Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood and LTN schemes - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists

[thebackrow]

“Any of their work or anything they campaigned for” you obviously know this person well enough to comment on their professional career.

Merely that all of the attacks seem to go no further that “he’s a racist because of this tweet” - with the forensic abilities of one Lambeth’s loyal supporters who seem to have worked their way through endless council minutes, numerous FOIs, and stolen videos of campaigner meetings if there was anything at all surely they’d be all over it with actual evidence rather than just name calling.

onelambeths highly distasteful attempts to portray resistance to LTNs as some kind of race war - their allusions to apartheid, the Holocaust and to the brixton riots - have been discussed on here before, as have Briggs accusations of eugenics(!). doesnt their Twitter feed continue to use some weird Police brutality picture as a avatar? All seems another desperate attempt to deflect from the evidence that LTNs have a positive impact on deprived communities which have lower car ownership.

 

[edcraw]

I’m just asking him a question about whether he personally condemns those tweets. Its what you asked me on a number of occasions. I’m sure he can answer himself. I seem to have hit a nerve with you though. How about you let him answer

You’ve hit a nerve because I just see you enabling and excusing the worst of your organisation whilst taking no responsibility and adding nothing to our community.

 

[chowce5382]

Merely that all of the attacks seem to go no further that “he’s a racist because of this tweet” - with the forensic abilities of one Lambeth’s loyal supporters who seem to have worked their way through endless council minutes, numerous FOIs, and stolen videos of campaigner meetings if there was anything at all surely they’d be all over it with actual evidence rather than just name calling.

onelambeths distasteful attempts to portray resistance to LTNs as some kind of race war - their allusions to apartheid, the Holocaust and to the brixton riots - have been discussed on here before, as have Briggs accusations of eugenics(!).

So they weren’t racist. You don’t think they were?

 

[thebackrow]

So they weren’t racist. You don’t think they were?

to me they looked like some stupid angry tweets that repeated some common racist tropes. I don’t think that makes the person who made them a racist - surely you’d judge them on their behaviour and the way they relate to and treat other people. I can’t see how you could make that sort of judgement without knowing them.

I could probably make a whole load of baseless judgements about you based on your photo and your job in the (aviation industry?) that might lead me to assume you’re were a posh twat climate change denier. But I’d be an arsehole if I made those sort of assumptions about someone without knowing more about them and their worldview.

 

[sleaterkinney]

So they weren’t racist. You don’t think they were?

With arguments like this and the earlier poor attempt at trolling it's no mystery how they burned through 35k of people's money on a flimsy case - and they want 15k more!. (Plus whatever it cost Lambeth).

 

[liquidindian]

Spoiler: CW: Transphobia

If it's fair game to go rummaging around in someone's Twitter history and draw conclusions, it looks like the treasurer of the One Lambeth Justice campaign was retweeting a whole bunch of ugly transphobic shit a few years ago.

(Is it possible to put images behind spoilers? I'd rather seeing this sort of thing was a choice if possible Figured it out I think!)

 

[edcraw]

I suspect chowce5382 will do another of his disappearing acts for a while.

 

[chowce5382]

With arguments like this and the earlier poor attempt at trolling it's no mystery how they burned through 35k of people's money on a flimsy case - and they want 15k more!. (Plus whatever it cost Lambeth).

So flimsy it’s at the court of appeal on suggestion of the judge who presided over the case.

to me they looked like some stupid angry tweets that repeated some common racist tropes. I don’t think that makes the person who made them a racist - surely you’d judge them on their behaviour and the way they relate to and treat other people. I can’t see how you could make that sort of judgement without knowing them.

I could probably make a whole load of baseless judgements about you based on your photo and your job in the (aviation industry?) that might lead me to assume you’re were a posh twat climate change denier. But I’d be an arsehole if I made those sort of assumptions about someone without knowing more about them and their worldview.

That could be a fair assessment of the person. To me it looked like your classic racist person who doesn’t seem to know they are until they’ve been caught out but you may know the person better than I do. I heard they had to go to some sort of training. Do you think they are less racist now?

 

[edcraw]

I suspect chowce5382 will do another of his disappearing acts for a while.

