TfL "cull of buses" consultation

[PR1Berske]

A case of seeing this and thinking of U75

Sixteen London bus routes are to be withdrawn by the end of next year: 4, 11, 12, 14, 16, 24, 31, 45, 72, 74, 78, 242, 349, 521, C3, D7 (subject to consultation)

(Or "consultation")

Link: Central London Bus Review

 

[existentialist]

The 72 was always significant for me - it was my Royal Road to Central London (well, Hammersmith) from where I lived as a kid in Tolworth. Almost all of my Red Bus Rover escapades started with me jumping onto a 72 at Tolworth Tower. I might even have caught the last days of RTs on the route, IIRC - I started those escapades in around '73 or '74.

 

[golightly]

Just seen this news. This was following being informed that the frequency of the 36 and 52 is to be reduced. I am upset at the loss of the 12; it's a really useful route. know the rationale that we can easily change buses to make our journey, but as more routes get reduced or deleted this argument is not going to hold up.

 

[StoneRoad]

What is TfL's rationale behind this - I "thought" we were supposed to be encouraging the use of public transport ?

[Maybe I'll find out what their "public excuse" is, after doing some more research ...]

 

[skyscraper101]

The 14 is one of the slowest routes in London, I used to use it every day when I lived off the Fulham Road. Nevertheless it was well handy for getting all the way to Putney directly from central London. TBH withdrawing that and the 11 is a bit of a blow to Fulham. That's two very handy routes no longer there which will be a massive pain when there are engineering works on the district line.

Losing the 72 is also a bit of a kick in the teeth for Barnes too. Especially given it's already a massive pain not having Hammersmith Bridge in operation. That basically reduces by 50% the bus routes going up from Hammersmith to Barnes, and Roehampton.

 

[T & P]

What is TfL's rationale behind this - I "thought" we were supposed to be encouraging the use of public transport ?

[Maybe I'll find out what their "public excuse" is, after doing some more research ...]

It's due to the average speeds of those routes. Deemed too slow apparently.

And it is no surprise they are extremely slow. Traffic in London has become far worse not better in recent years, as a direct consequence of TFL's policy of discouraging people from using their cars by means of creating unbearable driving conditions. The problem with that is that buses can't fly, and get caught in the now constant daytime traffic jams across every thoroughfare in London.

 

[golightly]

The 14 is one of the slowest routes in London, I used to use it every day when I lived off the Fulham Road. Nevertheless it was well handy for getting all the way to Putney directly from central London. TBH withdrawing that and the 11 is a bit of a blow to Fulham. That's two very handy routes no longer there which will be a massive pain when there are engineering works on the district line.

Losing the 72 is also a bit of a kick in the teeth for Barnes too. Especially given it's already a massive pain not having Hammersmith Bridge in operation. That basically reduces by 50% the bus routes going up from Hammersmith to Barnes, and Roehampton.

Roehampton is isolated enough already.

 

[wtfftw]

Just seen this news. This was following being informed that the frequency of the 36 and 52 is to be reduced. I am upset at the loss of the 12; it's a really useful route. know the rationale that we can easily change buses to make our journey, but as more routes get reduced or deleted this argument is not going to hold up.

Yep. The 12 is a really useful bus.

Also interested to see the 45 is to be culled as they took away the (useful) part previously.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

The main rationale is finance. (see also the proposed major cuts to underground staff)

One of Mayor Johnson's last acts was to cook up a deal with Chancellor Osborne to remove national government funding for TFL, which as I understand it was previously justified in part on the grounds that plenty of people who are not London residents also use TFL services (commuters and visitors from the home counties, tourists from all round the world)

Had London elected what the tories considered the right colour mayor (or right colour rosetted mayor) then no doubt one of the first acts of the new mayor would have been to strike a 'new deal' with whitehall.

Covid has seriously buggered TFL's finances, and while emergency government money has been thorn at private sector bus and train operators with few strings, TFL is under pressure to get back to a 'sustainable' / break even position.

It is probably fair to say that bus passenger numbers are still nowhere near what they were pre-covid, especially when it comes to central london commuters getting from main line station to office. Whether now is quite the right time to make long term plans based on current use while government is still pushing a 'go back to work' line to people who are working from home, is another question - when infrastructure (bus garages, bits of railway line / station) is closed and demolished / sold off / built over, it gets expensive to get that capacity back.

