My electricity bill has just tripled: how about yours? Alternative suppliers?

[CH1]

An explanation of that ludicrous sounding incentive for Smart meter off-peak use ...

Sounds like nonsense to me.
But not as aggressive as the cold call I got on Friday afternoon about the new government scheme where you have to sell you house to pay for social care.

 

[elbows]

I dont understand the thinking of people who think its nonsense. Reducing demand at times of peak demand is one way to try to balance things during periods where supply may struggle to meet demand.

 

[gentlegreen]

My new secret weapon.
250 watt "garage heater" I thought was dead but it's just a sticky thermostat.
It's only my feet and ankles that get cold so this will do fine instead of the 1kw fan heater.
I will box-in my trestle table/bench/desk and fit a foot rest ...

Roughly the same output as those lethal "4 tee lights under a flowerpot" things ..

I may still feel able to downgrade to a 20 watt reptile pad at some point ...

I tried this on my dimmer and at the lowest setting it chucks out about 69 watts for an indicated 18 I think ...
This is going to be a convection rather than radiant version of a kotatsu.
I will enclose my workbench somewhat ...

 

[gentlegreen]

I dont understand the thinking of people who think its nonsense. Reducing demand at times of peak demand is one way to try to balance things during periods where supply may struggle to meet demand.

It's also an incentive for people to get smart meters.
I don't know if I can oblige voluntarily with the 0.5kwh I use to cook my dinner because I want to get to bed by 8 ...

 

[MickiQ]

My smart meter phones home every 30 mins apparently so I imagine that BG have a very accurate record of how I use energy during the day and how much I use on average during 4-7pm. It should be easy for them to tell how much less I am using and thus work out my payment. The smart thing to do is to start moving things I do outside of peak load into peak load now to load up my usage ready for working out my discount.

 

[gentlegreen]

The smart thing to do is to start moving things I do outside of peak load into peak load now to load up my usage ready for working out my discount.

That was what got me about this. I don't understand why it's not simply economy 7 - it rewards the profligate and cynical

 

[MickiQ]

That was what got me about this. I don't understand why it's not simply economy 7 - it rewards the profligate and cynical

Me too tbh, If the energy companies just offered a discount off kwh used 00.00-07.00, and a smaller discount off 09.00-16.00 I would be actively looking for shit to move to that time period. Both the dishwasher and washing machines have built-in timers I and would be looking long and hard about what other stuff could be time shifted. I could invest in smart plugs to turn the freezers off for a few hours in the peak period for instance.

 

[CH1]

I dont understand the thinking of people who think its nonsense. Reducing demand at times of peak demand is one way to try to balance things during periods where supply may struggle to meet demand.

Have you got a link to where Octopus pay you a double payment of 75p oer unit to turn your power off between 4pm and 6pm?
And a review from a respectable source such as Moneybox or Martin Lewis?
The video is all about some experimental scheme involving getting paid.

 

[elbows]

Me too tbh, If the energy companies just offered a discount off kwh used 00.00-07.00, and a smaller discount off 09.00-16.00 I would be actively looking for shit to move to that time period. Both the dishwasher and washing machines have built-in timers I and would be looking long and hard about what other stuff could be time shifted. I could invest in smart plugs to turn the freezers off for a few hours in the peak period for instance.

I think its because its a winter desperation measure that they only intend to make use of on certain particular days on the calendar, if and when the shit really hits the fan with balancing supply and demand.

Because it is a desperate attempt to give them more wiggle room when required this winter, most of the previous conversation about this came up on that other thread I started about potential shortages, most of which happened from this post onwards: #165

It wasnt the tidiest conversation, there was some confusion, and even I eventually got frustrated with how some of the info has been presented so far. I was mostly going to leave further conversation alone until the mainstream media had more opportunities to talk about it in a context more people could relate to.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Have you got a link to where Octopus pay you a double payment of 75p oer unit to turn your power off between 4pm and 6pm?
And a review from a respectable source such as Moneybox or Martin Lewis?
The video is all about some experimental scheme involving getting paid.

It was an experimental scheme, the National Grid is now planning to roll it out if required, it's been discussed on the 'UK gas/electricity supply shortages this winter' thread, see the link provided by elbows above.

 

[elbows]

Part of the confusion is because the National Grid pay the electricity suppliers who sign up to this scheme, and those energy companies then manage how they offer this to their customers in their own way, with their own marketing and names for the scheme etc.

So last time this scheme got in the news, some of the detail was still a bit vague and fragmented. Here is an example article:

National Grid could pay you to use less electricity from today

The National Grid is paying customers to cut energy use today as the cold weather places a strain on supply margins - find out who will get the payment

moneyweek.com

Over the next two weeks, the ESO will launch a campaign to inform households and businesses about its new scheme. The body expects most suppliers to sign up to it but hasn’t yet released specific details.

How you get the money will be down to your supplier, but it could come as a credit on bills – similar to the £66 instalments we’re getting as part of the £400 energy grant.

Octopus Energy has also unveiled its own scheme, “Saving Sessions”. For every unit of energy that customers save compared to their typical usage throughout a set time, Octopus calculates it will pay its 1.4 million smart meter customers £4 on average – saving them around £100 throughout the winter, until March 2023. The supplier will send customers an email with information about its scheme and how they can sign up to get a text outlining the hours when they should use less electricity to get qualify for the payment.

