I do fear for Avatar if Jefe is let loose on it though 
Can you imagine how scathing he would be 
Can you imagine how scathing he would be
Avatar (James Cameron) [SPOILERS]
- Thread starter The Octagon
- Start date
ChrisFilter
Like a boss.
So my prediction about it being panned but making $$$s was bang on
As others have already said, it's got 89% on rottn tomatoes fom top critics. That's exceptionally high, so very little panning indeed, which makes your prediction bang off
revol68
what, fucking what?
The serious reviews have been very positive for Avatar, I mean I'm pretty certain the Wall Street Journal is a pretty serious publication.
And it's not just the mainstream publications like Empire, Little White Lies rated it highly too.
ChrisFilter
Like a boss.
revol68
what, fucking what?
I do fear for Avatar if Jefe is let loose on it though
Can you imagine how scathing he would be
that's cos he's a middle brow snob, the kind of cunt who rates Wes Anderson.
Mation
real life adventure worth more than pieces of gold
Of those I'd only agree with Pulp Fiction, but reckon Avatar deserves top top marks, despite its flaws.
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
But the serious reviews live it as well
It's a spectacle. Enjoy it a such.
No need to tell me this. I've got a blockbuster movie bar set somewhere nea the bottom of the mid-Atlantic rift
ChrisFilter
Like a boss.
New films always do well on imdb. In fact, I don't bother with imdb for the reviews anymore. Still useful for cast lists though, and filmogrpahies.
The worst thing of all are the forums on IMDB 
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
Internet forums are the worst things in the world, generally speaking.
Yeah I think Urban has fooled me about the wider reality...
Kid_Eternity
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Your arrogance is outstanding. You're literally the biggest tool on the whole internet!
revol68
what, fucking what?
Your arrogance is outstanding. You're literally the biggest tool on the whole internet!
You're the arrogant (albeit ignorant) twat making the snidey comments, comments that certainly convey a sense of 'intellectual' snobbery towards a film that you obviously didn't get.
Eh? I'm not though, I'm not separting things up into 'inner' conflicts that can be compared or contrasted to 'outer' conflicts. But more just looking at how the structuring of experience reflects the ways in which we are in the world, and vice versa. Anyhows....
revol68
what, fucking what?
Well whatever you are doing it castrates the most refreshing and interesting part of the film, it's unqualified side taking, the fact that it draws the battle lines clearly and whilst it allows characters to move between them, they have to move totally themselves.
Yeah and it made for a really good film! I suppose I'm just saying that this premise involves the fantasy that we can get rid of those aspects of our (individual or collective) selves that we feel shameful or guilty about.
revol68
what, fucking what?
See this is where you are turning it into some wanky psyche thing, it's not about that, it's not about guilt or whatever. The military aren't up to their antics because of some sort of mental issues, they are doing it for pure economic compulsion, it is an impersonal juggernaut, it works independent of the whims of the people in it, which is why it was great that he didn't waste time trying to humanise the military side or making them anything but cartoon villians, because in the end capitalism is a cartoonesque villian, it really does strive for total domination, for accumulation for accumulation's sake. It comes down to the fact that their can be no middle ground between, no harmonious synthesis or even temporal balances arising between conflicting interests, it is all or nothing.
Capitalism and the human and environmental destruction it entails can and must be purged, it must be got rid of totally, they aren't guilty parts of ourselves. If we start thinking of the two opposing sides as representing internal parts of our own psyche we completely miss the point.
Cameron has essentially made a millenarian movie and whilst it obviously contains a lot of new age Gaia inspired nonsense, it makes up for it by making clear that there are battle lines being drawn and we will be forced to pick sides.
It is crucially important to pick a side and commit oneself to action, taking a stand or whatever. No of course I don't want Cameron humanising the military and having some nice harmonious relationship between the naa'vi and the invaders, that would likely make for a very boring film. I'm just saying that we can still pick sides without having to turn the enemy into some sort of caricatured cartoon version of everything we can't tolerate about ourselves. Taking a stand, whether it be violent or not, then becomes something inherently tragic, thus curbing the sadistic excesses that result from dehumanizing the other (turning them into objects as opposed to subjects). And my point is that the film presents a somewhat fragmented view of the human condition, reflecting the fluidity of identity in this age, and that I feel this splitting of the self is basically an unheathy thing for us individually and collectively.
revol68
what, fucking what?
But it's not about some shit we can't tolerate in ourselves, to loath capitalism and US militarism isn't born out of some sort of need to externalise something within ourselves, such notions are a lot of liberal wank. I don't want to see Tony Blair hanging by his entrails because of some sort of sublimated self loathing, I want to see it because he is a lying piece of shit who should pay for his sins, it's not like it's some acting out to maks the fact that deep down I really wanted to invade Iraq and Afghanistan.
The role of humanisation in modern 'anti war' films has been fundamentally one of grasping moral victory out of the jaws of defeat, the brutality of war and the crimes US soldiers carry out are played out as American tragedies (Deer Hunter is the ultimate piece of disgusting shit in this regard) rather than what they primarily are, murderous acts on others, others who rarely figure other than a props for the playing out of emotions within the American forces.
Also you're talk of guilt etc implies some sort of equality of guilt that all humanity carries, this is liberal humanist bullshit, I'm afraid I simply am not guilty for capitalism in the same sense that a CEO or a leading politician are, nor are the charred victims of US cruise missiles. There is no universal human condition in this regard, capitalism etc aren't universal tragedies for us all, we don't all suffer the same, infact some people do very well out it and fight tooth and nail to uphold.
This film was so refreshing because it avoided all this bollocks and boiled it down to two sides and choices, it gladfully spared us any long winded agnst ridden scenes where the characters wrestled with their thoughts and emotions, because it was about something at a level above such banalness (that masquerades as depth), it was primarily about Politics.
Yeah I do see what you're getting at - good post. And I would hate to run the risk of looking to turn everything into some sort of ultimately meaningless internal 'drama'. I stand by my last post, and Hollywoods poor representation of 'tragic commitment to action' (as I put it) shouldn't have any real bearing on my argument that; yes we need to choose, but we must do so in a way that preserves our own humanity.
Or something. I'm off to get pissed!!
Or something. I'm off to get pissed!!
live_jayeola
/me is jayeola
Great flick! Only worth it if you see it in 3D. "Cinematography" is excellent. According to the entry on wikipedia Cameron waited for few years until the "technology caught up". I can see why.
Gromit
International Man of Misery
Loved the Cinematography but could do without the 3D tbh.
A good film puts you into a trance state where you immerse yourself in the film.
The 3D in Avatar kept pulling me out of that state due to the concious noticing of said 3D effects.
The best effects affect you sub-conciously so that you remain lost in the film.
You don't half overanalyse things Revol
revol68
what, fucking what?
You don't half overanalyse things Revol
But seriously it's all pretty explicit in Avatar.
krtek a houby
Merry Xmas!
avatar 2 set in a court where evil corporation tries to defend itself from allegations that it was invovled in the comet strike that wiped out all life on pandora
Holy shit! Is that a spoiler?
But seriously it's all pretty explicit in Avatar.
Yeah but you do it with everything.
I still don't think it's wholly unique. I mean apart from Vader's conciliation with Luke, Star Wars still portrays the Empire as unrepentently evil. My mate reckoned Star Wars was about guilt over Vietnam. Perhaps cos the baddies are English that confuses everyone so they got away with it?
I do think Palpatine was based on Nixon though
krtek a houby
Merry Xmas!
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