Accused rapist Ched Evans to be released from prison

[Sasaferrato]

The man lied his way into a hotel room, and, in the dark, had sex with a woman who he had never met before, didn't speak to her before, during or after sex and then left via the fire exit. How can consent ever possibly be presumed in this scenario? If anyone's got anything wrong here, it's the jury, not Bahnhof Strasse.

Neither you, nor Herr Strasse have heard all the evidence, the jury have.

I'm bloody sure that were it you in front of the jury, you wouldn't be doubting the verdict.

So many of you with egg all over your faces, and the hubris to continue to assert his guilt.

A bit frightening really, just a step away from lynch mob 'justice'.

 

[bimble]

I don't know what happened in that hotel room because I wasn't there. But more generally Sasaferrato , you can't seriously believe that the justice system in this or any country always 100% of the time gets it right, that would just be daft.

 

[Pickman's model]

Juries can be misdirected by Judges, And this judge was clearly was out of fucking order allowing her sexual history to be testimony.

i think you mean the appeal court judges. if you are going to have a pop at the verdict at least have the good sense to know what you're talking about.

 

[Teaboy]

Neither you, nor Herr Strasse have heard all the evidence, the jury have.

I'm bloody sure that were it you in front of the jury, you wouldn't be doubting the verdict.

So many of you with egg all over your faces, and the hubris to continue to assert his guilt.

A bit frightening really, just a step away from lynch mob 'justice'.

Why are you suddenly so happy?

British justice at its most ugly. If you can't see that then we have to wonder where your instincts lie.

 

[Orang Utan]

He is guilty though, he even admitted it.
What's wrong, and needs protesting, is the way the courts deal with cases like this and how, in this case, the hell the judge admitted the testimony of the victims' exes as evidence that Evans must be innocent. I don't know how you interpret expressing these grave concerns as having egg all over our faces

 

[Sasaferrato]

Juries can be misdirected by Judges, And this judge was clearly was out of fucking order allowing her sexual history to be testimony.

Well, if that is the case, the Crown have redress available. If the CPS feel that the judge's directions were erroneous, there can be yet another trial. Quite where you could find an impartial jury, for a third trial is problematic though. There has been a huge amount of press coverage, and I dare say it will be on the TV news tonight.

I have nothing more to say on this, his behaviour was absolutely loathsome, but after due legal process he has been found not guilty of rape. You don't have to like it, but there it is.

(Incidentally, as I've said a number of times before, I feel that rape is a vile crime, and would support whole life sentences for rapists.)

 

[Spymaster]

There are moves afoot to bring the Scottish system to two verdicts, Guilty and Not Proven.

No. The criticism is of the not proven verdict, not of not guilty.

 

[Pickman's model]

Yes, it possibly would. There are moves afoot to bring the Scottish system to two verdicts, Guilty and Not Proven.

so no one to leave a court in scotland will ever be innocent.

 

[Teaboy]

I have nothing more to say on this, his behaviour was absolutely loathsome, but after due legal process he has been found not guilty of rape. You don't have to like it, but there it is.

You're damn right I don't have to like it. We also don't have to just leave it there, unless you think nothing should change ever.

 

[planetgeli]

Remember the Saudi billionaire who was cleared of rape last year by a London court following his defence that it was an accident he tripped and fell into her?
Just saying, it is not unprecedented for the verdict 'not guilty' to leave a lot of people not entirely satisfied that justice has been done.

I think its worth being reminded how corrupt British justice can be.

"20 mins of private evidence" (press removed from court)

Jury took half an hour to acquit. Wonder how much per minute the bribe worked out as? Truly incredible.

(Sorry about the Daily Mail link)

Saudi millionaire Ehsan Abdulaziz cleared of raping teen in Maida Vale | Daily Mail Online

 

[Sasaferrato]

Why are you suddenly so happy?

British justice at its most ugly. If you can't see that then we have to wonder where your instincts lie.

I'm not happy. Although I suggested pre-trial that rather than assume guilt, we should wait for the trial, I did think that it was likely that a guilty verdict would be returned. I would defend the right of anyone to be innocent until proven guilty. A very strong sense of fair play was the reason I was not happy with the attitude of a goodly number of posters. I have a strong feeling that the jury voted not guilty on a very narrow margin.

Put yourself in Evan's shoes, you have been accused of a hideous crime, and everyone is screaming 'GUILTY' before the trial has taken place. A good place to be? I don't think that the courts always get it right, but it is what we have, and it's a bloody sight better than 'law' in some other jurisdictions.

That is the final comment.

 

[bimble]

A lot of people out there (judging by Twitter) are delighted by this verdict. Some of them might be massive fans of the man himself but it looks like the joy is actually rage against women in general. It's really disgusting, what a week.

 

[8den]

Well, if that is the case, the Crown have redress available. If the CPS feel that the judge's directions were erroneous, there can be yet another trial. Quite where you could find an impartial jury, for a third trial is problematic though. There has been a huge amount of press coverage, and I dare say it will be on the TV news tonight.

I have nothing more to say on this, his behaviour was absolutely loathsome, but after due legal process he has been found not guilty of rape. You don't have to like it, but there it is.

(Incidentally, as I've said a number of times before, I feel that rape is a vile crime, and would support whole life sentences for rapists.)

