Transgender hate crimes recorded by police go up 81%

[Rob Ray]

The economic left/social right mob of which Embery is a prominent member have always been with us to one degree or another, a previous generation were busy in the trade unions telling women to wait their turn.

 

[krtek a houby]

With some of the commentary here, it almost feels like the eighties again... the sheer hatred and ignorance from some elements who would have seen gay people silenced or worse.

We're better than this, right?

We've moved on, surely?

I was a pacifist back then.

But at this age, enough is enough. Had a byline or a tagline (dunno proper description) saying "arm the LGBT". It was half serious half joking.

Don't know what it means now.

I see the death threats and hatred out there, not here but beyond the urban bubble. I hope it doesn't slip into this site.

There's people who want to cage us or kill us. That's why urban needs to stamp out the phobes. They've had their say and their say is shit. Ban them. They aren't adding anything to the conversation.

(Am angry as fuck, so realise that my rant isn't necessarily the way to go)

Apologies for not being as erudite as the others here. Your words and experience means so much.

 

[Cloo]

Already happened, butch women have been stopped from using women's toilets and transvestigators are a thing. I'm dreading the TERF reaction to Christiane Endler, because she's cis but you just know some of them will assume she's trans because she's over 6ft.

Indeed - just saw a trans woman posting about how her (cis) sister got targetted by transphobes for being 6ft 3. The poster herself at 6ft is shorter than her cis sisters because she comes from a tall family. I've seen film of literally a very feminine looking woman but with cropped hair wearing sportswear was questioned by some busybody in the loos.

As you say Lotte these people seem to expend all their mental effort on trans people and none on more pressing issues, it really seems to addle their brains.

Like, why in the hell would men need to pretend to be women to 'destroy women's rights' in some nebulous way when the American Supreme Court can just remove tens of millions of women's (and others with uteruses') fucking bodily autonomy in one fell swoop against all public opinion?

How much money and effort is being expended in a moral panic about women's safety from a tiny % of assaults carried out by men dressed as women and on a handful of occasions trans women when many rape survivors recommend not pressing charges because the whole process of trying to get justice is so utterly devastating and fruitless?

 

[Lotte]

It's like the obsession with toilets. Signs are not barriers. A rapist doesn't need to dress up as a woman to rape.

Re abortion, I remember people asking why the hell JKR wasn't commenting on Roe vs Wade being overturned and the reply was 'she's not American, it doesn't affect her'. Well, she's not American or a swimmer but it didn't stop her commenting on Lia Thomas, despite Thomas not affecting her either. And I'd argue Roe vs Wade being overturned was far worse for women than the things JKR gets upset about, but of course TERFs blamed trans people and allies for abortion being overturned because either they weren't focusing enough on protecting it, or Roe vs Wade was overturned because the right were just that fed up of trans people.

 

[danny la rouge]

in this debate you're not expressing the views that lead people to be accused of bigotry or insufficient compassion.

I don’t know if that's a reference to my posts but in case of any misunderstanding, I’m not accusing you of having insufficient compassion. In fact I wouldn’t have made those posts had I believed that to be the case.

 

[danny la rouge]

What equivalence, if any, do you draw between the two different phenomena?

Copping out and self defeating ness? They overlap.

 

[Dystopiary]

Cis women in prison apparently aren't worth caring about at the moment - they don't seem to matter until HEADLINES about trans women being sent to jail reappear.

Never mind actual abuse that women experience in prison. Never mind that a massively disproportionate amount of those women have mental health issues, are from disadvantaged backgrounds, and have experienced domestic abuse. Never mind the lack of support for them. All that can be ignored. Because women's rights or something.

