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Why Conspiracy Theorists are so prevalent.

I just hope they step in before we all go kaboom! (like those monks remote viewed, I like to think that monks wouldn't lie, well, I've never knowingly been lied to by a monk)

But yeah, we'd probably end up shooting the first (official announced ;) ) scout mission to this planet, we're twitchy little fuckers.
 
The way I view it, modern democracy is like a jigsaw, with so many multi-coloured elements (parliaments, extra-governmental influences, ministerial lobbies etc etc) making up the whole picture.

Those who are wise refer to the picture on the box lid when putting together their jigsaw. They end up with something approximating reality.

Some people (not so wise) work by the picture they have in their minds of what the completed puzzle should look like: They tend to end up with slightly caricatured versions of the picture, with the pieces forced together in ways that don't quite fit.

Then there are those who put together bits and pieces -- say they collect edge pieces, or only sky blue pieces -- and kid themselves they're well on the way to completing the puzzle.

This last lot you could compare to the conspiracy theorists.

They have all the pieces, and a rough plan (in their heads) of how to complete the puzzle, but because they haven't seen the box lid and can't imagine what it looks like, they are doomed to come up with stunted versions of the whole picture.

(Never mind the fact that they will often rope in pieces from unrelated jigsaws, or use past jigsaws as guidance for their current project).

This might make it sound like I am unsympathetic to conspiracy theorists.

Not at all.

You don't have to believe that the whole world is a conspiracy in order to hold some conspiratorial viewpoints.

But for the usual meaning of 'conspiracy theorist' I think that the above should do.

Christopher Hitchens, in one of his more perceptive essays, called CTs "the exhaust fumes of democracy".

Perhaps that's it, and we should learn to accept that we will always have them with us as part and parcel of the privilege of free speech and (relatively) uncensored communication.
 
Conspiracy theories are just a distraction really. There's plenty of stuff going on that's really fucking bad or shocking and there is no real attempt to cover it up, stuff like the gas hydrate problem (for example) or the new Justice and Security Act. Surely even the worst chemtrail believing 9/11 denying tin foil hat wearing pentawater salesman should have the common sense to realise that it makes sense to fight the battles you can see in front of you if they are bad enough - and believe me they are.
 
xes said:
I like to think that monks wouldn't lie
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Oh dear.

I hate to despoil your innocence, but monks are the best liars in the world. In fact they invented lying.

Ignatius_Loyola_-_Loyola_Academy.jpg
 
belboid said:
Those things are at least scientifically possible, unlike many of the CT claims. Do you really believe it is just as daft to believe that Saddam might have had WMDs as it is to believe that there is a secret cabal of Jews (many pretending not to be Jews) who are clandestinely controlling the world? The former requires some ignorance about the world, and human psychology, the latter requires all that twohundred fold. The former can be rationally based (using false inputs), the latter cant be.

You're basically saying that there is no difference between CTs and the mainstream media, but there is. The two are not flip sides of the same coin, they are not thesis and antithesis. Which isnt to say the MSM is 'right,' but its usually wrong in a very different way.
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i just believe what Hitler said about lies, keep repeating them and suckers will believe them . If the MSM started saying the same thing about jew conspiracies plenty would believe it . Thats been proven in Europe already . Winston Churchill was saying the same thing and hes about to go on a 5 pound note .

Bullshit is still bullshit and bullshitters are still bullshitters . All it boils down to at the end of the day .
 
stuff_it said:
<snip>There's plenty of stuff going on that's really fucking bad or shocking and there is no real attempt to cover it up, stuff like the gas hydrate problem (for example) or the new Justice and Security Act. Surely even the worst chemtrail believing 9/11 denying tin foil hat wearing pentawater salesman should have the common sense to realise that it makes sense to fight the battles you can see in front of you if they are bad enough - and believe me they are.
Click to expand...
Word.
 
frogwoman said:
i hope so mate, it would be so great to find an intelligent life form from another planet, and converse with them, learn from/about them, their experiences, views, life, etc. I just hope that we dont end up killing them all as the ruling classes are prone to do.
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sorry, im in the kill them first ask questions later camp . Unless of course its obvious theyd win, in which case Ill be in the I for one welcome our new overlords camp. Naturally .
 
Casually Red said:
i just believe what Hitler said about lies, keep repeating them and suckers will believe them . If the MSM started saying the same thing about jew conspiracies plenty would believe it . Thats been proven in Europe already . Winston Churchill was saying the same thing and hes about to go on a 5 pound note .

