ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Quite right too. The claimant could obviously have got a job as a performance artist along the lines of Bob Flanagan, super-masochist!
Atos Medicals - Questions, Answers and Support
- Thread starter Zabo
- Start date
Quite right too. The claimant could obviously have got a job as a performance artist along the lines of Bob Flanagan, super-masochist!
WouldBe
Dislicksick
Saw the GP yesterday and neurologist won't do evoked potential tests saying there's no need as MRI is gold standard for diagnosing MS. Funny that the MS society say that evoked potentials can show up nerve damage that a MRI won't pick up. GP is contacting ME clinic to let them know and see if they will continue treatment.ESA form finally completed and should be going in the post this afternoon.
Only 1 week late.
Had a session at the ME clinic last Thursday. They told me it would be the last until I'd had another neurological appointment and the evoked potential tests done. Had a letter from my GP this morning to discuss the results of his chat with the neurologist. Looks like I won't be getting another consultation or tests done.Then they have the cheek to ask me if it's me that wants to stay in the sick role.
Any one know of a MS friendly hospital where I can get these tests done privately?
Zabo
Well-Known Member
"Two people with mental health problems, who claimed the test for sickness benefit would discriminate against them, have won their legal challenge. A judge ruled the Work Capability Assessment puts people with mental illness, autism and learning difficulties at a substantial disadvantage.
The process is too difficult for many to navigate, a court heard.
The Department for Work and Pensions has said it will appeal the decision.
Work Capability Assessment tests, which measure a person's entitlement to Employment and Support Allowance, were introduced in 2008 and are carried out on behalf of the government.
The law requires the government to make reasonable adjustments to avoid discrimination.
At Wednesday's hearing, the Upper Tribunal - which is equivalent to the High Court - was told people who have conditions that mean they lack insight can struggle to gather the right documents, including doctors reports, needed for a successful claim.
Lawyers for the two, whose identities have been protected, argued that where a claim is from someone with a mental health problem, it should be the government's responsibility to seek additional medical evidence."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22620894
The process is too difficult for many to navigate, a court heard.
The Department for Work and Pensions has said it will appeal the decision.
Work Capability Assessment tests, which measure a person's entitlement to Employment and Support Allowance, were introduced in 2008 and are carried out on behalf of the government.
The law requires the government to make reasonable adjustments to avoid discrimination.
At Wednesday's hearing, the Upper Tribunal - which is equivalent to the High Court - was told people who have conditions that mean they lack insight can struggle to gather the right documents, including doctors reports, needed for a successful claim.
Lawyers for the two, whose identities have been protected, argued that where a claim is from someone with a mental health problem, it should be the government's responsibility to seek additional medical evidence."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22620894
Ring up and say that you've got proof that ATOS received the form in time, then back this up with a letter (stating the time, date, first name and position of the person to whom you spoke) saying the same thing. Send this signed for, and keep a copy.ATOS received ESA form on 20th. I've received a letter from DWP today saying that as I haven't returned the form in time (it was a week late) they have stopped my benefits again.
Do I need to appeal this or do I wait as ATOS have received the form?
Puddy_Tat
naturally fluffy
Just a further link on the legal challenge which was won as referred to above by puddy tat.
http://www.rethink.org/news-views/2...test-is-unfair-for-people-with-mental-illness
http://www.rethink.org/news-views/2...test-is-unfair-for-people-with-mental-illness
Liked for the first bit, not the second.
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
Ok, when I originally got my ESA form I don't recall anything about it saying you are putting in a new claim or whatever, but when I went to the council the guy there said you must have put in a new claim. No, I said, they sent me a form and told me to fill it in and I did.
So should they not have made it a bit clearer that I was considered to be claiming something? This has totally stressed me out and I've ended up with bank charges because I forgot things. I've not had bank charges in about 10 years! since my dad died!
So should they not have made it a bit clearer that I was considered to be claiming something?
This has totally stressed me out and I've ended up with bank charges because I forgot things. I've not had bank charges in about 10 years! since my dad died!
Yes.<snip>So should they not have made it a bit clearer that I was considered to be claiming something?
ViolentPanda
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Ok, when I originally got my ESA form I don't recall anything about it saying you are putting in a new claim or whatever, but when I went to the council the guy there said you must have put in a new claim. No, I said, they sent me a form and told me to fill it in and I did.
So should they not have made it a bit clearer that I was considered to be claiming something?
