Why Conspiracy Theorists are so prevalent.

[butchersapron]

Jews (and Christians) were regularly fingered in pre-constantine Roman Empire.

 

[existentialist]

To be fair the Jews didn't get in on the act for a few years. At first it was the Masons and the Knights Templar who were behind the Jacobins.

Bloody Masons, eh? Coming over here, taking all our conspiracies.

As a Mason, I do find it quite amusing being told by CTers that I kno nuthin about it, and have to just watch this 9 hour video to Learn The Troof, rather than, say, be an active and moderately senior member of the organisation for a ¼ century...

 

[TruXta]

Bloody Masons, eh? Coming over here, taking all our conspiracies.

As a Mason, I do find it quite amusing being told by CTers that I kno nuthin about it, and have to just watch this 9 hour video to Learn The Troof, rather than, say, be an active and moderately senior member of the organisation for a ¼ century...

What lodge? Or is that a secret?

 

[frogwoman]

they do that with jews too.

"oh you're not a real jew, you're not in the higher levels"

 

[eoin_k]

Jews (and Christians) were regularly fingered in pre-constantine Roman Empire.

I'm basing this on Norman Cohn's thesis in Warrant for Genocide: The Myth of the Jewish world-conspiracy and the Protocols of the Elders of Zion which traces the narrative found in modern conspiracy theories to Abbé Barrel's late 18th Century Mémoire pour servir à l'Histoire du Jacobinisme. A Jewish conspiracy is quickly bolted onto this in the early 19th Century, but they aren't present in this earliest version, which isn't to suggests that it doesn't feed off earlier representations of Jews as demonic or what have you.

 

[frogwoman]

I'm basing this on Norman Cohn's thesis in Warrant for Genocide: The Myth of the Jewish world-conspiracy and the Protocols of the Elders of Zion which traces the narrative found in modern conspiracy theories to Abbé Barrel's late 18th Century Mémoire pour servir à l'Histoire du Jacobinisme. A Jewish conspiracy is quickly bolted onto this in the early 19th Century, but they aren't present in this earliest version, which isn't to suggests that it doesn't feed off earlier representations of Jews as demonic or what have you.

There were previous ideas of Jewish conspiracies, there was the idea which started in about the 13th century that some powerful Jews met once a year in France to draw lots to decide where the next child would be sacrificed and that sort of shit. But the modern form of it came together in about the 19th century.

that book is fantastic btw

 

[existentialist]

What lodge? Or is that a secret?

378. Mother lodge was 6800.

 

[DotCommunist]

that book is fantastic btw

early 19th century tsarist court reads as totally bugfucked insane.

 

[butchersapron]

I'm basing this on Norman Cohn's thesis in Warrant for Genocide: The Myth of the Jewish world-conspiracy and the Protocols of the Elders of Zion which traces the narrative found in modern conspiracy theories to Abbé Barrel's late 18th Century Mémoire pour servir à l'Histoire du Jacobinisme. A Jewish conspiracy is quickly bolted onto this in the early 19th Century, but they aren't present in this earliest version, which isn't to suggests that it doesn't feed off earlier representations of Jews as demonic or what have you.

Barruel - and yes, modern conspiracy theory is a mish-mash of tropes developed out of elite reaction to the french revolution with later russian anti-semitism coming to the fore (which is one reason i always argue this stuff is inherently reactionary - there are no good aspects to it at all). But, 1500 years before that the elites already knew the power of conspiracy theory - Nero and fire of Rome for example. And Cohen actually starts his book with similar examples of historic uses of conspiracy theory, including the development of the idea of jews murdering christian children and so on from the 12th century.

 

[TruXta]

378. Mother lodge was 6800.

6800, the Econo Lodge.

 

[frogwoman]

early 19th century tsarist court reads as totally bugfucked insane.

it written in the 1960s but it could have been written yesterday with these cunts still banging the same drum.

 

[eoin_k]

So blood libel is carried over from medieval European mythology - which relates to the demonic representation of Jews that Cohn traces back to early Christian church. But, isn't there a political aspect to conspiracy theory, which is new. Jews aren't just murdering Christian children and using them in their demonic rituals, they are also pulling the strings behind the course of history.

 

[butchersapron]

So blood libel is carried over from medieval European mythology - which relates to the demonic representation of Jews that Cohn traces back to early Christian church. But, isn't there a political aspect to conspiracy theory, which is new. Jews aren't just murdering Christian children and using them in their demonic rituals, they are also pulling the strings behind the course of history.

I'd say it's substantially the same and motivated by substantially the same things - before religion was the cover and justification now it's other things. In a similar way that racists have moved from using race-based racism (as odd as that sounds) to cultural justifications for the same views. Different forms, same content.

 

[butchersapron]

Some people just really really hate Jews as well. They'll use whatever they can lay their hands on to pursue this hatred basically.