 

[smokedout]

Smokedout, you've articulated it better than I could. Glinner almost never talks about abortion, equal pay, femicide, FGM, I'd bet he won't be talking about this horrible new AI beauty contest either, and on the rare occasions he does, it always comes back to trans people. Embery and Walsh are even worse - isn't Embery one of those 'women are happier being homemakers and raising kids' red/brown types? I bet if England women had lost the Euro final, Embery would have gone on about how women's football is woke lefty nonsense that nobody cares about. (I read the report on the BBC of Everton v Brighton a few days ago and it was depressing how many comments had been deleted, and I can guess why)

I think it's also notable how many cis men relish a form of feminism and that is not critical of them in any way and gives them a justification to dismiss and talk over women who disagree with them, police the borders of masculinity and tell people they consider women (trans men and afab non binary people) what they should be permitted to do with their bodies.

 

[belboid]

I think it's also notable how many cis men relish a form of feminism and that is not critical of them in any way and gives them a justification to dismiss and talk over women who disagree with them, police the borders of masculinity and tell people they consider women (trans men and afab non binary people) what they should be permitted to do with their bodies.

Quite oddly, many will also speak up in support of a separatist form of feminism which says all men are rapists. I suppose it helps them to think they are still being radical.

 

[Clair De Lune]

I'm very sorry to hear that, and it's not something I'd wish on anyone.

Thanks, I appreciate that.

 

[Balbi]

And bang on time the fucking transphobes are citing Cass as they attempt to get Pride and Pride related events stopped in Manchester because they're a "super spreader event for gender theory, queer theory and the profoundly damaging activities of the LGBT cult".

Being shared by noted headcase Claire Fox.



Yes this is insane, but looks at how dead eyed transphobia and Cass are combining to go after the entire LGBT community now by pathologising trans identity, allowing this quasi pandemic language to be aimed at the community.

 

[belboid]

And bang on time the fucking transphobes are citing Cass as they attempt to get Pride and Pride related events stopped in Manchester because they're a "super spreader event for gender theory, queer theory and the profoundly damaging activities of the LGBT cult".

Being shared by noted headcase Claire Fox.

View attachment 421225

Yes this is insane, but looks at how dead eyed transphobia and Cass are combining to go after the entire LGBT community now by pathologising trans identity, allowing this quasi pandemic language to be aimed at the community.

Jesus, a quick google make him look completely insane (and, this, an Institute of StupidIdeas lecturer)

After a career in adult learning, Barry was forced to join the fight against the new intolerance and deranging ideas such as queer theory and gender identity ideology.

His business lost contracts because he refused to play ball with the anti-science, misogynistic and homophobic edicts of the Trans Rights Activists and Social Justice Warriors plaguing the university sector.

For a number of years, he has been a strong voice in activism and has his own YouTube channel, Court of the EDIJester.

He designed and personally hosts The Winning Mindset Seminars helping anyone who joins fight back against wokery and the anti-enlightenment mob.

 

[Balbi]

And yet there he is being retweeted by a member of the House of Lords, Baroness Fox. You know the once from Spiked who became a Brexit MEP and was rewarded by Boris.

This is just some psycho, but he's a psycho who's got a member of the upper house of legislature supporting his psycho shit.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

I had withdrawn from these debates for a long time. It’s only recently that I came to the realisation that doing so was a cop out and self defeating.

dunno really.

i put a few threads - and one or two individuals - on ignore a few years back.

partly in the interests of maintaining healthy blood pressure, and also so as not to get banned which was getting likely...

 

[Lotte]

Quite oddly, many will also speak up in support of a separatist form of feminism which says all men are rapists. I suppose it helps them to think they are still being radical.

Oh, there are definitely men who think that, and that men need women to tame their wilder urges. And that they need to protect 'their' women from threats.

 

[Lotte]

Cis women in prison apparently aren't worth caring about at the moment - they don't seem to matter until HEADLINES about trans women being sent to jail reappear.

Never mind actual abuse that women experience in prison. Never mind that a massively disproportionate amount of those women have mental health issues, are from disadvantaged backgrounds, and have experienced domestic abuse. Never mind the lack of support for them. All that can be ignored. Because women's rights or something.

