Why no contactless/Oyster card payment outside London?

[Orang Utan]

It works very well there, although there should be a cash option. So why not roll it out everywhere?

(and this may be a question for another thread, but why are buses so dear outside London? It cost me £3 to get one bus home last week AND you have to state where you are going and the price varies depending, which is silly and a massive waste of time)

 

[souljacker]

Because TFL don't run anything outside London? Just a guess.

 

[Orang Utan]

Because TFL don't run anything outside London? Just a guess.

but why not have similar schemes outside London?

 

[bi0boy]

Yeah because no one has made them do it.

However I notice Stagecoach are to accept contactless nationwide by 2018. Probably because so many councils have been having a go at them, they certainly have been around this way as they're lobbying for new bus lanes etc and it's a case of "why should we widen the road to add a bus lane and make journey times more reliable if you insist on everyone rummaging around for coins when they get on".

 

[Ax^]

Mostly to annoy Londoners who have the audacity to venture out of the big smoke...

 

[souljacker]

but why not have similar schemes outside London?

They are doing it in Reading soon I believe.

 

[Orang Utan]

Yeah because no one has made them do it.

However I notice Stagecoach are to accept contactless nationwide by 2018. Probably because so many councils have been having a go at them, they certainly have been around this way as they're lobbying for new bus lanes etc and it's a case of "why should we widen the road to add a bus lane and make journey times more reliable if you insist on everyone rummaging around for coins when they get on".

new bus lanes would surely be more costly and inconvenient? I'm in Leeds and there's just no room for bus lanes on commuting routes. The roads are too narrow.

 

[weepiper]

Edinburgh buses take cash or a prepaid 'Ridacard' which I assume is pretty much like an Oyster (you tap it on the driver's machine and it displays an expiry date so he knows it's valid and once you've got it you can top it up for a week or a month at a time)

 

[purenarcotic]

I wonder about this too - public transport in Birmingham is exact change only and pretty terrible in some parts. They have introduced a smart card which is a bit like an oyster but it doesn't work properly. A day saver here is nearly a fiver which is a joke.

 

[Orang Utan]

I wonder about this too - public transport in Birmingham is exact change only and pretty terrible in some parts. They have introduced a smart card which is a bit like an oyster but it doesn't work properly. A day saver here is nearly a fiver which is a joke.

£4.50 in Leeds, or you could be spending £6 on just two journeys

 

[killer b]

Other local authorities don't retain the same level of control and coordination that TfL has over London's public transport infrastructure.

Some of the metropolitan centres have something like oyster - I think Newcastle has one, and there's been a contactless payment card mooted for Manchester for years (although as yet it's failed to materialise). Most places are at the mercy of the operators though, and they are resistant to change/spending money

 

[ska invita]

A problem of privatisation and lack of interconnectivity I reckon.

Once oystered my way onto a train from Croydon to Gatwick only to get fined when getting off at Gatwick for not having a ticket. That was annoying

 

[bi0boy]

new bus lanes would surely be more costly and inconvenient?

Exactly but they cost the private bus company nothing, whereas smart ticketing has an implementation cost.

 

[killer b]

London has (relatively) cheap and reliable public transport because the public transport system remains democratically accountable. It mostly isn’t elsewhere, so you can pay up or walk.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

Other local authorities don't retain the same level of control and coordination that TfL has over London's public transport infrastructure.

or anything like the level of funding, a fair chunk of which (at present) comes from central government.

I can't find the figures, but from memory, TfL spending on public transport per head of population is something like three times that in the the (former) metropolitan counties which retain a transport authority, and six times that elsewhere in England.

(Obviously there are complicating factors in that transport systems are used to varying degrees by commuters / holidaymakers from outside their boundaries)

Never mind, one of George Osborne's final acts was to decide that central government funding for TfL is to be reduced to zero over the next few years. No doubt had London's electorate voted for the 'correct' choice as mayor, the new mayor would have 'negotiated' a new deal...

 

[ruffneck23]

London has (relatively) cheap and reliable public transport because the public transport system remains democratically accountable. It mostly isn’t elsewhere, so you can pay up or walk.

its only cheap with oyster or contact less pay, before going onto apple pay, it was costing me £4.90 for 1 stop on the tube compared to £2.90 which is pretty disgusting really

 

[Orang Utan]

its only cheap with oyster or contact less pay, before going onto apple pay, it was costing me £4.90 for 1 stop on the tube compared to £2.90 which is pretty disgusting really

it is very expensive but it's cheaper to get an oyster card even if you're visiting briefly, so even tourists don't bother with buying tickets anymore.

 

[killer b]

Yeah, I'm in London once in a blue moon but I still have an oyster.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

its only cheap with oyster or contact less pay, before going onto apple pay, it was costing me £4.90 for 1 stop on the tube compared to £2.90 which is pretty disgusting really

to an extent, the fare was set to try and stop people making one station journeys on the underground...

(and bear in mind that the transaction costs / costs of providing the station bit of the journey is the same whether someone's travelling one stop or ten)

it is a downside of a flat / zonal fare system that very short journeys become comparitively expensive

 

[bi0boy]

its only cheap with oyster or contact less pay, before going onto apple pay, it was costing me £4.90 for 1 stop on the tube compared to £2.90 which is pretty disgusting really

Up here out of London it's £2.90 for one stop on the bus. One stop on the train (6 minutes, 5 miles) is £2.50.

 

[ruffneck23]

wow, makes me realize that things up here in the Isle of Man aren't so bad, its £2.70 each way for a 12 mile journey , 60p i think for less than 3 stops of less and £1.90 for a 5ish mile journey .They have an oyster type thing which is a bit cheaper, plus the buses have wifi.

Shame there isn't a proper railway apart from the steam train one

 

[ruffneck23]

it is very expensive but it's cheaper to get an oyster card even if you're visiting briefly, so even tourists don't bother with buying tickets anymore.

yeah , this is why i reluctantly went on to apple pay, for the few times I come back it makes it worth it

 

[Orang Utan]

I've not heard of apple pay
eta: ah, right, just the same as contactless, but with a phone?

 

[ruffneck23]

its basically paying for things using an i phone, you register your debit card and can use your phone as a contactless payment method, more and more shops are using it and it works on the tube and buses

 

[EastEnder]

Oyster cards only work within the boundaries of civilisation. If your Oyster card no longer works, you've gone too far and are at the mercy of the feral wretches that roam the fetid wastelands beyond.

 

[Pickman's model]

good to see liberals clamouring to be surveilled.

 

[Orang Utan]

good to see liberals clamouring to be surveilled.

where?

 

[Pickman's model]

where?

Here on this thread

 

[Orang Utan]

Here on this thread

There isn't anyone clamouring to be spied. You only get tracked if you register your card.
And I'm not a liberal myself, though I can't speak for the others who have posted.

 

[bi0boy]

good to see liberals clamouring to be surveilled.

Do you wear gloves when handling coins so as not to leave fingerprints on them?