Brady's, Brixton (Railway Hotel): history, chat and plans

[story]

It was a very popular rock venue. I went to quite a few gigs there.

Me too.

 

[lordnoise]

I saw bands at The fridge when it was upstairs from the KFC on Brixton Road. That was long before it was in its current location. And I saw guitar bands at The Ritzy when it was a derelict flea pit, and at Prince of Wales before they sold part of it to Pizza Hut.

So rock and guitar music was in Brixton before the early eighties.

And what about The Old White Horse? That was a belting punk/ pub rock venue back in the day.

And don't forget the deep connection between Punk and Reggae.

Of course there was rock and guitar music in Brixton pre 1980 - just not a huge amount of it - probably the same amount as Camberwell that other well known rock and roll area. The Old White Horse Brixton Rd was a non music pub until the very late 80s early 90s. I'm not forgetting the connection between punk and reggae - every Clash gig started with at a few dub tracks and any punk DJ worth their salt played reggae music at some point.

 

[editor]

Of course there was rock and guitar music in Brixton pre 1980 - just not a huge amount of it - probably the same amount as Camberwell that other well known rock and roll area. The Old White Horse Brixton Rd was a non music pub until the very late 80s early 90s. I'm not forgetting the connection between punk and reggae - every Clash gig started with at a few dub tracks and any punk DJ worth their salt played reggae music at some point.

I think you're very much guilty of projecting your own personal opinions and experiences of that time on to the whole of Brixton. Did you ever go to the 121 Centre, for example?

 

[editor]

Of course there was rock and guitar music in Brixton pre 1980 - just not a huge amount of it - probably the same amount as Camberwell that other well known rock and roll area. The Old White Horse Brixton Rd was a non music pub until the very late 80s early 90s. I'm not forgetting the connection between punk and reggae - every Clash gig started with at a few dub tracks and any punk DJ worth their salt played reggae music at some point.

I think you're very much guilty of projecting your own personal opinions and experiences of that time on to the whole of Brixton. Did you ever go to the 121 Centre, for example?

 

[lordnoise]

No however I used to meet some of the members on my travels. Although you make it sound like a drop in centre for all local folk it was only effectively used by a small group of people. I think its important not to paint too rosy a picture of Brixton back then they were very hard times for everyone.

 

[lordnoise]

Of course there was rock and guitar music in Brixton pre 1980 - just not a huge amount of it - probably the same amount as Camberwell that other well known rock and roll area. The Old White Horse Brixton Rd was a non music pub until the very late 80s early 90s. I'm not forgetting the connection between punk and reggae - every Clash gig started with at a few dub tracks and any punk DJ worth their salt played reggae music at some point.

Sorry mate I do remember a period when a landlord experimented with bands and djs down there. Apologies.

 

[editor]

No however I used to meet some of the members on my travels. Although you make it sound like a drop in centre for all local folk it was only effectively used by a small group of people. I think its important not to paint too rosy a picture of Brixton back then they were very hard times for everyone.

Really not seeing where I've supposedly been painting a "rosy picture" here or where you're getting this "drop in centre" bit from.

 

[story]

Sorry mate I do remember a period when a landlord experimented with bands and djs down there. Apologies.

Aye.

And because I was seeing bands in Brixton as much as I was anywhere else (including Camden, Holborn, Hammersmith....), it was no less important as a destination for live music than anywhere else, for me.

But I can't say I recall going to Brady's.

 

[lordnoise]

Really not seeing where I've supposedly been painting a "rosy picture" here or where you're getting this "drop in centre" bit from.

Theres lots talked on here about the (inevitable imo) gentrification of Brixton. Historys a different matter altogether. So - especially on a beautiful day like today in and around Brixton in 2011 - I think its important to remember just how much serious depravation there was in Brixton in the 70s and 80s. Some residents (like myself) chose to be there but the majority had no choice whatsoever and that fact shouldnt be forgotten.

 

[newbie]

I saw bands at The fridge when it was upstairs from the KFC on Brixton Road. That was long before it was in its current location. And I saw guitar bands at The Ritzy when it was a derelict flea pit, and at Prince of Wales before they sold part of it to Pizza Hut.

When it was done up to become Little Bit Ritzy it had a stage and bands played there fairly regularly. Also sold great cake

This whole subthread is a bit weird tbh. The notion that 'disaffected youth' in Brixton were mostly black is all well and good but it airbrushes out the thousands of local squatters, most of whom were white, and many of whom lived, very visibly, in big communal spaces, whole streets or blocks. There were parties, there were gigs, bands played, people were entertained. It's a bit fanciful to imagine that people who wanted music other than reggae had to go to Camden or somewhere.

