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Why are Leave voters expected to compromise?

when unable to understand what people are saying to you rather than asking for clarification responding instead to some question you've invented isn't particularly adult either.

If only more people dared to admit that something another person uttered is unclear to them and ask for explanation, the
world would be a little bit better. You know, there's nothing humiliating, embarrassing or what have you to state that you don't understand something someone else has brought to light. If anything,m it shows honesty and not being afraid of being caught off guard - what's wrong with that?

For what it's worth, I merely stated a fact, but hey as the saying goes: Whom the cap fits, should wear it.
 
You still just don't seem to grasp the concept of a binary choice, the winner-takes-all etc. That's what a two choices system is all about; should it be abandoned because in this case the outcome doesn't coincide with what a minority feels?
It was an utterly flawed exercise, that should never have been undertaken. Any small amount of forethought would have make any but the silliest person realise that offering a binary choice on such a complex issue was doomed from the outset to end badly.

And, if it is to be abandoned, then the last reason for doing so would be because "the outcome doesn't coincide with what a minority feels" (leaving aside the question of whether it is still a minority in any case).

No, the reason for abandoning it would be because the government had thoughtlessly embarked us on a course which has proved to be as unworkable as any sensible person would have realised it was from the start. After forty years of membership, our systems, cultures, and processes are far too entangled for them to be swiftly or easily separated in the simplistic way many of the more strident Leave supporters would have us believe they want. And it is very likely that far more of those who voted Leave did so in ignorance of the difficulties (largely thanks to some very dubious campaigning).

No, the honourable thing to do now would be for the Government to go back to the people, apologise for inviting them to make a choice that could never be honoured, and do some serious grown-up work on figuring out exactly what the real problems around our membership of the EU are, and what the solutions might be, including if necessary renegotiating the terms of our membership.

But nobody in Government, let alone the Tory party, is going to have the integrity to make that kind of admission. So I guess we're stuck with this mess until it all falls apart. Whatever that ends up meaning.
 
You still just don't seem to grasp the concept of a binary choice, the winner-takes-all etc. That's what a two choices system is all about; should it be abandoned because in this case the outcome doesn't coincide with what a minority feels?
i entirely understand a binary choice. but it's not 'winner takes it all', not if you want social peace. as i pointed out above, you don't know why people voted leave. indeed, you said to find out what terms people want there'd need to be a second referendum. which many leave voters (and indeed many remain voters) are wholly opposed to. so you've compromised yourself here, in all senses of the word.
 
If only more people dared to admit that something another person uttered is unclear to them and ask for explanation, the
world would be a little bit better. You know, there's nothing humiliating, embarrassing or what have you to state that you don't understand something someone else has brought to light. If anything,m it shows honesty and not being afraid of being caught off guard - what's wrong with that?

For what it's worth, I merely stated a fact, but hey as the saying goes: Whom the cap fits, should wear it.
if there's nothing humiliating or embarrassing about why didn't you ask what i meant in my post 153 rather than offer a reply (your 154) which makes you look like a lackwit?
 
Although Norway can be considered a country that's 'associated' to the EU, they're not an EU member state. What are you aiming at?
I'm aiming at providing you with a little reassurance as you appear to be getting yourself into something of a tizz.

The referendum, as you point out, asked a binary question: leave the EU yes/no. The majority of those polled said 'leave'. Norway is not in the EU, so a deal like that which is enjoyed by Norway or something very similar to it would wholly fulfil the single wish expressed by the 52 % in the binary referendum to leave the EU. No compromise involved at all.

Hope that allays your fears over this matter. :)
 
The signal:noise ratio in what you write is lamentably low, particularly in view of how much effort you put into criticising the way others express themselves over what they are actually saying.

Too bad that neutral, objective facts seem to offend you, but it would help if you could narrow things down.
Not only does it make for better understanding, it prevents the whole going back and forth - BTW, I still don't know what you mean though.
 
Too bad that neutral, objective facts seem to offend you, but it would help if you could narrow things down.
Not only does it make for better understanding, it prevents the whole going back and forth - BTW, I still don't know what you mean though.
what he means is that most of what you write is nonsense and very little of it bears examination.
 
if there's nothing humiliating or embarrassing about why didn't you ask what i meant in my post 153 rather than offer a reply (your 154) which makes you look like a lackwit?