I'm presuming you were claiming Incapacity Benefit, and your claim came due for renewal, so they sent you an ESA form. Is that the case?
spirals
Something uber witty here.
FFS! I could cry I sent in my DLA renewal pack about 8 weeks ago. A couple of weeks later I got a call asking why I signed it name B as opposed to name A. I told them that I had got married nearly 2 years ago and informed them of my name change at the time. They said they hadn't changed the name and could I send them a copy of the marriage certificate in the post. I said I would and asked if it needed to be in urgently and would it delay my form being processed? They told me no and it was just for their records. I phoned today to double check what needed to be in the covering letter and to ask how my claim was going as it ends very soon and they inform me that they haven't even registered it as they need the copy of my marriage certificate to proceed! So thats completely opposite to what they told me when they phoned
I sent in my DLA renewal pack about 8 weeks ago. A couple of weeks later I got a call asking why I signed it name B as opposed to name A. I told them that I had got married nearly 2 years ago and informed them of my name change at the time. They said they hadn't changed the name and could I send them a copy of the marriage certificate in the post. I said I would and asked if it needed to be in urgently and would it delay my form being processed? They told me no and it was just for their records. I phoned today to double check what needed to be in the covering letter and to ask how my claim was going as it ends very soon and they inform me that they haven't even registered it as they need the copy of my marriage certificate to proceed! So thats completely opposite to what they told me when they phoned
WouldBe
Dislicksick
The letter was late. It was due back on the 9th May but I hadn't completed it until the 16th and posted it that afternoon and that's as fast as I could physically and mentally fill it in. I tried to phone the DWP on the 8th but after half an hour on hold I was falling asleep from exhaustion so hung up.
I phoned the DWP yesterday and was asked bluntly why I didn't send the form back to the DWP. Durr that's because the envelope provided was addressed to ATOS
@ DWP. They suggested I write to the DWP explaining why the form was late. Their own DWP work psychologist report already explains this due to lack of concentration, poor memory, slow mental processing speed and fine motor control. (had they bothered to read it). Can I do them under the disability discrimination act for taking advantage of my disabilities?
Just had a phone call from a very helpful woman at the DWP. Turns out they haven't recieved the paperwork from the tribunal so I'll have to fax it off tomorrow. I rang this morning from the jobcentre coz the whole gig's been taking too long (getting on ten weeks since I won my appeal) and (luckily) I got someone who knew their arse from their elbow and had someone look into it and bell me back.
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
I really don't know. I think it was called Income something Incapacity because I haven't paid enough stamps but the letter dated 14th May called it Income Support. I originally claimed a long time ago(10+ yrs) but it was February/March.
I certainly didn't know it had to be renewed.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Income Support due to incapacity was what was previously paid to people who hadn't paid enough stamps. Basically Income Support plus a "disability premium" that brought it up to the same level as Incapacity Benefit.
I suspect that you were sent the form "on spec" because you're on Income Support + the disability premium rather than Incapacity Benefit, which is why they're treating it as a fresh claim rather than a transition - there's no assumption of an existing claim or any protection with regard to Income Support, while there is with Incapacity Benefit.
So, have they stopped paying you "because you made a fresh claim"? If so, on what basis, FFS? If they've provided you with no info, just stopped putting money in your bank, then you need to be tearing their arses off.
IIRC you don't have much access to a CAB, so you'll probably need to phone them yourself, and ask them to take you through the sequence of events of the last 3 months or so with reference to your claim, so that you at least know what has happened, and then to send you copies of all relevant records pertaining to your claim that they have on file, otherwise you'll have no way of knowing wtf they're on about.
That'll give you the basis for taking things further, 'cos until you know wtf they're on about, you've got no way to fight back.
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
No they haven't stopped the money, I just thought it was a bit off that I wasn't made aware that I was making a new claim. It starts in June apparently and I think I'm getting more than I 'should' be because they can't lower my income
I've been put in the WRAG thing and will get another letter about that? But equationgirl said on the last page that's meant to be for people who they want to be working asap.
My brain injury and symptoms aren't going to go away and I'm just confused at to what is going on. I may go down to the local JC and ask for an appt so they can explain it in simple terms!
Can email you scanned bits of the letter so you can see what I mean if you like?
I'm just a bit wary of 'rocking the boat' in case they realise they've made a mistake and then they screw me over iykwim.
