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About the 20mph speed limit in Wales built up areas? Which goes live tonight..

Hollis said:
I don't think it's just about kids walking to school.. as a cyclist 20mph roads feel alot safer than 30mph - I avoid the local ones. I can't belive it will make any significant difference to the average length of car journeys in urban areas.
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My route to the nearest supermarket goes through a variety of limits. It starts with a 30, then a 40 then a 60, a 40 with the periodic 20 by a school, a 30, a 60 and then for the rest of the way it is a 30.

It is a country road that goes through some villages. I wouldn't cycle on it though people do.
 
A lot of the built up areas round here have changed to 20mph in recent years. I thought it was a national thing that was rolling out, but it seems to have been a decision by the local council. It covers some or most of my journey to/from work (depending if I go on the dual carriageway or not) and hasn’t really made any difference to journey times. They are nicer places to walk round now though, it’s much easier to cross roads when people are driving that bit slower.
 
MickiQ said:
Broadly indifferent to it tbh, I can see the point of restricting speed where people live and kids go to school. A lot of more modern cars have PCS systems that will apply the brakes automatically if they detect an obstacle in front of the vehicle such as another car or a pedestrian. 20mph gives them a better chance of stopping the car even if the driver's attention is wandering.
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But...
littlebabyjesus said:
And even if you hit them at 20mph, you'll hit them with less than half the force than you would at 30mph.
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Yeah. If a child steps out in front of a vehicle and there literally isn't time to stop, the impact is a lot less.
 
maomao said:
You'll have fifty percent more time to spot hazards. And you'll get used to it just like you did to thirty.
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Probably can get used to it but at the moment I worry about how easy that will be, I am used to maintaining 30 pretty much without having to look down at the speedo too often. I think 20 will be harder to maintain without looking. I don't want a fine or points for that matter but for it to be safer for all road users I need to be able to look out the windscreen not eyes glued to my speedo.
 
weltweit said:
Probably can get used to it but at the moment I worry about how easy that will be, I am used to maintaining 30 pretty much without having to look down at the speedo too often. I think 20 will be harder to maintain without looking. I don't want a fine or points for that matter but for it to be safer for all road users I need to be able to look out the windscreen not eyes glued to my speedo.
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If you find it that difficult to adapt maybe you shouldn't be driving. When was the last time you were tested?
 
newme said:
I mean at 3am in an area where you are the only traffic at all seems sort of pointless for example
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It depends on what the objective danger is - with built up areas, the danger is people, and while there may be fewer people about at 3am, a drunk is as much a hazard as a 4yo who sees a friend and runs out across the road to get to them. It's also about noise, pollution and by making built up areas a place drivers want to avoid as much as possible.

A motorway is a road where speed limits can fluctuate according to the hazards - in a clear day with little traffic 70/80/90 is fine, but if the weather's shit, I've driven from Glasgow to Preston at 30, which was less fun than you might think.
 
I live in a small village in North Wales. There appears to be a lot of resistance to this locally judging by some vandalised signs I've seen as they make the changes. Mind you (massive generalisations coming up) the drivers round here like to tailgate and treat the indicator lights as merely an optional extra they might use if they are in the mood.

I think it's a great idea. We'll get used to it. I can go at 60, until I get to the village, when it drops to 20.
 
maomao said:
If you find it that difficult to adapt maybe you shouldn't be driving. When was the last time you were tested?
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I passed my car test when I was 18 IIRC

I think it is a perfectly valid thought. If the limit is 20 I prefer to observe it and would like to be able to do it safely and without getting any tickets for exceeding it by accident. My cars speedo has alternate size numbers, 10 is big, 20 is small 30 is big etc .. If I had cruise control I would likely use that ..
 
weltweit said:
I passed my car test when I was 18 IIRC

I think it is a perfectly valid thought. If the limit is 20 I prefer to observe it and would like to be able to do it safely and without getting any tickets for exceeding it by accident. My cars speedo has alternate size numbers, 10 is big, 20 is small 30 is big etc .. If I had cruise control I would likely use that ..
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If you don't feel able to safely observe the rules of the road, or you have trouble seeing your speedometer clearly, you should hand your license in.
 