Bullshit is still bullshit and bullshitters are still bullshitters . All it boils down to at the end of the day .
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No it isn't. That's you being an elitist, that is.
 
phildwyer said:
Of course. Witchcraft has always been and still remains far more efficacious than any Enlightenment psychology or physiology.
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One of these days that tongue will stick permanently in your cheek. Or does "witchcraft" include the placebo effect and anecdotal evidence about the way in which a confident doctor (or other trained and qualified medic or paramedic) with a good so-called bedside manner can treat patients more effectively than one with equal competence but no bedside manner and little ability to persuade their patients of their competence?
 
phildwyer said:
<snip>monks are the best liars in the world. In fact they invented lying.<snip>
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No, you're looking far too late in human history. Experts of some sort (which includes members of proto priesthoods as well as priesthoods) are, have been, and ever will be the best liars.

Not because they're born more dishonest than anyone else, but because they're in a position of informational advantage. One of the groups I'd nominate for "best premonk liar" would be those who cobbled together disparate local myths* into what later became the Old Testament.


*including turning Tiamat's necklace into the end of the OT story of The Flood.
 
Conspiracy Theorists apparently cannot see that the world is just full of mad bastards as well as evil geniuses who rise to the top of their game be it in politics, science or whatever.
It is a default setting in the human psyche to dismiss any unexplainable or illogical event as either being:
A; God, whichever form you believe in.
B; The Devil, whichever form you believe in.
C; Aliens, whichever form you believe in.
D; Government or Elitist conspiracy.
E; Human form Lizards.
Without actually having to rationalise CTers can live their lives in a fantasy world were they do not have to get involved or attempt to change anything. They can just sit at home without going out to vote, protest, strike, petition, complain or riot!
There is that much misinformation and deceit flowing out of magazines, the internet and that shit pump in the corner of everyone's room that it is easy to become paranoid.
Orwell and Huxley painted a pretty representative idea of their future, our present world.
Big Brother is watching, he is to the extent of population control, but also by self imposed fear and lack of will to fight against it.
Soma for the people, TV and Media to keep the people calm and relaxed.
You could almost think there was a conspiracy going on.:)
 
stuff_it said:
Conspiracy theories are just a distraction really. There's plenty of stuff going on that's really fucking bad or shocking and there is no real attempt to cover it up, stuff like the gas hydrate problem (for example) or the new Justice and Security Act. Surely even the worst chemtrail believing 9/11 denying tin foil hat wearing pentawater salesman should have the common sense to realise that it makes sense to fight the battles you can see in front of you if they are bad enough - and believe me they are.
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I agree with that in the sense that wibbling on about loon CT stuff is a distraction from the real government and corporate horrors, and immersing yourself into CT activity actually gets in the way of proper investigation of the real enemy.

Gets in the way to the extent that a tempting CT is that MI5/CIA/<insert name of even more shadowy black ops agencies here>/etc are behind the dissemination of all the most hatstand CT stuff :D :cool:

On the other hand, if I was involved in proper investigative research and digging, and/or activism and campaigning against The Man (the real Man that is, the actually existing Man, not some Man I made up), the last people I'd want joining our campaigns and research networks would be CT obsessives.

That'd be really shit for PR and credibility :p
 
phildwyer said:
The popular vogue for empiricism and materialism is the most acute symptom of the difficulty in critical thinking under modern conditions.
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In other words, empiricism and materialism currently prevent you from getting away with spouting/publishing the most egregious examples of the crap you think up. :)
 
ViolentPanda said:
In other words, empiricism and materialism currently prevent you from getting away with spouting/publishing the most egregious examples of the crap you think up. :)
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There's no doubt empiricism/materialism/rationalism holds the dominant position with regards to knowledge production. But hey, stuff works...what would you suggest we use instead phildwyer? What epistemological tradition are you punting?
 
Gnome Chompsky said:
There's no doubt empiricism/materialism/rationalism holds the dominant position with regards to knowledge production. But hey, stuff works...what would you suggest we use instead phildwyer? What epistemological tradition are you punting?
Click to expand...

Whichever tradition someone wants a book or article written in. He's not fussy. He's an equal opportunities pen-for-hire*. :)

* I say this as someone who's read two of his books, and a dozen or so articles. Still, I may be biased by also having read his "rational proof of G-d's existence" thread, and spent a lot of the time thinking "what an absolute arse!". ;)
 
Ok just did a quick, albeit Wiki based :oops: refresher on Empiricism. Doesn't seem such an evil thought process to me.

Especially when it emphasises evidence (and logic), empiricism seems to be what Conspiracy Theorists are incapable of employing principles of, or even understanding.

Other things they can't do :

1. Assess the sources they've decided they like critically/questioningly/sceptically
2. Reach conclusions after doing research
3. Do research.
4. Look at any sources that run any risk of contradicting them
4. Tell the difference between being sceptical aboiut conspiracy theories, and unquestioningly believing every single thing that the government tells you -- sheeple like!!!11!!!111 :p
 
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