Or perhaps he’ll just ignore it…

 

[liquidindian]

I suspect chowce5382 will do another of his disappearing acts for a while.

Depends if he can crowdfund "some sort of training" I guess.

 

[chowce5382]

Depends if he can crowdfund "some sort of training" I guess.

For the racist guy?

 

[liquidindian]

For the racist guy?

For the transphobic guy. You.

 

[cuppa tee]

.

 

[chowce5382]

For the transphobic guy. You.

By arguing for respect of the ECHR

 

[liquidindian]

You're going to have to explain that for me, sorry.

 

[edcraw]

By arguing for respect of the ECHR

You’re a busted flush. OneLambeth isn’t really anything

a Facebook group of a couple of hundred active members (most of which prob aren’t in Lambeth)

a fundraiser for a lost cause

a hateful Twitter account.

and an off shoot of a guy campaigning against the council that doesn’t want anything to do with the rest of you lot.

You’ve made no actual arguments about LTNs here only technicalities on their implication and you seem to have no knowledge of your own neighbourhood. Give it a rest

 

[chowce5382]

You're going to have to explain that for me, sorry.

Section 122 of the EA and the ECHR give rights to various groups of individuals. The maim argument I was having with Owen Jones at the time was that everyone, however they chose to identify, has a right to their personal and private life under the ECHR. As such, if you then grant rights hitherto ungraded to a group then there is a chance that you undermine the rights of others. My simple argument was, post me too and having spoken to all the women in my family and a number of friends that they felt very strongly about their personal space away from women who had previously identified as men. My view is that changing rooms (for example) should not be one or another but there should be a third safe space to ensure that the delicate balancing act required under numerous pieces of legislation is respected. Government and local council don’t want to spent the money doing this so they are making society come up with a solution which won’t work for numerous groups of people. This doesn’t seem right or fair.

 

[chowce5382]

You’re a busted flush. OneLambeth isn’t really anything

a Facebook group of a couple of hundred active members (most of which prob aren’t in Lambeth)

a fundraiser for a lost cause

a hateful Twitter account.

and an off shoot of a guy campaigning against the council that doesn’t want anything to do with the rest of you lot.

You’ve made no actual arguments about LTNs here only technicalities on their implication and you seem to have no knowledge of your own neighbourhood. Give it a rest

I know legal technicalities aren’t important to you but there are to the groups they protect. Not sure why you’ve never agreed with that one

 

[chowce5382]

to me they looked like some stupid angry tweets that repeated some common racist tropes. I don’t think that makes the person who made them a racist - surely you’d judge them on their behaviour and the way they relate to and treat other people. I can’t see how you could make that sort of judgement without knowing them.

I could probably make a whole load of baseless judgements about you based on your photo and your job in the (aviation industry?) that might lead me to assume you’re were a posh twat climate change denier. But I’d be an arsehole if I made those sort of assumptions about someone without knowing more about them and their worldview.

Do you know them?

 

[snowy_again]

How do you know it's anyone who is part of onelambeth and it's many different groups?

How are your racist friends doing?

Where have I said it is?

But unless you know something we don’t know, it’s more than likely that it’s been done by someone who doesn’t like LTNs isn’t it? And if you’re that way inclined, you’re likely to follow some of the anti ltns on social media and start copying and escalating the vandalism that gets applauded on their channels.

And I’ve never met Simon Still. I’ve not an LCC member and haven’t been for years.

Do you want to make any more unfounded allegations?

 

[edcraw]

I know legal technicalities aren’t important to you but there are to the groups they protect. Not sure why you’ve never agreed with that one

Like I say you’ve never actually expressed an opinion on LTNs just looking to get rid of them anyway you can - nothing constructive.

How about actually engaging with the community. Have you ever spoken to our councillors?

 

[chowce5382]

Like I say you’ve never actually expressed an opinion on LTNs just looking to get rid of them anyway you can - nothing constructive.

If they are implemented properly and following the law then they are a political decision. That way they will have been put in properly. No point in putting them in unlawfully as you undermine their credibility. I’ve said a number of times that I live in one and there is less traffic

 

[edcraw]

If they are implemented properly and following the law then they are a political decision. That way they will have been put in properly. No point in putting them in unlawfully as you undermine their credibility. I’ve said a number of times that I live in one and there is less traffic

But no actual opinion or solution to the problems of traffic?