Eta, if they had stopped my money I'm not sure I'd even be fit for posting here. My head is mince and it's kinda going my way
I've been put in the WRAG thing and will get another letter about that? But equationgirl said on the last page that's meant to be for people who they want to be working asap.
My brain injury and symptoms aren't going to go away and I'm just confused at to what is going on. I may go down to the local JC and ask for an appt so they can explain it in simple terms!
Can email you scanned bits of the letter so you can see what I mean if you like?
I'm just a bit wary of 'rocking the boat' in case they realise they've made a mistake and then they screw me over iykwim.
Eta, if they had stopped my money I'm not sure I'd even be fit for posting here. My head is mince and it's kinda going my way
Worth a try if you've got the energy to do it, I suppose. Just for the principle of it.<snip>They suggested I write to the DWP explaining why the form was late. Their own DWP work psychologist report already explains this due to lack of concentration, poor memory, slow mental processing speed and fine motor control. (had they bothered to read it).
Can I do them under the disability discrimination act for taking advantage of my disabilities?
kittyP
Pluviophile
So with stuff like this happening, will we realistically see any changes?
I have still not heard anything from ATOS since sending off my ESA20 (?) form and am getting more and more frightened that an assessment will be coming soon.
Especially as I am now having a fight with the CMHT that are supposed to be the ones helping me.
Received a letter saying that my ESA was being reduced by £10 a week as of June (I think) but with no explanation as to why.
Two of us are living off what most people get for one person.
We have had to go to a debt management charity to take over our money issues as it is totally out of control.
I do not know how much more strength I have.
WouldBe
Dislicksick
I wrote to the DWP yesterday explaining why my ESA form was late and sent it 1st class recorded delivery. They haven't received it yet so probably won't get it until Tuesday.
I signed the letter off with "This whole process is making me more depressed, more suicidal and I'm rapidly losing the will to live."
Don't know if it will make any difference but I thought I'd put it in anyway.
I signed the letter off with "This whole process is making me more depressed, more suicidal and I'm rapidly losing the will to live."
Don't know if it will make any difference but I thought I'd put it in anyway. 
Minnie_the_Minx
someinenhhanding menbag and me ah bollox
Don't know if it will make any difference but I thought I'd put it in anyway.
nah, they won't gve a shit unforunately
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
No they haven't stopped the money, I just thought it was a bit off that I wasn't made aware that I was making a new claim. It starts in June apparently and I think I'm getting more than I 'should' be because they can't lower my income
Right, so basically they've done the same as with people on Incapacity Benefit. That's okay.
They can't compel you to work, only encourage you to undertake "work-related activity". If there's no work-related activity consonant with your injury and symptoms, well, you can't be compelled or coerced into doing things you're not capable of.
I suspect that you were put in the W-RA group because the decision-maker is ambivalent about your brain injury, so they've put you in the group where they can reassess you the easiest.
Please. I'll PM you an e-mail address.
Yep. We all live in fear of that, I'm afraid.
Eta, if they had stopped my money I'm not sure I'd even be fit for posting here. My head is mince and it's kinda going my way
As usual, the bastards cause loads of stress, when a better-written letter could stop that happening.
UhOhSeven
Your mum
Really? I had heard (= read in reputable sources) that you could be forced into unpaid work for an indefinite period if you were in WRAG, on pain of having your money cut.
Not being snippy, but could you provide a link to a source that backs this up, please?
Apologies if I've missed such a link elsewhere in the thread, it's a big thread and reading it all is beyond me.
WouldBe
Dislicksick
I don't see how. The WRAG group is for people who are unfit for work but may be if their condition improves in the future. They can't force you to work if they have deemed you unfit.
UhOhSeven
Your mum
After many years of fruitful experience with them, I am not assuming that there is much logic to DWP rules.
Anyway, a decisive source would be appreciated, one way or t'other.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
So far, the only compulsory element to ESA WRAG is to attend "work-focused interviews". Work Programme activities are not compulsory, they're voluntary*. Of course, that doesn't mean that your adviser won't mislead you.
*source: www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/work-programme-faqs.pdf
equationgirl
Respect my existence or expect my resistance
According to this DWP document (Annex A, p6), it depends whether you are classed a mandatory participant or a voluntary participant of ESA, which will depend on your individual circumstances and medical prognosis. Most of them seem to fall in the voluntary category though:
http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/wp-pg-chapter-2.pdf
http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/wp-pg-chapter-2.pdf
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