Suicide and self-harm rates are absolutely horrific in women's prisons. Good luck getting JK Rowling to care about that though.

I knew Bev Craig at Manchester University and she was one of the chairs of the LGBT Society. She was openly and proudly lesbian. Good luck getting her to ban Pride, Barry, you twat. And people who whine about ~social justice warriors~ have never, in my experience, cared about homophobia or misogyny. Plenty of them sneer at feminists. And if you're against homophobia, why are you going on about the 'LGBT cult'?

 

[Balbi]

You know how trans and ally posters point out how exhausting all this is? In ten days it's gone from hey we'd like better healthcare to, no healthcare for trans youth, an enquiry into adult healthcare for trans people and now they're going after Pride parade as a whole?

You've got columnists saying that they've won the battle but prepare for war, on gender. That's chilling. No doubt a Hadley Freeman or a Terfina Tory-Bangs is writing a column stroking their chin and going "yes what about Pride if Cass says social transition should have clinical guidance".

It's having to fight on literally every front of public existence for stakes which on this side of the fence are existence and for the transphobes is absolute zero. If trans people continue to exist in public they lose nothing, but if they get what they want then trans people lose everything.

Not just trans folks, the whole LGBTQi community, and as I've said before once they've got that rolled up it'll set the stage for attacks on women's healthcare and bodily autonomy.

Oh yeah at some point the liberal terfs will clutch their heads and say "no, I just wanted to stop trans people I didn't want this extensive anti LGBTQi right wing project" and the only response you can give to that is "You were told what this was, and what it meant, but you made common cause with the far right and ignored the community outright telling you the score".

 

[Lotte]

It is genuinely frightening, because they will not stop with trans people. Those lesbians who team up with homophobes are going to find out the hard way. I've already seen a few comments about bringing back Section 28.

 

[InArduisFouette]

It's like the obsession with toilets. Signs are not barriers. A rapist doesn't need to dress up as a woman to rape.

Re abortion, I remember people asking why the hell JKR wasn't commenting on Roe vs Wade being overturned and the reply was 'she's not American, it doesn't affect her'. Well, she's not American or a swimmer but it didn't stop her commenting on Lia Thomas, despite Thomas not affecting her either. And I'd argue Roe vs Wade being overturned was far worse for women than the things JKR gets upset about, but of course TERFs blamed trans people and allies for abortion being overturned because either they weren't focusing enough on protecting it, or Roe vs Wade was overturned because the right were just that fed up of trans people.

the ironic thing is the best 'social engineering' tool for access to something like toilets or a semi secure area of any premises is a pair of overalls, a clipboard and toolbox , second best is a police uniform ...

when 'manly man' won't touch a tape measure or a stethoscope becasue it's pink or purple ... do you really think a rapist is going to dress as a woman to access spaces?

what is also very telling about the peopel who try the toilet or changing room guff as intellectual masturbation is their behaviour descriptions around these facilities read like the behaviour of boys in a Mid C20th Minor public school...

 

[InArduisFouette]

Quite oddly, many will also speak up in support of a separatist form of feminism which says all men are rapists. I suppose it helps them to think they are still being radical.

which is where the Politicla Lesbian movement comes from, women who aren;t lesbians because they are sexually and romantically atteacted to other femme aligned people but becasue they want to punish men

 

[planetgeli]

which is where the Politicla Lesbian movement comes from, women who aren;t lesbians because they are sexually and romantically atteacted to other femme aligned people but becasue they want to punish men

Oh come on. That's not true. The two are not mutually exclusive.

 

[smokedout]

And the physical strength argument falls down when it comes to snooker, not to mention that snooker has mixed tournaments. Arm length doesn't matter because you can use a cue extender. But you still get people calling for trans snooker players to be banned.

I think this really reveals that fairness is not the real motivation for rigidly segregating sport by sex. If being tall really is an advantage in snooker then surely the fair thing to do would be to segregate by err .. height.

