Side-by-side cycling

[Orang Utan]

Hence "on open roads" comment...

Why does that make a difference?

 

[Saul Goodman]

Why does that make a difference?

His cycling cop friend said it does., so it's true.

 

[ska invita]

It's different because it has a dedicated cycle lane.
it's not just the bit where you're passing the cyclist that's dangerous, it's also when you are pulling out to overtake and then coming back in. If a cyclist is close to the kerb it just encourages cars to try and squeeze past - they mostly get it wrong.

Heres a really standard London suburban A road - one lane each way, often at peak times with a constant stream of traffic each way



If a bike is riding near the kerb at such a time are you saying you should never "overtake" unless you can go into the lane of oncoming traffic?

 

[Sprocket.]

Can you post me a hammer?

I have several, a plethora of mallets, planishers and mawls. Ball pein, cross pein, straight pein and chipping hammers. From 2oz to 14lb. All ready to go, cheap rates.

 

[Orang Utan]

Heres a really standard London suburban A road - one lane each way, often at peak times with a constant stream of traffic each way

View attachment 236055

If a bike is riding near the kerb at such a time are you saying you should never "overtake" unless you can go into the lane of oncoming traffic?

Yep, would you overtake a car in the same lane?

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Heres a really standard London suburban A road - one lane each way, often at peak times with a constant stream of traffic each way

View attachment 236055

If a bike is riding near the kerb at such a time are you saying you should never "overtake" unless you can go into the lane of oncoming traffic?

For starters nobody should ever be riding near the kerb.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Why does that make a difference?

Because you can see junctions/hazards coming from a distance away, there won't be a pedestrian to randomly step out etc

 

[Orang Utan]

Because you can see junctions/hazards coming from a distance away, there won't be a pedestrian to randomly step out etc

It’s not pedestrians that you should be worried about, but the cyclists who are too close to you to be safe on the road

 

[Raheem]

I was stuck behind the GB women's team the other day. They had a car behind them going super slow the protect them. They were definitely riding more than two abreast, though, so maybe I should report them.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

It’s not pedestrians that you should be worried about, but the cyclists who are too close to you to be safe on the road

Or ride with competent people?

 

[Saul Goodman]

Or ride with competent people?

They're cyclists, who don't know the Highway code.

 

[Orang Utan]

Or ride with competent people?

Or ride behind people at a safe distance ie one which you can brake safely and avoid colliding with another bike

 

[TopCat]

I should stop laughing reading this thread.

 

[Dogsauce]

How about riding in / on the cycle lane when one has been built alongside the road instead of on the carriageway ?

There are a number of places I pass regularly with perfectly good grade separated cycle paths, and still the cyclists stay on the main road ...

a lot of segregated paths don’t have many access/egress points, or are only accessed via crossings from side roads etc. If you’re unfamiliar with how to get onto a particular track and miss the entrance then it can be a long ride before you find a way onto it, unless you want to stop, clip out, lift your bike up onto the kerb, remount and move off again. Fuck that.

Plus a lot of them aren’t swept of debris, give way at side roads whereas the main carriageway doesn’t, don’t allow you to rejoin the road early enough to take up the right position for turning etc. Most are unusable, designed by traffic engineers that have never sat on a bike.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Or ride behind people at a safe distance ie one which you can brake safely and avoid colliding with another bike

Number of collisions with each other in a group in the time I've been with my club - zero.

Wish I could say the number was the same for people hit by cars whilst commuting/riding in cities etc

 

[sleaterkinney]

Heres a really standard London suburban A road - one lane each way, often at peak times with a constant stream of traffic each way

View attachment 236055

If a bike is riding near the kerb at such a time are you saying you should never "overtake" unless you can go into the lane of oncoming traffic?

Even if they are near the kerb(they shouldn’t be) you need to give room in case they swerve to avoid a pothole, if you are going over the central reservation it should be safe enough to go all the way over. You don’t have an automatic right to be able to pass traffic.

