Frankie Jack
Not a bloke..
I believe he has his eye on wheeching the SNHS under wastemonster control so of course he doesn't want independence. Possibly to remind him how pre-Tory NHS worked.
Will you vote for independence?
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andysays
Love and solidarity
It changes its name to the M74 as it reaches the border, but you wouldn't notice.
(I should add, so as not to offend my father in law who is obsessed by these things, that it is actually called the A74(M) at first before becoming the M74).
Maybe Burnham is worried we'll ask for all the road surfaces back, covered as they are with tar McAdam. Which is ours.
Hasn't he got a health service to save?
Thanks for the clarification - you've probably driven over it more recently than me.
There are quite a few things the Scots could ask for back if they wanted to be proper bloody minded, including penicillin, which would potentially be more of a worry to Burnham than the possibility of driving on the right
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
http://www.scotsman.com/news/politi...dependence-no-case-disappoints-stuc-1-3314114
THE leader of Scotland’s trade union movement has said that his members are “more attracted” to the pro-independence campaign than to the campaign for continuing within the UK.
Grahame Smith, Scottish Trades Union Congress (STUC) general secretary, said the union was “disappointed” in the case being made for staying in the UK by the No campaign.
He made the stark claim as the umbrella trade union body launched an analysis paper on the referendum “a just Scotland” today.
The STUC, which represents, 630,000 workers, includes some of the UK’s biggest trade union such as Unite and Unison - that are affiliated to Labour.
Mr Smith said that STUC members had so far been “more attracted by the vision offered by the Yes campaign
THE leader of Scotland’s trade union movement has said that his members are “more attracted” to the pro-independence campaign than to the campaign for continuing within the UK.
Grahame Smith, Scottish Trades Union Congress (STUC) general secretary, said the union was “disappointed” in the case being made for staying in the UK by the No campaign.
He made the stark claim as the umbrella trade union body launched an analysis paper on the referendum “a just Scotland” today.
The STUC, which represents, 630,000 workers, includes some of the UK’s biggest trade union such as Unite and Unison - that are affiliated to Labour.
Mr Smith said that STUC members had so far been “more attracted by the vision offered by the Yes campaign
True, but campaigning against the union endorsement is a different matter.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
No it's not - and i doubt mamy people will be campaigning within the union on the issue of the referendum. To cmapiagners i doubt it will effect things one way or another (expect to give w/c colouration to elements of the YES vote). To individual voters why would it matter?
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
We're not getting to keep Queenie now apparently, fucking ACE!!!!!! 
“Respected Telegraph commentator Peter Oborne wrote yesterday that David Cameron might throw a spanner in Scotland’s constitutional works.
He wrote: Will the Queen be allowed to remain as Scottish monarch? I have no doubt that the Queen herself would strongly prefer that she did. But it is not simply a matter for her. She is constitutionally obliged to take the advice of the Prime Minister, David Cameron.
Cameron has already denied Scotland the pound sterling. He is entitled to deny the Scots the House of Windsor, especially since the Scots had their own separate monarch before James the VI and I unified the crowns of England and Scotland in 1603.”
“Respected Telegraph commentator Peter Oborne wrote yesterday that David Cameron might throw a spanner in Scotland’s constitutional works.
He wrote: Will the Queen be allowed to remain as Scottish monarch? I have no doubt that the Queen herself would strongly prefer that she did. But it is not simply a matter for her. She is constitutionally obliged to take the advice of the Prime Minister, David Cameron.
Cameron has already denied Scotland the pound sterling. He is entitled to deny the Scots the House of Windsor, especially since the Scots had their own separate monarch before James the VI and I unified the crowns of England and Scotland in 1603.”
Frankie Jack
Not a bloke..
andysays
Love and solidarity
We're not getting to keep Queenie now apparently, fucking ACE!!!!!!
Given that James was king of Scotland before he became king of England, I reckon the monarchy is something else the Scots could claim was their's, along with roads and penicillin. Not sure how happy that would make you
Something else to bear in mind - isn't there going to be a British GE during the negotiations around independence? So the UK negotiators may end up representing a different govt than the one they start off with. I'm sure danny la rouge has a copy of the the timetable and proceedures to hand...
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
It's a bit of an empty article. Large numbers of PCS branches-my own included-have already voted for PCS not to take an official position. The article studiously ignores that fact. I was speaking to a PCS rep in DWP Glasgow branch today who is in no doubt that 'No official position' will win the vote. There is 3 DWP branches in Glasgow 2:1 for no official position. The HMRC branch referred to has possibly already resulted in reps resigning their position within PCS.
One of the things I find funny is the near desperate rush from Lefts/SSP/Solidarity types desperate for PCS top take a YES position effectively on a border. The very same types who for years wanted other Lefts to ignore the border in Ireland and for unions not to take Pro United Ireland positions for fear of alienating Protestant workers. The issue is much less sharp obviously but in the West of Scotland it is still an issue. Some of the crap i've heard about not bothering if working-class prods/unionist types might resign from the union is ok as Independence is more important shows a rather pathetic side to that debate. Using Independence as some kind of 'progressive/non progressive dividing line is cringingly bad.