 

[Rob Ray]

It doesn't seem very coherently thought through whether a given sport actively segregates according to actual tiers of advantageous physical traits afaics, beyond women/men. Combat sports and lifting often do weight class I guess? But you don't get eg. sprint tiering according to fast-twitch muscle fibre prevelance, or indeed the differentiation of men according to tiers of testosterone. You're just lucky if you've got a good amount of useful stuff in you.

 

[Balbi]

It's a deliberate trap isn't it. Defining a woman by testosterone level meant a lot of middle distance black women who'd been whooping the pants off white women were banned from the sport unless they took drugs to artificially reduce their testosterone.

Doping, but only because of a natural advantage is incredible.

Then you've got the blanket bans of participation in sports which includes darts or chess or some shit these days, and is being encouraged in wider and wider fields.

That's the trap part, because a lot of the rules supported and sometimes written by anti trans groupw state no trans woman who has gone through male puberty can compete as an adult.

But the same groups who pushed for this specific wording are the same ones who've advocated for banning puberty blockers, meaning that no trans woman would ever qualify.

"You can't compete because we introduced a rule saying you can't compete if you went through male puberty and we also lobbied to force you to go through male puberty" is breathtakingly cruel when you see it coming from one single ideological faction.

 

[Rob Ray]

Another tragic thing about it will be that truly exceptional sportswomen will never be simply celebrated again, there will always be a tinge of "oh but what if she's too close to being a man." I shudder to think how these arseholes would have treated the likes of Beryl Burton.

 

[Balbi]

Oh you do not want to see what the freaks in the anti trans movement say about non-white athletes, especially black and Asian ones.

The last Olympics was awful enough with the way they treated Laurel Hubbard but the Chinese track teams got heavily transvestigated because how can they be women and look like that (being incredibly lean, fit, athletes)

 

[smokedout]

My one moment of sporting greatness was winning the high jump on sports day in the last year of middle school when I was 12. After years of sporting failures I was finally on my way.

I tried out for it when I got to upper school the next Summer. I was faced with giants. The field of participation with the move to a bigger school had trebled. I was an August birthday so one of the youngest in my year and puberty kicked in quite late whilst it was obvious a lot of the boys had matured massively over the year. I came last. It was shit.

Games was miserable. My skinny 7 stone body was up against kids who were pretty much physically men and quite a few of them didn't like me much. It was humiliating and frequently very painful and put me off sport for life (luckily I had an enlightened games teacher who quickly decided that as long as I turned up and signed the register, and changed out of my uniform, I could go off on a 'cross country run', which meant fuck off and go smoke in the woods behind the school, I don't care as long as I don't get in trouble).

Sport isn't fair. It excludes huge amounts of people who's bodies don't fit. Elite sport is totally out of reach for the vast majority who aren't born with whatever physical characteristics ensure success. Sport could be a lot fairer, and more inclusive, and women's sports are a vital part of that, but rigid sex segregation whilst ignoring the differences between bodies of the same sex still excludes many if not most people from a lot of sports. This could be a moment to start radically rethinking sports participation instead of just arguing for more exclusion.

 

[SpookyFrank]

It's very difficult to read this as anything other than criticism of people being bothered about women's sport:

0/10

Come on mate, seriously. Have some pride in your work at least.

 

[Callie]

Tangent so sorry but I have always wondered why P.E. at school wasn't taught in ability tiered classes. Not sure if that has ever changed. Tiered classes was the case for the majority of other subjects. I loathed PE to my core. I may have enjoyed and participated more if I wasn't in the same class as the school athletes and got to compete or interact with others at a similar level.

 

[Callie]

0/10

Come on mate, seriously. Have some pride in your work at least.

We are discussing the sport issue right now so it might be nice to hear santinos thoughts on the matter (or those who he represents?). Will you be clear Santino if any comments are your thoughts Vs represented thoughts? Or do the two align?