For completeness I'd also add that for a few years the Brixton Sundown was a fine venue where I saw some great bands, none opf which I can remember

 

[lordnoise]

When it was done up to become Little Bit Ritzy it had a stage and bands played there fairly regularly. Also sold great cake

This whole subthread is a bit weird tbh. The notion that 'disaffected youth' in Brixton were mostly black is all well and good but it airbrushes out the thousands of local squatters, most of whom were white, and many of whom lived, very visibly, in big communal spaces, whole streets or blocks. There were parties, there were gigs, bands played, people were entertained. It's a bit fanciful to imagine that people who wanted music other than reggae had to go to Camden or somewhere.

For completeness I'd also add that for a few years the Brixton Sundown was a fine venue where I saw some great bands, none opf which I can remember

I have a fear of history overplaying the role and exaggerating the predicament of those of who you speak newbie. Intellectuals have a habit of bigging themselves up when they write the history books. Sorry for repeating myself but those times were really all about the crap that the black community went through and I dont care what anyone says Brixton was a shocking place to listen to rock music until The Fridge got into full gear in the late 80s

 

[Mrs Magpie]

How old are you lordnoise? Just wondering like.

 

[editor]

Sorry for repeating myself but those times were really all about the crap that the black community went through and I dont care what anyone says Brixton was a shocking place to listen to rock music until The Fridge got into full gear in the late 80s

The Fridge was in "full gear" way before the late 1980s, attracting the likes of King Kurt, the Eurythmics, Pet Shop Boys, Boy George, Sisters of Mercy, Frankie Goes To Hollywood, New Order and Marc Almond by 1983.

 

[Mrs Magpie]

You forgot the Frank Chickens and also Alien Sex Fiend!

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

You forgot the Frank Chickens and also Alien Sex Fiend!

Oh, Frank Chickens?! Weren't they two Japanese girls who did a comedy act? Or am I getting them confused with someone else?

They played a couple of times at the George IV

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Theres lots talked on here about the (inevitable imo) gentrification of Brixton. Historys a different matter altogether. So - especially on a beautiful day like today in and around Brixton in 2011 - I think its important to remember just how much serious depravation there was in Brixton in the 70s and 80s. Some residents (like myself) chose to be there but the majority had no choice whatsoever and that fact shouldnt be forgotten.

I get the impression you think that only applied to blacks. There were plenty of whites in the area then - working class whites, not the middle classes you have nowadays

 

[Mrs Magpie]

Oh, Frank Chickens?! Weren't they two Japanese girls who did a comedy act?

I wouldn't call it a comedy act. It was singing with added fun.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

I wouldn't call it a comedy act. It was singing with added fun.

But they were two Japanese girls yes?

Have checked it's the same ones and it would seem so.

Well they wree obviously considered comedic enough to play at the Comedy Pit in the George IV in the days when Jo Brand, Eddie Izzard etc. were performing

 

[lang rabbie]

Oh, Frank Chickens?! Weren't they two Japanese girls who did a comedy act? Or am I getting them confused with someone else?

They played a couple of times at the George IV

Fringe arts royalty these days - I surreally caught up with them doing a Chinese New Year show at The Royal Opera House in 2007.

 

[story]

I have a fear of history overplaying the role and exaggerating the predicament of those of who you speak newbie. Intellectuals have a habit of bigging themselves up when they write the history books. Sorry for repeating myself but those times were really all about the crap that the black community went through and I dont care what anyone says Brixton was a shocking place to listen to rock music until The Fridge got into full gear in the late 80s

But Brixton was not, like, some kind of black-only ghetto with no white people.

And what do you mean by "intellectuals"? The people I remember going to gigs with - here in Brixton and elsewhere - were in the main disaffected youth, although we didn't think of ourselves in that way. So far as I know, none of them (us) grew up to be intellectuals. Loads of them died, ended up in prison, joined the Convoy... others slipped into relative obscurity in the suburbs....

And I don't remember Brixton venues being "shocking", no more so than any other place anyway (Clarendon, anyone?).

And I certainly definitely went to gigs with guitar music and white people in Brixton in the late seventies and early eighties.

 

[story]

Originally Posted by lordnoise
Theres lots talked on here about the (inevitable imo) gentrification of Brixton. Historys a different matter altogether. So - especially on a beautiful day like today in and around Brixton in 2011 - I think its important to remember just how much serious depravation there was in Brixton in the 70s and 80s. Some residents (like myself) chose to be there but the majority had no choice whatsoever and that fact shouldnt be forgotten.

I don't think anyone is trying to forget it. But that's not the only thing that was happening. And it was informing the local music scene.

