I don’t know what you think Gramsci but it feels to me that whilst one Lambeth was something that was cross party, ie both left and right, it’s now splitting down party political lines with one wing trying to change the political cabinet system in Lambeth, anti gentrification etc which I see as left wing and the other wing as very purely anti LTN and more right wing, what do you think?
Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood and LTN schemes - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists
- Thread starter teuchter
- Start date
In his reply Ben Rymer mentions thousands have signed the petition yet only 244 showing on the online one. Maybe they’ve gathered more but thousands is surely a stretch.
These seem like very separate campaigns, neither with much support. I admit I don’t know much about the cabinet system but not sure how a campaign against LTNs, which OneLambeth is, fits into this. Sounds like Ben is trying to usurp the LTN campaign because he has the URL and Twitter account.
These seem like very separate campaigns, neither with much support. I admit I don’t know much about the cabinet system but not sure how a campaign against LTNs, which OneLambeth is, fits into this. Sounds like Ben is trying to usurp the LTN campaign because he has the URL and Twitter account.
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Gramsci
Well-Known Member
I'm not in it so can only guess and read between the lines of what is said in public.
But yes I would say there are two wings. I did see people at the demo last Saturday giving out the newsletter. So it should not be overstated. The lady introducing the speakers was complaining of how this Council was run. So I would say both wings have common ground.
I think arguing for a change in how the Council is run in response to how LTNs have been imposed plus other top down actions like estate regeneration is right.
However its a difficult argument to get across. Its not as snappy as a wannabe Mayor getting on a podium as saying if elected they will get rid of LTNs.
Lambeth can host petitions on its website. For some reason they are refusing to host this petition.
The "left" wing of One Lambeth are correct to see the Cabinet system as part of the problem. Particularly the way its developed in Lambeth.
In a normal state of affairs Cllrs should be able to have leeway to bring up residents concerns. Under the Cabinet system a few Cllrs and senior officers decide what is going to happen. Most Cllrs expected to go along with this.
Ex Cllr Rachel Heywood took up residents concerns over the Council imposed road closures in LJ. Look what they did to her. The Cabinet system is undemocratic.
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Angela Mcfarlane claiming OneLambeth cares about pollution - they don’t. They’re campaigning for the status quo which is already illegal levels of pollution. We have to reduce car journeys and that’s the stated aim of LTNs.
If they really cared they’d campaign for it - expanded ULEZ, road pricing, Greater London congestion charge etc. They’re a pro-motoring lobby group.
If they really cared they’d campaign for it - expanded ULEZ, road pricing, Greater London congestion charge etc. They’re a pro-motoring lobby group.
snowy_again
Slush
So Angela is running the gofundme now with Charlie?
Jesterburger
Well-Known Member
Yes if they cared about pollution they'd fully support the ULEZ extension - but the politicians they invited all oppose the ULEZ extension - Shaun Bailey & Tim Briggs want to scrap it, Farah London wants to exempt all but brand new cars which defeats the object.
The existing ULEZ has made an enormous difference to air quality in central London - huge declines in pollution - so if they really cared about that they would be right behind its extension.
The existing ULEZ has made an enormous difference to air quality in central London - huge declines in pollution - so if they really cared about that they would be right behind its extension.
snowy_again
Slush
editor
hiraethified
I tried twice in the past and I'm done with their shitty fucking FB group.
Not a fan then?
editor
hiraethified
Any group that claims to represent the community but then that arbitrarily bans anyone who doesn't 100% agree with every word of their message can do one.
thebackrow
Considerably more Brixton.
Can anyone confirm exactly what OneLambeth is taking Lambeth Council to the High Court for? It's not clear (to me) from the crowd funder website if it's to remove the LTN's in Lambeth, just the one that the lady (Sofia) is affected by (Railton) or if it's about the lack of consultation. The only thing I can find with any detail is this which says they argue the council did not conduct an equalities evaluation ahead of introducing the Railton LTN in June 2020. If anyone here is involved with the campaign,/one lambeth can you clarify for me?
Woman takes Lambeth Council to court over controversial LTNs
A Lambeth resident is taking the council to court over Low Traffic Neighbourhoods (LTNs) for discriminating against people with disabilities.www.swlondoner.co.uk
ETA I did find this on the onelambeth.co.uk website, but I'm still no clearer as to what it would mean in practice "We have received back the legal advice from our appointed legal team and essentially, we have a strong case to challenge all the ETOs under a single court application. This must be done by Statutory Review which is the normal procedure for challenging Traffic Orders. Unlike Judicial Review this is NOT amenable to Legal Aid so we need to continue to raise funds"
the unpopular peoples front of One Lambeth seem to be putting a lot of faith in their court case. Judical/Statutory reviews seem to be a bit of a weird thing -
the summary here Judicial review process | Richard Buxton Solicitors seems to be a summary of this Governtment guide https://assets.publishing.service.g...attachment_data/file/746170/JOYS-OCT-2018.pdf
Judicial review (JR) is the process of challenging the lawfulness of decisions of public authorities, usually local or central government. The court has a "supervisory" role - making sure the decision maker acts lawfully. It is important to understand that a JR is not a re-run on the merits of the decision but a challenge to the lawfulness of the decision that was made. Note - there is a very similar procedure known as "statutory appeal" which applies to certain types of decision,
It sounds like you challenge the process, not the underlying decision - did someone 'tick all the right boxes', not whether the actual decision/outcome was wrong.