And Sass the point that everyone is trying to make and you dont seem willing to grasp, is that you seem satisfied that the CPS and Justice system did everything in their power to convict him, while others here know that the justice system is absolutely broken and has let down hundreds of thousands of women and if you're a white wealthy man you are unlikely to be convicted of rape.

 

[8den]

A lot of people out there (judging by Twitter) are delighted by this verdict. Some of them might be massive fans of the man himself but it looks like the joy is actually rage against women in general. It's really disgusting, what a week.

Yeah I thought Trump fans had the market cornered in under shitbaggery but looking at the Chad Evans hashtag makes me want to shower in bleach.

 

[Teaboy]

I'm not happy. Although I suggested pre-trial that rather than assume guilt, we should wait for the trial, I did think that it was likely that a guilty verdict would be returned. I would defend the right of anyone to be innocent until proven guilty. A very strong sense of fair play was the reason I was not happy with the attitude of a goodly number of posters. I have a strong feeling that the jury voted not guilty on a very narrow margin.

Put yourself in Evan's shoes, you have been accused of a hideous crime, and everyone is screaming 'GUILTY' before the trial has taken place. A good place to be? I don't think that the courts always get it right, but it is what we have, and it's a bloody sight better than 'law' in some other jurisdictions.

That is the final comment.

I would never have been in Evans shoes. That's the point. Bollocks - that's the final comment.

 

[Athos]

I was thinking this. Perhaps she has a history of group sex - i dunno, pure speculation.

A history of group sex would be entirely irrelevant.

 

[Teaboy]

How often do we see that a defendant's criminal history is not allowed to be known during the trial yet in a rape trail a woman's sexual history is? Its a never ending disgrace.

ETA: Someone get in contact with Lilly Allen maybe she can apologise on behalf of the justice system.

 

[bimble]

How often do we see that a defendant's criminal history is not allowed to be known during the trial yet in a rape trail a woman's sexual history is? Its a never ending disgrace.

It is very unusual for this sort of evidence to be admitted in a rape trial, this was an exception. Not saying it was right of the judge to allow it but important to remember that this is not usually allowed. Still the damage will be done I'm sure this case will put a lot of people off from coming forward thinking that they will have to go through similar.

 

[equationgirl]

not proven is sensiible, its double jeopardy thats stupid, and double jeopardy in a system that has a not proven verdict is really fucked up

Double jeopardy has been revised so that there can be another trial. Revised in light of Angus sinclair and world's end murders case.

 

[Spymaster]

Double jeopardy has been revised so that there can be another trial. Revised in light of Angus sinclair and world's end murders case.

In the light of the Stephen Lawrence case in England

 

[Looby]

I dunno - i'm just speculating as to what evidence the defence put forward from witnesses regarding her previous sex life.
NB - are you attacking specifically me or just the contention you put forward in general?

I don't see the relevance unless you think there's some sort of link between liking group sex and being raped? Her previous sex life has absolutely nothing to do with whether she was raped that night, absolutely fuck all.

 

[Pickman's model]

It is very unusual for this sort of evidence to be admitted in a rape trial, this was an exception. Not saying it was right of the judge to allow it but important to remember that this is not usually allowed. Still the damage will be done I'm sure this case will put a lot of people off from coming forward thinking that they will have to go through similar.

You liked my post above about the APPEAL COURT JUDGES allowing it.

 

[bimble]

You liked my post above about the APPEAL COURT JUDGES allowing it.

Yes, and? Your post explained why they allowed it and how exceptional that is.

 

[Pickman's model]

Yes, and? Your post explained why they allowed it and how exceptional that is.

Yes. And then another judge presided over the retrial. Yet you think the retrial judge had an option

 

[Gromit]

How often do we see that a defendant's criminal history is not allowed to be known during the trial yet in a rape trail a woman's sexual history is? Its a never ending disgrace.

ETA: Someone get in contact with Lilly Allen maybe she can apologise on behalf of the justice system.

Depends how relevant the criminal history is. If not relevant they aren't allowed but if it is they can and do.

 

[bimble]

Pickman's model I don't know what you're trying to prove. My post was a reply to Teaboy, my only point being that admitting such evidence is highly unusual, it is not normally permitted at all, but that doesn't mean it won't put a lot of women off from coming forward for fear of the same.

 

[Spymaster]

Her previous sex life has absolutely nothing to do with whether she was raped that night, absolutely fuck all.

Well the contention was that on other occasions she had participated in consensual sex and forgotten about it the following day. That is relevant.

 

[Teaboy]

Depends how relevant the criminal history is. If not relevant they aren't allowed but if it is they can and do.

Fuck off Gromit. This subject needs you like a hole in the head. Do one.

 

[Pickman's model]

Pickman's model I don't know what you're trying to prove. My post was a reply to Teaboy, my only point being that admitting such evidence is highly unusual, it is not normally permitted at all, but that doesn't mean it won't put a lot of women off from coming forward for fear of the same.

You said "not saying it was right of the judge to allow it [testimony of former partners]". The judge had no option. The appeal court had in this case allowed it. Do you understand now that the entire point of the retrial was to hear something you seem to think the retrial judge should have excluded?

 

[Gromit]

Fuck off Gromit. This subject needs you like a hole in the head. Do one.

Don't like your crap comparison being shown for what it is eh?!