employer isn't going to care. If your'e not doing anything wrong you don't need to hide your identity.

HR will act on any letter, even if it is to just discuss what it is all about. I spent my youth in HR (don't recommend this to anyone btw), I know everything gets kept, I know even if it's untrue or unfounded it can hold you back or put you next on the list for the chop.

"Dear xyz company, It has come to our attention that one of your employees, JM, is campaigning against a number of local initiatives to provide clean air, reduce deaths [insert words which make you out to be some kind of nazi]. Here are some facebook screenshots of her talking down these schemes and opposing them, rallying others to fight them. I'm sure as you are a company in the healthcare industry you understand the importance of xyz and to have someone in your employ fighting agianst them is seen as very bad for a company of your reputation in the market. It's not the kind of publicity you would want"

 

[editor]

That's not a parody account - that's targeted harassment of a young woman. It's 'I know where you live'. It's trying to scare her.

And I'll ask again - what would anyone write to your employer and say? that "Jeanette Moo was at a protest and held a banner". Your employer isn't going to care. If your'e not doing anything wrong you don't need to hide your identity.

I've had all this kind of crap happen to me in the past - including people writing to companies I was working for - and it's a horrible thing to experience.

 

[Jeanette Moo]

I've had all this kind of crap happen to me in the past - including people writing to companies I was working for - and it's a horrible thing to experience.

It makes me feel sick thinking about it. Sabotaging someone life because they have a different opinion / needs.

The things sent to that lady Sarah. Also sick.

It's on everyone to root out this type of abuse. Don't laugh if you see or hear about these things - tell them it's not needed to win or get yuor point across.

 

[Pickman's model]

If your'e not doing anything wrong you don't need to hide your identity.

 

[editor]

So I'll ask again, why are the people opposing these schemes worried about their identities being known, or their employers knowing that they are campaigning against the low traffic neighbourhoods if they're not doing anything illegal?

Because that's their fucking prerogative and even most children know the dangers of exposing your full identity online to potential trolls, ne'er do wells, weirdos, stalkers etc.

But given your stance on this, why haven't you included your full name and address in your profile here? Got something to hide, eh?

 

[thebackrow]

Because that's their fucking prerogative and even most children know the dangers of exposing your full identity online to potential trolls, ne'er do wells, weirdos, stalkers etc.

But given your stance on this, why haven't you included your full name and address in your profile here? Got something to hide, eh?

No, but I understood this forum was a 'safe space' where there is a somewhat unusual code of effective anonymity even when people do know each others identities. It also has you as a moderator and you're pretty good at monitoring the site and dealing with any bad behaviour.

The issue is where someone has been open about their own identity and someone else has set up an anonymous account which they use to harass/Doxx/threaten/defame on a platform (Twitter) that has a very poor record of dealing with that kind of behaviour. As I understand it the Oval campaigners were doing exactly that and now it seems to have moved on to Brixton as well.

I assume you think that's ok do you ?

 

[sleaterkinney]

Hows it going in Tooting after those planters have been removed?

 

[editor]

I assume you think that's ok do you ?

Why would you assume that exactly?

 

[teuchter]

Hows it going in Tooting after those planters have been removed?

What a surprise, eh.

I hope some folk are out to get some photos of emergency vehicles stuck in the traffic jams. We know that the anti LTN people are terribly concerned about emergency vehicles being delayed so no doubt they'll be urgently thinking of solutions if the removal of the LTNs has proven to be ineffective.