I went to some amazing squat parties down here in the late 70s, one at least with several punk bands playing in a back garden, and rumours flying that The Clash would make an appearance. And black people were at those parties too.

 

[editor]

I went to some amazing squat parties down here in the late 70s, one at least with several punk bands playing in a back garden, and rumours flying that The Clash would make an appearance. And black people were at those parties too.

Indeed. The Cooltan squat that followed on from that scene was always fairly mixed.

 

[Brixton Hatter]

So I went to The Minet Rd archive today to try and find evidence for The Railway Hotel having been a Youngs pub and guess what ? It wasn’t. It did sell Youngs beer though ! I found a file on pubs in Brixton and there was a ‘Real Ale in Brixton 1979’ guide which lists the beers as Youngs Special, Fullers ESB and Bass amongst others. Theres no way that Youngs would have allowed Fullers beer to be sold on its premises so it must have been a privately owned free house. I went to the electoral register to see who lived at The Railway Hotel 20 Atlantic Rd in the period in question and found the names of the Irish couple I remember running it in 79/80 – John and Ann Galloghy (along with the names of other Irish bar staff living there). I was surprised to find that they’d run it since 1969 and before them back to 1965 (I didn’t go further) a series of more Irish names – Dunn, Dooley, Queally and so on – clearly a pub with Irish connections back in the mid 60s.
Given the severely traditional no music Youngs like feel of the pub when I knew it under the Galloghys in 79/80 it is highly unlikely that there was a music club called Bradys there in 1967. Remember too that there was no seperate function room at The Railway - the large area where bands played when it was Bradys was the main lounge bar with no stage.

John and Anne aren’t listed in 1981 so I think they or whoever owned it sold it either after the first riots or perhaps because of the boycott of the pub by Brixtons politicos after the Galloghys banned 2 lesbians who refused to stop snogging in the lounge bar !
In 1982 a bloke called Larry Mutch is listed as living there. Its at this time 81/82 when it may have started being called Bradys. It was bought by an Irish pub company who later bought the Russell Hotel towards Kennington calling it Bradys too. A year later in 1983 Dave Roberts who was my boss when I worked there as student is listed as living there as bar manager. Hes there in 1984 too and I know Dave kept it pretty much the same as the Galloghys did ie. a basic music free boozer for the remnants of the Irish community and the market workers.
In 1985 and 86 Justin Egan lives there which is when I lose touch with the pub. So in reality it can only have been a music venue from 1985 onwards and if the Clash did play there it was with a fag end line up - they definately didn’t play there at their height in the mid/late 70s. Certainly the live gig featured in the film Rude Boy (78/79) cant have been filmed at The Railway and I cant see any other scenes in the film that look like they're filmed in one of the bars.

I revere the music and memory of Hendrix and the Clash as much as anybody - I’m also desperately sad about The Railway Hotels fortunes since it closed but until someone can come up with proof that these two hugely important bands played there surely these myths should be put to one side. Whatever future lies ahead for The Railway/Bradys lets make sure its based on fact not myth.

good work mate

and now the Minet Library is under threat of closing

 

[newbie]

I have a fear of history overplaying the role and exaggerating the predicament of those of who you speak newbie. Intellectuals have a habit of bigging themselves up when they write the history books.

that point might be better made about somewhere like the Notting Hill of the 70s, now remembered for the hippies and then punk but which, like Brixton at the time, had reggae everywhere and a blues in most streets most weeks (or so it seemed).

Sorry for repeating myself but those times were really all about the crap that the black community went through and I dont care what anyone says Brixton was a shocking place to listen to rock music until The Fridge got into full gear in the late 80s

you make it sound as though from the late 80s onwards the 'black community' (whatever that means) didn't go through crap, or maybe it just wasn't all about them anymore because there was rock music to listen to.

 

[past caring]

Certainly the live gig featured in the film Rude Boy (78/79) cant have been filmed at The Railway and I cant see any other scenes in the film that look like they're filmed in one of the bars.

Not true. Much of the live footage in the film was staged - i.e. it wasn't of "real" gigs but of concerts that would never have taken place were it not for the film. I'm not saying it was shot at the Railway, but what you've dug up doesn't rule it out by any means.

 

[lordnoise]

Not true. Much of the live footage in the film was staged - i.e. it wasn't of "real" gigs but of concerts that would never have taken place were it not for the film. I'm not saying it was shot at the Railway, but what you've dug up doesn't rule it out by any means.

