NUS national protest against the cuts 10.11.10 [London]

[krtek a houby]

I just think that the amount of damage caused is going to have such a negative impact. There was little chance of us changing anythng anyway, without creating chaos. Students have a bad enough reputation as it is. The was it's being shown in the media, is that all students behaved like that, which means those of us who protested peacefully may as well not have been there, because the message we gave, has been stamped out by all of the violence.

Good luck to you. You're posting on a pro-violence thread, so I don't think you're going to win any converts.

In fairness to the shouties; they're all armchair warriors, their youth long slipped by, they've had to conform, conform, conform and as such they are consumed with self loathing. They could only dream of possessing the vitality of your cause. But being cynical, decaying elders they are too tainted by their disappointments and if they could steal your fire, they would stamp it out immediately and replace it with their own noxious conflagration.

 

[Paulie Tandoori]

I just think that the amount of damage caused is going to have such a negative impact. There was little chance of us changing anythng anyway, without creating chaos. Students have a bad enough reputation as it is. The was it's being shown in the media, is that all students behaved like that, which means those of us who protested peacefully may as well not have been there, because the message we gave, has been stamped out by all of the violence.

Do you honestly think that the media would be covering anything at all about student fees if you'd have all had a nice march and then gone home?

 

[Citizen66]

I just think that the amount of damage caused is going to have such a negative impact. There was little chance of us changing anythng anyway, without creating chaos. Students have a bad enough reputation as it is. The was it's being shown in the media, is that all students behaved like that, which means those of us who protested peacefully may as well not have been there, because the message we gave, has been stamped out by all of the violence.

How terrible for you. People angry and wanting to fight back against attacks on them from the monied class puts you in a bad light? Perhaps stay home and curl your hair instead next time.

 

[ymu]

I just think that the amount of damage caused is going to have such a negative impact. There was little chance of us changing anythng anyway, without creating chaos. Students have a bad enough reputation as it is. The was it's being shown in the media, is that all students behaved like that, which means those of us who protested peacefully may as well not have been there, because the message we gave, has been stamped out by all of the violence.

You'll learn.

 

[krtek a houby]

Are you that chap I've seen driving through red traffic lights?

Can't drive

 

[Random]

In fairness to the shouties; they're all armchair warriors, their youth long slipped by, they've had to conform, conform, conform and as such they are consumed with self loathing. They could only dream of possessing the vitality of your cause. But being cynical, decaying elders they are too tainted by their disappointments and if they could steal your fire, they would stamp it out immediately and replace it with their own noxious conflagration.

Yet more content-free posting. Sure of your arguments?

 

[Fruitloop]

For what its worth, a lot of us were pleasantly suprised.

 

[Random]

anyways, some eejit's fessed up to organising the bloody thing: http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/stand...tudent-fees-protest-thugs-must-be-punished.do

poor old revo, trying to claim credit and all the paper keeps saying is anarchists, anarchists anarchists

 

[Pickman's model]

Yet more content-free posting. Sure of your arguments?

content-free = no arguments.

 

[Ungrateful]

Thing is, unless he and moon23 etc are holding something back they don't have a tactical/strategical argument that holds water...so they fall back on moralism.

What do you mean by 'moralism'? Aren't having good principles vital for any radical action and goal. Usually it is the middle managers who go on about 'moralism' as if acting on just and fair principles or identifying attractive aims had nothing to do with them. The problem with Moon23 and Jer Babyllondon (and the the Sun, David Clegg and Nick Cameron), is precisely the inadequacy and inconsistency of their moral positions.

 

[Pickman's model]

poor old revo, trying to claim credit and all the paper keeps saying is anarchists, anarchists anarchists

anarchist federation? couldn't organise a meeting about defeating the trots without the trots winning the argument

 

[moon23]

Guido has just launched a £1000 reward for anyone who provides information on the thug that threw that fire extinguisher. Lets hope they catch them.

 

[Pickman's model]

Guido has just launched a £1000 reward for anyone who provides information on the thug that threw that fire extinguisher. Lets hope they catch them.

let's hope not, eh

 

[Orang Utan]

Good luck to you. You're posting on a pro-violence thread, so I don't think you're going to win any converts.

what violence?

 

[dylans]

Funny how not one of you can actually justify why violence should play a part in your political outlook.

Because it is effective. The very fact that this thread is 37 pages long and growing shows something of the impact of violent direct action. If yesterdays march had been a good natured stroll from A to B it would have merited a single column in a newspaper if they were lucky.

Because civil disobedience is justified, morally, politically and strategically.

Morally because it is in response to a widespread act of violence against the population of this country for the sole benefit of the rich. Violence against the symbols of power is an act of self defence. Politically because after betrayal after betrayal by our "elected representatives" the streets are all we have left.