Well, first of all since your post wasn't unclear to me, I didn't ask for any clarification.
Second of all, what in my post #154 warrants the label 'lackwit' (don't even know what that means)?
I invite you to point out the wrongness of what I posted in #154.
 
Well, first of all since your post wasn't unclear to me, I didn't ask for any clarification.
Second of all, what in my post #154 warrants the label 'lackwit' (don't even know what that means)?
I invite you to point out the wrongness of what I posted in #154.
upload_2019-4-3_14-8-56.png
it bears no relation to what i said in 153, it does not follow on from it, it has no connection with what i said.
 
go back and read my post. then read your post again and think about why your 154 is not really an answer to my 153. if at first the reason isn't obvious reread the two posts. you may need to do this several times.
and Nik i don't know why you didn't do this ^^^ yesterday rather than saving it till today
 
Well, first of all since your post wasn't unclear to me, I didn't ask for any clarification.
Second of all, what in my post #154 warrants the label 'lackwit' (don't even know what that means)?
I invite you to point out the wrongness of what I posted in #154.
lackwit means stupid: lack wit.
 
I'm aiming at providing you with a little reassurance as you appear to be getting yourself into something of a tizz.

The referendum, as you point out, asked a binary question: leave the EU yes/no. The majority of those polled said 'leave'. Norway is not in the EU, so a deal like that which is enjoyed by Norway or something very similar to it would wholly fulfil the single wish expressed by the 52 % in the binary referendum to leave the EU. No compromise involved at all.

Hope that allays your fears over this matter. :)
Looks like Nik's going to ignore this.
 
I'm aiming at providing you with a little reassurance as you appear to be getting yourself into something of a tizz.

The referendum, as you point out, asked a binary question: leave the EU yes/no. The majority of those polled said 'leave'. Norway is not in the EU, so a deal like that which is enjoyed by Norway or something very similar to it would wholly fulfil the single wish expressed by the 52 % in the binary referendum to leave the EU. No compromise involved at all.

Hope that allays your fears over this matter. :)

You see, that's where you're grossly misinformed.
I for one wouldn't exactly equate 'being associated' with having left and neither would anyone that knows what the facts are.

Norway enjoys some benefits, but has absolutely nothing to say. Granted, they don't share in some of the burdens either, but that's what being an associated country - as opposed to being a full member - is all about.

Besides, which status the UK would get after it has left is up for negotiation - as said future arrangements are to be determined at a future date and in any case after th UK has left.....

Rest assured, I don't have any fears at all (nothing to fear at all).
 
You see, that's where you're grossly misinformed.
I for one wouldn't exactly equate 'being associated' with having left and neither would anyone that knows what the facts are.

Norway enjoys some benefits, but has absolutely nothing to say. Granted, they don't share in some of the burdens either, but that's what being an associated country - as opposed to being a full member - is all about.

Besides, which status the UK would get after it has left is up for negotiation - as said future arrangements are to be determined at a future date and in any case after th UK has left.....

Rest assured, I don't have any fears at all (nothing to fear at all).
we all have lots to fear, climate change, flu pandemics, the mass extinction event that's going on around us, the stupidity of those in power...

if you don't have any fears at all you've not been paying attention
 
Can you pinpoint some of the nonsense?
If not, your remark is just a gratuitous one.
i am explaining what existentialist said to you. so perhaps you should ask existentialist what you've said that he finds especially nonsensical.

or maybe do it the other way round and ask him if he can point to anything you've said which is sensible - that might be quicker.
 
You see, that's where you're grossly misinformed.
I for one wouldn't exactly equate 'being associated' with having left and neither would anyone that knows what the facts are.

Norway enjoys some benefits, but has absolutely nothing to say. Granted, they don't share in some of the burdens either, but that's what being an associated country - as opposed to being a full member - is all about.

Besides, which status the UK would get after it has left is up for negotiation - as said future arrangements are to be determined at a future date and in any case after th UK has left.....

Rest assured, I don't have any fears at all (nothing to fear at all).
Ah now. You're attempting to play around with language here. Norway is not an associate member of the EU. It is a member of EFTA (to which the UK belonged pre-EEC - rather an obvious place to return to post-EU) and has a series of bilateral agreements with the EU as a result of that, which involve a number of obligations and entitlements. You know, as happens in international treaties like trade agreements.