 

[liquidindian]

Section 122 of the EA and the ECHR give rights to various groups of individuals. The maim argument I was having with Owen Jones at the time was that everyone, however they chose to identify, has a right to their personal and private life under the ECHR. As such, if you then grant rights hitherto ungraded to a group then there is a chance that you undermine the rights of others. My simple argument was, post me too and having spoken to all the women in my family and a number of friends that they felt very strongly about their personal space away from women who had previously identified as men. My view is that changing rooms (for example) should not be one or another but there should be a third safe space to ensure that the delicate balancing act required under numerous pieces of legislation is respected. Government and local council don’t want to spent the money doing this so they are making society come up with a solution which won’t work for numerous groups of people. This doesn’t seem right or fair.

This is just bigotry, however you dress it up in faux concern.

You retweeted someone baldly stating that trans people are mentally ill. If you believe that Simon Still was right to resign from his campaigning position for racist statements on Twitter, then it's time for you to fall on your sword. I didn't make these rules, you and your friends did.

 

[chowce5382]

But no actual opinion or solution to the problems of traffic?

I think that moving it from one place to another doesn’t work. My road is very quiet now but there are so many people whose lives consist of having more traffic. I was told it would evaporate by now. Real investment in public transport seems to me to be the best solution and true investment in hydrogen planes, cars buses and the infra that surrounds it. I’ve done a lot of work in electric and hydrogen aircraft and what is holding it back it real investment rather than the odd couple of mil here and there

 

[liquidindian]

I realise that this is getting wildly off topic, but I think this is important. chowce5382's post above looks kinda reasonable on the face of it, but there is no "delicate balancing act" here. Trans women are not a threat to cis women, and the idea that predators would be able to use self-ID to infiltrate women's spaces is not borne out at all by the evidence. Mermaids has a good article on this and I suggest, chowce5382, that you read it. I don't care how keen you are to disagree with Owen bloody Jones. It doesn't excuse this.

 

[edcraw]

I think that moving it from one place to another doesn’t work. My road is very quiet now but there are so many people whose lives consist of having more traffic. I was told it would evaporate by now. Real investment in public transport seems to me to be the best solution and true investment in hydrogen planes, cars buses and the infra that surrounds it. I’ve done a lot of work in electric and hydrogen aircraft and what is holding it back it real investment rather than the odd couple of mil here and there

Not sure what planes have to do with LTNs but it’s really not the availability of public transport that makes people drive in London and arguing that shows how little you know about the subject.

The vast majority of people manage very well without using cars for day to day transport.

 

[toblerone3]

This has been a very interesting thread to watch. It seems to have gone beyond the arguments. this is culture wars!!!

 

[edcraw]

Someone definitely wants to turn it into a culture war…



Even more convinced that OneLambeth isn’t really anything, the person that runs this Twitter account is just deranged.

 

[chowce5382]

I realise that this is getting wildly off topic, but I think this is important. chowce5382's post above looks kinda reasonable on the face of it, but there is no "delicate balancing act" here. Trans women are not a threat to cis women, and the idea that predators would be able to use self-ID to infiltrate women's spaces is not borne out at all by the evidence. Mermaids has a good article on this and I suggest, chowce5382, that you read it. I don't care how keen you are to disagree with Owen bloody Jones. It doesn't excuse this.

I realise that this is getting wildly off topic, but I think this is important. chowce5382's post above looks kinda reasonable on the face of it, but there is no "delicate balancing act" here. Trans women are not a threat to cis women, and the idea that predators would be able to use self-ID to infiltrate women's spaces is not borne out at all by the evidence. Mermaids has a good article on this and I suggest, chowce5382, that you read it. I don't care how keen you are to disagree with Owen bloody Jones. It doesn't excuse this.

I ageee that this is not the place. If you read above I wasn’t talking about the women not being attacked (which is the at one end of the scale). I was talking about general comfort including the diverse groups of women we're talking about here from different cultures, backgrounds and religions. There is a balancing act (under the law) and by its nature the Gender Recognition Act will change that balance