 

[Orang Utan]

Number of collisions with each other in a group in the time I've been with my club - zero.

you're all nutters

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

you're all nutters

Why, because we ride around and don't crash

 

[Orang Utan]

Why, because we ride around and don't crash

cos you ride so close to other riders

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Even if they are near the kerb(they shouldn’t be) you need to give room in case they swerve to avoid a pothole, if you are going over the central reservation it should be safe enough to go all the way over. You don’t have an automatic right to be able to pass traffic.

A rider should be a minimum 1m from the kerb. Then lets say 75cm width for bike and rider (this is actually pretty low, some MTB's will be wider still), then the 1.5m safe passing distance.

So the nearside of a passing car needs to be at least 3.25m from the kerb. There are very few roads in an urban environment (or elsewhere tbh) where this won't put a car over the white line.

 

[ska invita]

Even if they are near the kerb(they shouldn’t be) you need to give room in case they swerve to avoid a pothole, if you are going over the central reservation it should be safe enough to go all the way over. You don’t have an automatic right to be able to pass traffic.

you are living on a different planet to me
if any car were to slow down to a crawl to follow a slow bike (not everyone on a bike are lycra clad racers) on a road where there was plenty of space to overtake the world would end ...
ive had a license for over twenty years and i did a long stint as a van driver - never have I seen people not "overtake" - ie drive straightforward at a speed faster than a bicycle whilst theres plenty of room to do so.
no driver in the uk has ever done that, i would bet you, so why argue thats its some kind of norm thats being trasngressed?

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

you are living on a different planet to me
if any car were to slow down to a crawl to follow a bike (not everyone on a bike are lycra clad racers) on a road where there was plenty of space to overtake the world would end ...
ive had a license for over twenty years and i did a long stint as a van driver - never have I seen people not "overtake" - ie drive straightforward at a speed faster than a bicycle whilst theres plenty of room to do so.
no driver in the uk has ever done that, i would bet you, so why argue thats its some kind of norm thats being trasngressed?

See basic maths above. Your idea of "plenty of space" sounds rather different to what is considered safe.

 

[sleaterkinney]

you are living on a different planet to me
if any car were to slow down to a crawl to follow a bike (not everyone on a bike are lycra clad racers) on a road where there was plenty of space to overtake the world would end ...
ive had a license for over twenty years and i did a long stint as a van driver - never have I seen people not "overtake" - ie drive straightforward at a speed faster than a bicycle whilst theres plenty of room to do so.
no driver in the uk has ever done that, i would bet you, so why argue thats its some kind of norm thats being trasngressed?

I wish it was the norm, it’s not, and that’s down to shit driving. Have a cycle down a road like that and you will have a different opinion on what plenty of room is...
.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

cos you ride so close to other riders

It's less effort for more speed. Win win.

 

[Orang Utan]

It's less effort for more speed. Win win.

needlessly reckless imo

 

[Saul Goodman]

It's less effort for more speed. Win win.

If you're riding close enough to be in the slipstream of another cyclist, you're riding way too close and dangerously. If you saw car drivers doing it you'd be on here frothing about it.

 

[Spymaster]

Or ride with competent people?

There are about 3 competant cyclists in the United Kingdom. Are you suggesting they be shared around?

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

If you're riding close enough to be in the slipstream of another cyclist, you're riding way too close and dangerously. If you saw car drivers doing it you'd be on here frothing about it.

Well, you start to get the benefit from several metres away, so you’re even wrong on that point as well as everything else.

 

[Saul Goodman]

Well, you start to get the benefit from several metres away, so you’re even wrong on that point as well as everything else.

Get your calculator out.

At 3m the reduction in drag is zero.
If you're riding with 3m or less between you and the bike in front, you're riding dangerously.
Please try harder.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Get your calculator out.

At 3m the reduction in drag is zero.
If you're riding with 3m or less between you and the bike in front, you're riding dangerously.
Please try harder.

Both wind tunnel, cfd and real world testing have shown benefits up to 10 m away, aerodynamics is a somewhat more complex thing than your little equation.

Also, much lol at the idea of 3m being an unsafe distance on a bike.