So you're basically talking out of your arse. Fuckety bye. :)
 
i am explaining what existentialist said to you. so perhaps you should ask existentialist what you've said that he finds especially nonsensical.

or maybe do it the other way round and ask him if he can point to anything you've said which is sensible - that might be quicker.
And my answer to Nik would be that it's not about what he's saying that's "nonsensical" so much as content-free. He seems to be long on posturing and criticising other people's expression, and very short on anything resembling actual fact. And, from what I can see, when he is brave enough to essay the occasional fact, he gets it completely arse about face (vide his exchange rate howler at Why are Leave voters expected to compromise?)
 
Ah now. You're attempting to play around with language here. Norway is not an associate member of the EU. It is a member of EFTA (to which the UK belonged pre-EEC - rather an obvious place to return to post-EU) and has a series of bilateral agreements with the EU as a result of that, which involve a number of obligations and entitlements. You know, as happens in international treaties like trade agreements.

So you're basically talking out of your arse. Fuckety bye. :)

Still doesn't rebut the fact that Norway is an associated member enjoying some of the benefits the EU offers.
Being one thing doesn't preclude you from being something else at the same time.
Same as f.i. being intelligent, but uttering stupid things at the same time.
One doesn't distract from the other being true at the same time.

I was asked a direct question and I answered to it.
 
Your 'fact' is not a fact. Norway is not an associate member of the EU. You have invented that as a category in order to claim that a Norway-style deal involves compromise by the 52 per cent. It does no such thing. A sizeable chunk of the 52 per cent will have had this kind of thing in mind when they voted - reasoning along the lines of 'we want the common market but not the other stuff'. Now I may not agree with that. I don't. But it's a very long way from the kinds of things May and others have been seeking.

I don't pretend to represent the wishes of others, but you appear to think that you do. You appear to think that just because you voted leave with a particular outcome in mind, so did all the others who voted leave, despite the vote being a simple binary question, as you yourself pointed out. Well you don't.
 
And my answer to Nik would be that it's not about what he's saying that's "nonsensical" so much as content-free. He seems to be long on posturing and criticising other people's expression, and very short on anything resembling actual fact. And, from what I can see, when he is brave enough to essay the occasional fact, he gets it completely arse about face (vide his exchange rate howler at Why are Leave voters expected to compromise?)

Call it whatever you want to and go on wildly beating at anything around you, but the fact of the matter is that the question I raised has yet to be answered.
For reference, the question is: Why are Leave voters expected to compromise?
Someone tried to answer it, but they failed (miserably, I might add).
 
Call it whatever you want to and go on wildly beating at anything around you, but the fact of the matter is that the question I raised has yet to be answered.
For reference, the question is: Why are Leave voters expected to compromise?
Someone tried to answer it, but they failed (miserably, I might add).
who is expecting leave voters to compromise?
 
Your 'fact' is not a fact. Norway is not an associate member of the EU. You have invented that as a category in order to claim that a Norway-style deal involves compromise by the 52 per cent. It does no such thing. A sizeable chunk of the 52 per cent will have had this kind of thing in mind when they voted - reasoning along the lines of 'we want the common market but not the other stuff'. Now I may not agree with that. I don't. But it's a very long way from the kinds of things May and others have been seeking.

I don't pretend to represent the wishes of others, but you appear to think that you do. You appear to think that just because you voted leave with a particular outcome in mind, so did all the others who voted leave, despite the vote being a simple binary question, as you yourself pointed out. Well you don't.

I don't know where you get the idea that I have to invent stuff.
I don't need to as others you know well may do. As said, I'm calling them as I see them.
What you're doing is splitting hairs (BTW, quite an admirable quality if you are good at it).
In case you have a better word than 'associated country', may I suggest we use that word.

How do you know what 'a sizeable chunk of the 52 per cent will have had this kind of thing in mind when they voted' thought?
Did they tell you or are you interpreting thoughts/wishes of others?

On one thing we agree though, the 'deal' that the PM seems to have come up with isn't even worth the paper it is written on (I'd say this even if the reported 585 pages comments are wrong). As an MEP pointed out quite correctly the other day: it's not Brexit, not even BRINO (BRexit In Name Only); it's fake Brexit. And before everyone jumps on me, I'm paraphrasing - I don't pretend to know the exact words she used.

Wanting to put the so-called deal before the House of Commons again, reminds me of a definition Einstein once supposedly gave.
 
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