Politically because it is the only thing that is taken seriously, non violent, legal, well behaved protest will be ignored and that is simply not an option for millions of people who are facing a future of misery and poverty as a result of these attacks. Strategically because by invading the Tory headquarters yesterdays demonstration has helped to shake the cynicism and apathy and defeatism of many people (including myself) who have been demoralised into inaction by the belief that there is no stomach in the country for a fightback against these blatant anti working class attacks.

For all the above reasons I make no apologies for applauding yesterdays action and I hope for more.

 

[Student_Teacher]

It will be easy to portray these protestors as immature yobs now they have started smashing stuff.

That's why I'm so riled about it, I went and said my bit, made my point, then came home, but I may aswell not have bothered, alongside the other 50,000 odd students who were also peaceful, because we're getting no credit or coverage. Not only that, but it's assumed that we were all behaving like that, which isn't fair.

 

[Random]

That's why I'm so riled about it, I went and said my bit, made my point, then came home, but I may aswell not have bothered, alongside the other 50,000 odd students who were also peaceful, because we're getting no credit or coverage. Not only that, but it's assumed that we were all behaving like that, which isn't fair.

You really think 'your point' would have been taken up by the media if not for the militant protestors?

 

[Belushi]

That's why I'm so riled about it, I went and said my bit, made my point, then came home, but I may aswell not have bothered, alongside the other 50,000 odd students who were also peaceful, because we're getting no credit or coverage. Not only that, but it's assumed that we were all behaving like that, which isn't fair.

You sound like one of the kids you're meant to be teaching.

 

[Fruitloop]

Look, you were never going to get a sympathetic hearing in the media, or peacefully change the minds of the current government. Can you understand that?

 

[krtek a houby]

what violence?

You mean who's pro-violence? Try and quote properly if you wish to have your say.

Read the thread again, or better still, read dylans post above.

 

[Pickman's model]

That's why I'm so riled about it, I went and said my bit, made my point, then came home, but I may aswell not have bothered, alongside the other 50,000 odd students who were also peaceful, because we're getting no credit or coverage. Not only that, but it's assumed that we were all behaving like that, which isn't fair.

life's not fair

 

[dylans]

That's why I'm so riled about it, I went and said my bit, made my point, then came home, but I may aswell not have bothered, alongside the other 50,000 odd students who were also peaceful, because we're getting no credit or coverage. Not only that, but it's assumed that we were all behaving like that, which isn't fair.

If the demonstration had been peaceful the entire demonstration would have been ignored. I don't want to "make my point and go home" I want to win. To do that we will have to fight and that doesn't mean a stroll in the park.

 

[krtek a houby]

You really think 'your point' would have been taken up by the media if not for the militant protestors?

Pretty sure there was coverage of the protests before the revolutionaries kicked off...

 

[Pickman's model]

If the demonstration had been peaceful the entire demonstration would have been ignored.

yeh, like every other student demo is

 

[chilango]

I went and said my bit, made my point, then came home, but I may aswell not have bothered

You've just summed up 20 years of student protests that have led to the current position.

It'd be worth listening to the views here of those who have been there and done that to avoid repeating the same mistakes.

 

[krtek a houby]

If the demonstration had been peaceful the entire demonstration would have been ignored. I don't want to "make my point and go home" I want to win. To do that we will have to fight and that doesn't mean a stroll in the park.

You a student dylans? You on yesterdays protest?

 

[Student_Teacher]

Under the Coalition proposals if you graduate and don't get graduate-level job with above-average salary, you don't have to pay anything. Even if you never make a payment, the debt gets cancelled eventually. Also, the poorest third of students will pay *less* under the Browne proposals than they do now, making the proposals more progressive than the status quo.

Personally I think it was stupid to sign a coalition agreement that didn't allow Lib Dem MPs to vote against a proposal to raise fees.

It's not just that though, the amount that we will have to pay back, bearing in mind the interest will still be adding on if we are employed or not, it's that by the look of things, the extra money we'll br earning over non graduates, will be going into paying back our fees. The length of time it will take to pay it back will be longer than ever, and it will take years to feel the benefit of our increased earnings. I went to Uni because my wages as a teaching assistant wern't enough to get a foot on the property ladder, is things go as proposed, I'll be in the same position, with a shedload of debt to boot.

 

[Pickman's model]

You a student dylans? You on yesterdays protest?

cos obviously it was only students on the demo yesterday no one else from higher education would turn out about this sort of thing

 

[Orang Utan]

You mean who's pro-violence? Try and quote properly if you wish to have your say.

Read the thread again, or better still, read dylans post above.

you talk about there being violence but it was just a few windows being smashed

 

[Fruitloop]

Hordes of feral mobsters rampaged through jer's imagination.