I suppose in a way I am used to it, when I lived in the strange motoring country Germany people would drive at all sorts of speeds on the Autobahn with impunity (no limits) but almost immediately when you took the Ausfart the limits were very low and were policed. I got used to it.
 
Afaik it's every Welsh village. It's certainly mine (pop 50) because we have 3 bureaucratic laminated pieces of paper, all bilingual, on each entry/exit of the village. All unreadable unless you are a cm away.
The 50 mph limit through Port Talbot cracks me up. You go past signs, in bunched up traffic constantly changing from 30 to 50, which say "For cleaner air". As the smoke pours out of the steelworks beside you, while you drive on a flyover deliberately built right over the town.

And the enforcement of this 20mph? There are no cameras in villages. There's about a dozen new ones for the whole county.
And if I want, 50 yards down the road, I can legally do 60 - on the bendiest, narrowest, built up hedges country roads you can imagine.
Not exactly consistent.
 
weltweit said:
Probably can get used to it but at the moment I worry about how easy that will be, I am used to maintaining 30 pretty much without having to look down at the speedo too often. I think 20 will be harder to maintain without looking. I don't want a fine or points for that matter but for it to be safer for all road users I need to be able to look out the windscreen not eyes glued to my speedo.
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I did a speed awareness course a while back ( :facepalm: ) and one thing they suggested was sticking to 2nd gear in 20 limits and 3rd in a 30. That way the engine will start to rev high when going too fast.

I was caught on a dual carriageway, but about 90% of the others were caught in a 20 or 30 limit.
 
kebabking said:
It depends on what the objective danger is - with built up areas, the danger is people, and while there may be fewer people about at 3am, a drunk is as much a hazard as a 4yo who sees a friend and runs out across the road to get to them. It's also about noise, pollution and by making built up areas a place drivers want to avoid as much as possible.

A motorway is a road where speed limits can fluctuate according to the hazards - in a clear day with little traffic 70/80/90 is fine, but if the weather's shit, I've driven from Glasgow to Preston at 30, which was less fun than you might think.
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Thus was not built up or traffic heavy at 3am, it was seeing one car in a year doing that route, which was over a barrier going the other way. We don't even have motorways here. On a motorbike the danger is mostly to myself, I take that rather seriously.
 
planetgeli said:
Afaik it's every Welsh village. It's certainly mine (pop 50) because we have 3 bureaucratic laminated pieces of paper, all bilingual, on each entry/exit of the village. All unreadable unless you are a cm away.
The 50 mph limit through Port Talbot cracks me up. You go past signs, in bunched up traffic constantly changing from 30 to 50, which say "For cleaner air". As the smoke pours out of the steelworks beside you, while you drive on a flyover deliberately built right over the town.

And the enforcement of this 20mph? There are no cameras in villages. There's about a dozen new ones for the whole county.
And if I want, 50 yards down the road, I can legally do 60 - on the bendiest, narrowest, built up hedges country roads you can imagine.
Not exactly consistent.
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Port Talbot is possibly the most horrible town in Britain. Maybe there are other contenders that I haven't been to.

Anyway, people will get used to it. Instead of defaulting to 30, they'll default to 20. It will feel normal soon enough. You kill fewer people at 20 than 30. That's the point, whether a village has 50 or 5000 inhabitants. And walking or cycling along those streets will feel that bit more pleasant.
 
weltweit said:
I spent quite a lot of time last year mooching around Port Talbot trying to find the best view of the steel works. I didn't find what I was looking for. I need a drone :)
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It's actually not as bad as it used to be. 40 years ago, there were even more factories belching out fumes. It stank.
 
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