If a JR claim is successful the usual result is that the decision is "quashed" or nullified. In turn this usually means that the decision has to be taken again. In planning cases, this means that the application will be reconsidered having rectified any defects found eg. with EIA or other required information. This can result in exactly the same decision being taken - so victories in JR can be pyrrhic.
That SWLondoner news piece above says
OneLambeth leads the fundraising effort for the legal case, which will be heard on 10th and 11th June. They argue the council did not conduct an equalities evaluation ahead of introducing the Railton LTN in June 2020. An assessment published in August established further data needed to be collected to ensure the policy did not overlook the needs of disabled residents.
So even if they win the council just has to make the decision again. Even the 'Transport for All' report that gets mentioned, and had a load of positive quotes from disabled people in Lambeth, didn't say the LTNs should be removed, just that some parts could be improved. Maybe they end up with a 'blue badge' exemption or maybe just for specific residents with particular needs. My uncle's just got a blue badge because he has lung cancer so can't walk far right now but actually being in a car and driving some distance isn't a problem for him.
And maybe OneLambeth could have got some tweaks for those disabled residents who have specific needs by putting in a reasonable submission to the consultation which will happen at the end of the trial and got the same result as the (best possible) outcome of their legal case. As usual it seems the only people likely to do well out of legal action are the lawyers.
thebackrow
Considerably more Brixton.
Even if they win it sounds like a lot of ppl who've contributed to their appeal are going to be disappointed. Reading right down the fundraiser it says
What do you want to happen?
OneLambeth is campaigning towards having all LTNs declared illegal and a full suspension.
Then we will we actively engage with the Council on measures to identify the real problems with transport in Lambeth and explore joined-up solutions that are rooted in science, data, community consultation, inclusivity, non-discrimination, democracy and strategic planning - as it always should have been done.
but that's not what the legal case would do. There was lots of cheering about the judicial review that was 'won' against TfL but that didn't result in anything changing at all that I can see. I don't think anything was removed or "suspended" as a result. Is that because they are appealing it?
What do you want to happen?
OneLambeth is campaigning towards having all LTNs declared illegal and a full suspension.
Then we will we actively engage with the Council on measures to identify the real problems with transport in Lambeth and explore joined-up solutions that are rooted in science, data, community consultation, inclusivity, non-discrimination, democracy and strategic planning - as it always should have been done.
but that's not what the legal case would do. There was lots of cheering about the judicial review that was 'won' against TfL but that didn't result in anything changing at all that I can see. I don't think anything was removed or "suspended" as a result. Is that because they are appealing it?
snowy_again
Slush
thebackrow TfL won the right to appeal the high court decision on Streetspace* something the judge (and supporters) said wouldn’t happen.
*Streetspace isn’t the same as LTNs
*Streetspace isn’t the same as LTNs
editor
hiraethified
How can OneLambeth claim to be about 'community consultation' when they have a long record for throwing anyone in that community off their FB group if they don't parrot the party line.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
Looks like councillor hypocrisy isn't restricted to London when it comes to LTN's...
Yeah, I think that's because they're appealing. But it seems that if they let black cabs use the bus lanes then that would then comply.
Great summary btw, really helpful.
I’ve been looking at who is contributing to their go fund appeal and apart from a few anonymous donors, it looks like most of of the rest are regular contributions from a fairly small list, some of whom I recognise the names. £30k is a lot of money to lose even if you “win” and like others have said, it might just be symbolic or have limited impact.
thebackrow
Considerably more Brixton.
I'd have expected if they win they would get their costs paid and if they lose I think I saw they are only liable for 5k of the councils costs.
Jesterburger
Well-Known Member
Shaun Bailey cares so much about pollution... that he's been driving around central London in a non-ULEZ compliant bus
www.standard.co.uk
Well done Mums for Lungs for spotting
Revealed: Shaun Bailey’s battle bus breaches London’s toxic air rules
Conservatives pay £300 a day toxic air levy to drive 20-year-old double decker in London
www.standard.co.uk
Well done Mums for Lungs for spotting
snowy_again
Slush
I love the fact his office first tried to claim it was powered by biofuel - figurative bullshit.
snowy_again
Slush
Shaun Bailey cares so much about pollution... that he's been driving around central London in a non-ULEZ compliant bus
Revealed: Shaun Bailey’s battle bus breaches London’s toxic air rules
Conservatives pay £300 a day toxic air levy to drive 20-year-old double decker in London
Well done Mums for Lungs for spotting
It’s not that it’s not just ULEZ compliant, it’s not even LEZ compliant.
sparkybird
ask the bird...
Thanks, that's really helpful and makes sense to me.
Tulster218
Well-Known Member
Oh the irony.
editor
hiraethified
What do you mean?
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
I was on the what's app group for the Lambeth Climate change people's assembly. I left as it got taken over with people posting up all day about how terrible LTNs are. It was winding me up.
As much as I have sympathy with some issues around LTNs I don't want a lot of stuff about it on my FB about it. Already get a bit of it for some reason.
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