 

[wtfftw]

Transport suffers deepest cuts after London subsidy axed | Transport | The Guardian

DfT faces cut of 37% as Transport for London prepares to lose entire operational budget by 2020, fuelling concerns over higher fares

amp.theguardian.com

There was that before and it's just got worse. Bloody Tories.

 

[T & P]

Meanwhile in Germany, to help people out with the recent sharp rise in the cost of living, they’re offering a de facto nationwide travelcard for all types of public transport for €9 a month for the next three months

Germany's 9-euro ticket coming June 1: What you need to know

The German federal government has cleared the way for the 9-euro public transport ticket to kick off on June 1, 2022. Here’s what expats need to know.

www.iamexpat.de

Imagine the chances of that ever happening in here Or even if you could get the countless private franchises running routes across the country to agree to such scheme, even as a one-off, I dread to think what price would they deem acceptable. £9 for a month? Try £399 and be grateful for it I reckon.

 

[PR1Berske]

 

[mango5]

That twitter thread is a horrible read

 

[wtfftw]

Maps

https://imgur.io/a/q0kwqCU

 

[teuchter]

Carnage on the buses (in central London)

Wednesday 1st June 2022 A blog post extra. Route 14 will be axed TfL’s much anticipated six week consultation about its “central London’s bus review” began today. It’s going to ta…

busandtrainuser.com

 

[Pickman's model]

Carnage on the buses (in central London)

Wednesday 1st June 2022 A blog post extra. Route 14 will be axed TfL’s much anticipated six week consultation about its “central London’s bus review” began today. It’s going to ta…

busandtrainuser.com

But what do you think?

 

[teuchter]

But what do you think?

I think it's worth reading, which is why I posted it.

 

[teuchter]

It's due to the average speeds of those routes. Deemed too slow apparently.

And it is no surprise they are extremely slow. Traffic in London has become far worse not better in recent years, as a direct consequence of TFL's policy of discouraging people from using their cars by means of creating unbearable driving conditions. The problem with that is that buses can't fly, and get caught in the now constant daytime traffic jams across every thoroughfare in London.

All of this post is basically nonsense.

It's due to funding cuts, in a country where nearly all forms of public transport are almost constantly under attack.

 

[8ball]

While I’m open to the idea that transport needs change over time, I’m sure we can agree that the people who use buses aren’t the people that the Tories are particularly concerned about.

 

[Raheem]

Also interested to see the 45 is to be culled as they took away the (useful) part previously.

And where will I put my brimful of Asha?

 

[teuchter]

While I’m open to the idea that transport needs change over time, I’m sure we can agree that the people who use buses aren’t the people that the Tories are particularly concerned about.

Yes, although this is less true in London, where a greater portion of the population uses buses than does elsewhere in the UK.

 

[Elpenor]

All of this post is basically nonsense.

It's due to funding cuts, in a country where nearly all forms of public transport are almost constantly under attack.

London has just spent literally billions on a new rail line as you well know as you’ve been a passenger on it

 

[T & P]

All of this post is basically nonsense.

It's due to funding cuts, in a country where nearly all forms of public transport are almost constantly under attack.

All of that post was based on a press article that claimed the axed routes were those with the slowest average speeds, and that was the reason for them being cut as they were deemed not fit for purpose It could be an excuse, of course…

 

[pseudonarcissus]

While I’m open to the idea that transport needs change over time, I’m sure we can agree that the people who use buses aren’t the people that the Tories are particularly concerned about.

 

[Raheem]

View attachment 325298

 

[pseudonarcissus]

There’s going to be a bus replacement service with his cardboard models

 

[8ball]

There’s going to be a bus replacement service with his cardboard models

Shit, I’d forgotten about the cardboard thing.

 

[teuchter]

London has just spent literally billions on a new rail line as you well know as you’ve been a passenger on it

I'm not sure what your point is.

 

[pseudonarcissus]

London has just spent literally billions on a new rail line as you well know as you’ve been a passenger on it

I can’t lay my hands on the statistics that the number of bus users in London is multiples of the underground ridership.

Cross rail was a bargain…half the cost of Dido Harding’s test and trace

 

[Pickman's model]

I think it's worth reading, which is why I posted it.

Why do you think it worth reading? What aspects particularly influenced your decision to share it?