 

[Delroy Booth]

So blood libel is carried over from medieval European mythology - which relates to the demonic representation of Jews that Cohn traces back to early Christian church. But, isn't there a political aspect to conspiracy theory, which is new. Jews aren't just murdering Christian children and using them in their demonic rituals, they are also pulling the strings behind the course of history.

I think a lot of the blood libel stuff has been re-invented as "peadophile rings at the heart of the illuminati/bilderberg/masons etc" if you listen to Icke in particular ritual child abuse is a trope he relies on heavily.

This is even more complex because of the real child abuse scandals that have gone on. The snakeoil salesmen peddling anti-semitic innuendo are all over these scandals and they're going to make it harder for proper investigations to be done.

 

[frogwoman]

Some people just really really hate Jews as well. They'll use whatever they can lay their hands on to pursue this hatred basically.

"the jew"

god knows why, we're pretty boring really.

 

[WouldBe]

An interesting article on the increasing prevalence of conspiracy theorists:
http://www.scientificamerican.com/a...-faked-why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories

Is it because the government are adding something to the water that makes people more paranoid?

 

[frogwoman]

I think a lot of the blood libel stuff has been re-invented as "peadophile rings at the heart of the illuminati/bilderberg/masons etc" if you listen to Icke in particular ritual child abuse is a trope he relies on heavily.

This is even more complex because of the real child abuse scandals that have gone on. The snakeoil salesmen peddling anti-semitic innuendo are all over these scandals and they're going to make it harder for proper investigations to be done.

These cunts do actually claim that kids have been sacrificed. By bankers who control the world and poison the water (poison the well). Yeah that's nothing to do with Jews is it

 

[butchersapron]

That Spivey one we were talking about the other day, he claim's Cameron sacrificed his son Ivan to Satan, rather than dying from Early Infantile Epileptic Encephalopathy with Burst-Suppression.

 

[eoin_k]

Has the argument been presented to taffboy gwyrdd in these terms before? A zero tolerance attitude to conspiracy theory is linked to a reading of them as tropes that can be traced through the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, to a reactionary defence of the ancienne regime at the end of the 18th Century, which feeds of a deep rooted anti-semitism in Europe dating back to Roman times.

 

[frogwoman]

It has been presented to him yeah - more than once - and he threw a hissy fit about it. There's no fucking way he's not aware of it.

quite right - no way we should tolerate this shit any more than we should tolerate the views of the EDL has any place on "the left" (i'm not talking about people who are starting to become politically aware and maybe believe / are open to some aspects of it)

 

[butchersapron]

Has the argument been presented to taffboy gwyrdd in these terms before? A zero tolerance attitude to conspiracy theory is linked to a reading of them as tropes that can be traced through the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, to a reactionary defence of the ancienne regime at the end of the 18th Century, which feeds of a deep rooted anti-semitism in Europe dating back to Roman times.

Pretty sure - he's certainly been on threads in which posters outlined it like that.

 

[DotCommunist]

its been put in even simpler terms- sites linked to/sources referenced by himself being literally two or three clicks away from full on ZOG shit. Ignores it/defends it.

 

[frogwoman]

it's pretty ironic seeing his approach to EDL bullshit (ie pandering to the worst reactionary "anti-fascist" bollocks ie class prejudice masquerading as anti-racism, taking the piss out of their educational level, literacy etc) compared to how he see this. Common ground between "conspiracy theories" and the left? well im sorry but if the traditional left have any common ground with these cunts it's time to tear it up and start again.

 

[8ball]

That Spivey one we were talking about the other day, he claim's Cameron sacrificed his son Ivan to Satan, rather than dying from Early Infantile Epileptic Encephalopathy with Burst-Suppression.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

it's pretty ironic seeing his approach to EDL bullshit (ie pandering to the worst reactionary "anti-fascist" bollocks ie class prejudice masquerading as anti-racism, taking the piss out of their educational level, literacy etc) compared to how he see this.

It's entirely consistent if you start from a point where the dynamic is clever enlightened people vs thickos and the wilfully ignorant.

 

[frogwoman]

It's entirely consistent if you start from a point where the dynamic is clever enlightened people vs thickos and the wilfully ignorant.

Exactly, it's just elitism. WAKE UP SHEEPLE! etc

 

[butchersapron]

It's entirely consistent if you start from a point where the dynamic is clever enlightened people vs thickos and the wilfully ignorant.

...and it's this aspect that always gives opposition to this stuff a certain amount of bite. They've already made it nasty and personal because their whole start point is calling everyone else mugs.

 

[frogwoman]

but so much liberal "anti-racism" and "left wing" stuff is like that, thinking that "the public" are stupid and believe this shit.

are they not part of the public themselves?

 

[8ball]

Most people are mugs tbf.