I'm sorry past caring but theres no way any of the concerts in Rude Boy were staged at The Railway Hotel when it was filmed in 1978/79. There wasnt a space then that either looked like the ones in the film or that was used for music. The large area later used for music when it became Bradys was the main drinking area of The Railway Hotel. There is a slight chance that some other conversational scenes were filmed there but when I last saw the film it certainly didnt look like it. (Oh Lord with my dodgey memory I'm going to have to watch it through again arent I ?) Because I worked there (briefly) and drank there (not so briefly) I've a good knowledge of what all 3 bars looked like back then. One of The Clashes later line ups may have played there from the mid 80s when it became known as Bradys but sadly and strangely over the years that this has been claimed no one has come up with a year let alone date.

Hendrix at The Railway News

I went to the British Library Newspaper archive in Colindale yesterday (another great facility threatened with closure) to see if I could dig up any info on the Bradys Club mentioned in the Hendrix gig guide (link posted above). According to the guide he played Bradys Club London on Sunday 19th February 1967 after having played at York Uni the night before (and before playing in Bath the following Monday). All the dates on the list check out against those printed in Melody Maker except one - you guessed it - Bradys Club isnt mentioned and all the venues he played on that tour (including Brixtons Ram Jam Club on Sat 4th) are sizeable mainstream venues I recognise except Bradys Club.
I looked at the gig listings in MM during 66 and 67 but couldnt find any mention of a Bradys Club as a venue anywhere in London. The Swan in Stockwells there as a jazz venue and The Half Moons does folk on a Tuesday night but apart from the Ram Jam doing a mixture of black music and blues rock there are no Brixton music venues of any description listed.
I checked the commercial directories for London in 1967 at Minet Rd previously for a Bradys Club but no joy. Bradys Club either didnt advertise in the MM (strange if it could attract a large enough audience to pay for Jimi even then) or it was a small improvised club attached to a pub (like The Railway) that didnt have a commercial entity of its own.
I'm going to contact Rich Dickinson whos fan site the gig list is on to see who put it together. I'm also going to try and find people who knew The Railway Hotel in the mid 60s to see if it had any music connections - any help with this would be much appreciated like wise with any suggestions of how and where to take my research further.

 

[lordnoise]

The Fridge was in "full gear" way before the late 1980s, attracting the likes of King Kurt, the Eurythmics, Pet Shop Boys, Boy George, Sisters of Mercy, Frankie Goes To Hollywood, New Order and Marc Almond by 1983.

Great stuff if you were one of the 10 people who actually turned up to watch Annie. Yes there was rock music played in Brixton in the 70s and 80s but Brixtons very historic and important contribution to popular music during that time was Reggae. Reggae defined Brixton.
Rock was there and good and great at times but it was peripheral.

BTW I dont want to underplay the importance of 121 to those who lived there, worked there and who were helped there. Its importance to Gay people in Brixton and the wider movement is well documented - I'm just not sure they can be used as evidence of a thriving rock movement in Brixton at the time.

 

[editor]

BTW I dont want to underplay the importance of 121 to those who lived there, worked there and who were helped there. Its importance to Gay people in Brixton and the wider movement is well documented - I'm just not sure they can be used as evidence of a thriving rock movement in Brixton at the time.

I've never used the phrase, "thriving rock movement," by the way - that's you disingenuous invention. I've just pointed out that you were incorrect to suggest that the Fridge "didn't get going" until the late 80s when it was already an established gig playing a wide variety of music before that.

I know this because I played there in the early eighties.

 

[story]

Great stuff if you were one of the 10 people who actually turned up to watch Annie. Yes there was rock music played in Brixton in the 70s and 80s but Brixtons very historic and important contribution to popular music during that time was Reggae. Reggae defined Brixton.
Rock was there and good and great at times but it was peripheral.

BTW I dont want to underplay the importance of 121 to those who lived there, worked there and who were helped there. Its importance to Gay people in Brixton and the wider movement is well documented - I'm just not sure they can be used as evidence of a thriving rock movement in Brixton at the time.

I don't think anyone is denying this, lordnoise; but you seem to be adamantly denying - in the face of first hand experience - the importance and relevance of guitar music in and around Brixton at the time.

It was secondary, and perhaps less obvious than other forms of music, but it was there, and it was important. Or at least it was important to those of us who were there.

 

[lordnoise]

I've never used the phrase, "thriving rock movement," by the way - that's you disingenuous invention. I've just pointed out that you were incorrect to suggest that the Fridge "didn't get going" until the late 80s when it was already an established gig playing a wide variety of music before that.

I know this because I played there in the early eighties.

I didnt say you used the word thriving you actually used the word big.

The Fridge started out medium sized venue in the early 80s and got smaller before it found its current home in the failed Ace rock venue around 1984? It took many years before it was attracting the huge 7 day a week crowds it does now - maybe a marker of when rock came to have an importance in Brixton might be when The Atlantic (big reggae sound system pub) became the Dogstar.