Proper Tidy
Arsed
Given he spent a decade doing it, I'm not sure he was trying to disrupt. More like gathering intelligence, surely.
Tout exposed Mark 'Stone/Kennedy' exposed as undercover police officer
- Thread starter butchersapron
- Start date
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
An extraordinary story, if it's true. I would love to read the view of Detective-Boy, though I'm sure he's got more sense than to contribute!
If it is true, I wonder if the officer would be employable again on general police duties. As Kaka Tim said, he won't have got to do any proper policing for ten years. Would he need re-training? I can't see how ten years without a break could be good for his own welfare and family life. I'd also question how effective it can have been in terms of crimes prevented or detected, or intelligence gathered. Us respectable taxpayers should be told. However, the eco types shouldn't complain too much. They got a willing volunteer who did driving and seems to have offered social support and counselling. For free, on the rates. As to whether it is legitimate for the state to spy on people who on the face of it were conspiring to at least talk about vandalism, and possibly involved or linked to vile ALF crime, well yes. definitely. Turns out, though, that if what people here say is true, you were all basically nice people and all he's done is demonstrate your innocence and essential good natures, which must be nice.
If it is true, I wonder if the officer would be employable again on general police duties. As Kaka Tim said, he won't have got to do any proper policing for ten years. Would he need re-training? I can't see how ten years without a break could be good for his own welfare and family life. I'd also question how effective it can have been in terms of crimes prevented or detected, or intelligence gathered. Us respectable taxpayers should be told. However, the eco types shouldn't complain too much. They got a willing volunteer who did driving and seems to have offered social support and counselling. For free, on the rates. As to whether it is legitimate for the state to spy on people who on the face of it were conspiring to at least talk about vandalism, and possibly involved or linked to vile ALF crime, well yes. definitely. Turns out, though, that if what people here say is true, you were all basically nice people and all he's done is demonstrate your innocence and essential good natures, which must be nice.
Why do you assume that he was meant to disrupt anything?
The amount of disruption caused to normal economic, industrial and developmental activity by "eco squatters" over the last twenty or thirty years has been steadily growing and has merited intelligence gathering. Infiltration is by far the most effective means of intelligence gathering and it's cost is repaid many times in the ability to properly understand, manage and respond to threats.
Random
Ethnic nalgocrat
Sounds likely.
As for what he's doing now - surely he's going to be very useful in training the next generation of infiltrators? Or a career as a private security cunsultant on 'eco-terrorism' probably beckons
I doubt it. Deep undercover officers, particularly when their cover ends up being broken, often end up with mental health problems anyway. Even short term undercover work is hugely risky for the individual officer and frequently causes some sort of stress / breakdown. If he was to be re-deployed to ordinary policing, yes he would be re-trained (probably from scratch after ten years).
They're not ... but strangely enough in the real world things aren't all or nothing ...
They're not ... but strangely enough in the real world things aren't all or nothing ...
but they were paying this geezer fuck knows how much - and probably others too - for 10 years!!! Are they really that much of a threat? I don't even know what they DO?
discokermit
Well-Known Member
yeh, the stress of sitting round smoking weed, parties and going camping for ten fucking years must have been awful.
AKA pseudonym
Well-Known Member
Well it examplifies amongst the other groups infilitrated, where the Police/state are very pro-active in protecting Big Business interests...
Updated Indy Article with some links to similar ops and advice....
discokermit
Well-Known Member
yeah you can imagine the odd one signing up to defeat terrorism or nazis or something but who thinks "I will infiltrate some hippies for 10 years" ????
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
Personally I think too much attention / concern has been applied to "eco squatters" ... but their actions have, over the past couple of decades, certainly put them firmly into the category where some intelligence gathering and monitoring is merited. Infiltration would certainly be a usual part of that and, to some extent, would not be particularly excessive. Whether it merits being continued for ten years I am less sure ... but there are always shortages of undercover resources and so someone somewhere will have been reviewing the situation and deciding that the intelligence obtained was worth the candle on a fairly regular basis. Without knowing what that intelligence was, and what it enabled to be done, it is not possible to judge whether that decision was sound or not. Part of the problem with intelligence is that it's success tends to be measured by what doesn't happen and so it doesn't lend itself to obvious performance indicators.
Whilst that might be nice if it is your only life, it is a little more stressful if it is not!
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
indeed , he was actually getting paid to do it
... AKA preventing crimes such as criminal damage, theft, violent disorder and assault ...
You imply that the police are protecting interests of Big Business which have no connection with crime at all. Big Business' activities are legal (at least insofar as their day to day operations are concerned) and, as such, they are entitled to the protection of the law. It is naive to think that the police shouldn't have a role in that.
Most police undercover officers are selected from amongst normal officers, usually fairly young in service before they have done too much and become too well known, at least for deeper undercover deployments. A few that I have met over the years have certainly been a little odd in one way or another!
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
Indeed . Theres a real danger these types might climb up a tree and play set of fucking pan pipes while wearing a funny peruvian style hat . Hence its worth diverting police resources and budgets to watching people do that while hoodies terrorise families to the extent they burn themselves and their disabled daughters to death because theyvveno prtection from a living hell.
Meanwhile big business is law abiding .
grit
an ugly force for good
They dont sign up, the are picked.
aye i've read plenty of undercover books, i was just trying to be obnoxious. Still can't work out why anyone would do this for years, often putting themselves in danger, knowing full well that they are totally expendable and will be dropped as soon as it suits...
i'mnotsofast
Well-Known Member
I take David Shayler at face value and believe he became an eco-squatter/transvestite/reincarnation of Christ after a genuine mental breakdown.
But I once read The Spy Who Came in From The Cold, and so part of me now wonders if he's really still sane and if he's actually working deep undercover as an incredible triple-bluff.
Here's a recent article about him: http://www.i-zeen.com/articles/From...=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+i-zeen/fBtH+(i-zeen)
And there was a brilliant interview with him in Vice, read it if you haven't already:
http://vice.typepad.com/vice_magazine/2009/08/david-shayler-reluctant-messiah-part-one.html
http://vice.typepad.com/vice_magazi...art-two-at-home-she-feels-like-a-tourist.html
But I once read The Spy Who Came in From The Cold, and so part of me now wonders if he's really still sane and if he's actually working deep undercover as an incredible triple-bluff.
Here's a recent article about him: http://www.i-zeen.com/articles/From...=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+i-zeen/fBtH+(i-zeen)
And there was a brilliant interview with him in Vice, read it if you haven't already:
http://vice.typepad.com/vice_magazine/2009/08/david-shayler-reluctant-messiah-part-one.html
http://vice.typepad.com/vice_magazi...art-two-at-home-she-feels-like-a-tourist.html
Brainaddict
slight system overdrive
Jesus, it must be horrible for the people who were actually close to him. Madness.
Casually Red
tomorrow belongs to me
he went to public school didnt he ? hardly surprising
he went to public school didnt he ? hardly surprising
watch it you'll get stalked worse than me!
i'mnotsofast
Well-Known Member
Eh? Story?
I remember this bloke from the G8 in Scotland, and at various things after that, didn't know him other than to say hello to though.
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