There's plenty of straightforward arguments for a YES vote, some of the guff i'm seeing/hearing from mates is far from that.
The meeting is tomorrow btw.
On the issue of PCS not siding as it's not a union issue well of course it is as it affects government staff both sides of the border. People in my office deal with benefit claims in London, Manchester and various other cities in England. That very fact makes it a union issue. However there's one problem there, neither side have put forward anything other than it'll be better with us. For m,any members in my branch there is the fear that the work they do will simply be relocated on the system which is very easy in this 'digital' world. PCS are being asked to take a leap when no trades union rep worth their reputation or politics should ask.
Imho the Herald article is a spike from a NO supporter or a meddlesome idiot. Put out the story that YES is gonna win in a sizable, arguably most militant union, then when the 'No official position' wins the NO Campaign can say look they've pulled back. If a YES supporter put that story out then they are idiots.
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
Given that James was king of Scotland before he became king of England, I reckon the monarchy is something else the Scots could claim was their's, along with roads and penicillin. Not sure how happy that would make you
Something else to bear in mind - isn't there going to be a British GE during the negotiations around independence? So the UK negotiators may end up representing a different govt than the one they start off with. I'm sure danny la rouge has a copy of the the timetable and proceedures to hand...
I couldn't give a toss about the royal family whoever they are I'm afraid. The fact that James was 'ours' seems to have gone right over tory heads
Yes, there is a GE and one that we still vote in, again this has been pointed out to 'them' but hey ho!
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Given that James was king of Scotland before he became king of England, I reckon the monarchy is something else the Scots could claim was their's, along with roads and penicillin. Not sure how happy that would make you
Something else to bear in mind - isn't there going to be a British GE during the negotiations around independence? So the UK negotiators may end up representing a different govt than the one they start off with. I'm sure danny la rouge has a copy of the the timetable and proceedures to hand...
The 7th May 2015 is prior to independence day, 2016, so Scots will vote in that general election, and you're right, the government could change. But since all 3 Westminster parties agree that Scotland won't be allowed post-it notes, thumbs or the vowels on computer keyboards, negotiations will probably not change much.
We're not getting to keep Queenie now apparently, fucking ACE!!!!!!
Cameron's an idiot - but we already knew that.
Very sensible.
Not necessarily. It wouldn't surprise me if a day or two after a 'Yes' vote, the rUK Parliament got shot of Scotland on a 'sort yourself out' basis.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Did you ask them about their votes in 2010 first? Because it doesn't count if you did.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
It would me.
No I didn't, because it's not relevant. FWIW one (I'm not saying which) volunteered that the SNP had been very helpful locally.
Dear Lord.
Canteen at work today. Irish colleague quips about how unfair it is that Scotland could get its independence without having to go through a civil war. English colleagues look very puzzled. 'What civil war? "
Queue quick tour of Irish history. (Well not *that* quick. ) Irish colleague tells me she's amazed by the lack of general knowledge of/interest in things Irish and wonders how I can be bothered explaining the Scottish stuff...
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
This is the actual Daily Mail, not a spoof:
He has already been told that an independent Scotland may not be able to stay in the EU or keep the pound.
But now Alex Salmond faces perhaps the biggest threat his dream of Scottish statehood.
For the country’s first minister has now been warned that, if it opts for secession, Scotland might not be allowed to enter the Eurovision Song Contest.
Really? OK, I'm running off some Yes leaflets and blitzing the town.
He has already been told that an independent Scotland may not be able to stay in the EU or keep the pound.
But now Alex Salmond faces perhaps the biggest threat his dream of Scottish statehood.
For the country’s first minister has now been warned that, if it opts for secession, Scotland might not be allowed to enter the Eurovision Song Contest.
Really? OK, I'm running off some Yes leaflets and blitzing the town.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
But Israel can. Shocking.
weepiper
I fix the machines that fight climate change
I was just reading that and thinking 'errr... what?'
This and the 'you might not be able to keep the Queen!!!1!!1' stuff. They really have no idea about us do they.
Oh dear, I laughed so hard I need another mug of tea after that!
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
It's hard to tell the spoofs from the real Project Fear these days.
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
danny la rouge The Mash ran that story and I think the Mail have picked up on it, totally missing that the Mash is satire 
Bless!
So far all these threats make me want to vote yes even more. You can take your royal family, BBC and Eurovision and shove it!
Bless! So far all these threats make me want to vote yes even more. You can take your royal family, BBC and Eurovision and shove it!
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Belittling the notion by saying the "biggest threat to the dream of independence" is the (entirely fictional) inability to take part in Eurovision?
No, I think that's too subtle for them. They really do think it's a big threat.
Honestly, bringing your 'royal' family into our house and then conveniently 'forgetting' them when you leave. Tskdanny la rouge The Mash ran that story and I think the Mail have picked up on it, totally missing that the Mash is satire
So far all these threats make me want to vote yes even more. You can take your royal family, BBC and Eurovision and shove it!
goldenecitrone
post tenebras lux
Was in the barber's today (in London) and overheard a young guy from Dundee being asked by his barber which way he was going to vote. I thought it was a bit rude to just ask someone something like that. I guess Scots all over England are being asked the same question. Must get irritating.
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