Ovo Energy has launched a similar scheme. The supplier is asking volunteers to cut their average energy consumption between 4 pm and 7 pm – when it claims we use up to one-fifth of our energy. If you manage to lower your energy use to Ovo’s threshold, it will pay you £20. Its trial will run from November 2022 to March 2023. You don’t have to do anything if you choose not to take part — you’ll just be billed at the standard 34p per kWh rate.

Articles like that one said the scheme as a whole was supposed to launch on November 1st so Im hoping there will be more opportunities for people to get their heads round it later this week. I havent kept up with what individual suppliers might have said about it since articles like that were written. And articles like that one arent brilliant at being completely clear as to whether these individual suppliers schemes are an additional separate thing or are the way they are passing on the wider National Grid ESO scheme to customers.

 

[contadino]

So I've seen loads of 200w solar panels with charge controller on eBay for £25ish and I could pop one on my garage roof and get a good yield. Obviously I'd need a leisure battery and inverter, but that could power my freezer and washing machine, right? (Washing machine runs once, maybe twice a week...)

 

[gentlegreen]

you'll be lucky to get 100 watts this time of year at noon - your washing machine will need 3kw...
Typical deep cycle lead acid battery 1.2kwh ?

You're at least an order of magnitude out ...

two sheds has a fairly small system - but it'll be at least 10 times that size.
I wonder if those are chinese watts ...

200 Watt 12 Volt Solar Starter Kit w/ 40A MPPT Charge Controller

This kit comes with two 100W Monocrystalline Solar Panels totaling 200 Watt, one 20 Amp MPPT Charge Controller, 20' MC4 Extension Cables, and two sets of Z brackets for Mounting. Free Shipping! On Sale!

uk.renogy.com

£369.99

 

[elbows]

I'll try to describe some of the confusion and difficulty getting a handle on all the detail by using Octopus as an example:

Firstly they already offer various different tariffs that include several different 'pay less for certain hours overnight' schemes that are a bit more convoluted than the old economy 7.

They did issue the following press release in October which makes it clear that the new scheme is built on top of the National Grid scheme:

Blackout Busters: Octopus Energy customers could make £100 whilst helping end power cuts

octopus.energy

But then when looking at the detail on that page, the sort of amounts of money mentioned in that one are "based on a customer who turns down 1kWh in ~25 events (1-2 per week) at an average £4/kWh". On the other thread there was some discussion of how many such events there would actually be. Probably the number will relate to how many times the shit actually hits the fan this winter, so nobody can say for sure, but it also sounds like there will be a whole bunch of test events where the National Grid activate the scheme (and pay suppliers who then pay customers) to make sure its all working and can generate the sort of response from customers they are hoping for.

But then there is more confusion because if people click on the link in the above press release to sign up, they end up on a page that wanks on and on about the previous trials that Octopus already did in the past (We paid customers to use less power at peak times. Here's what happened. ). Presumably if you then click on the pink button on that other page to sign up to express interest, you'll actually get stuff relevant to the new scheme, because a page appears that mentions 'Saving Sessions', but as I'm not a customer of theirs I cant get past that stage.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I'll try to describe some of the confusion and difficulty getting a handle on all the detail by using Octopus as an example:

Firstly they already offer various different tariffs that include several different 'pay less for certain hours overnight' schemes that are a bit more convoluted than the old economy 7.

They did issue the following press release in October which makes it clear that the new scheme is built on top of the National Grid scheme:

Blackout Busters: Octopus Energy customers could make £100 whilst helping end power cuts

octopus.energy

But then when looking at the detail on that page, the sort of amounts of money mentioned in that one are "based on a customer who turns down 1kWh in ~25 events (1-2 per week) at an average £4/kWh". On the other thread there was some discussion of how many such events there would actually be. Probably the number will relate to how many times the shit actually hits the fan this winter, so nobody can say for sure, but it also sounds like there will be a whole bunch of test events where the National Grid activate the scheme (and pay suppliers who then pay customers) to make sure its all working and can generate the sort of response from customers they are hoping for.

But then there is more confusion because if people click on the link in the above press release to sign up, they end up on a page that wanks on and on about the previous trials that Octopus already did in the past. Presumably if you then click on the button on that other page to sign up to express interest, you'll actually get stuff relevant to the new scheme, but as Im not a customer of theirs I cant get to that stage.

Can we keep this to the other thread, rather than duplicating the discussion?

 

[elbows]

In future I will try to talk about it in the other thread but since others brought it up here I wanted to at least summarise where we had got to previously with the detail. I sort of suspect it will still keep coming up here too due to the way its dressed up as an opportunity for people to save money, but I'll try to do my bit to keep it on the other thread when I can.

 

[cupid_stunt]

If it comes up again on this thread, just link to the other one.

 

[gentlegreen]

Too many overlapping threads

 

[MrCurry]

What is “the other thread”?

 

[gentlegreen]

What is “the other thread”?

One on heating and energy saving tips, and. "how cold is your house ?", which overlaps with the F-ing weather thread.

 

[MrCurry]

One on heating and energy saving tips, and. "how cold is your house ?", which overlaps with the F-ing weather thread.

i see no thread on heating and energy saving tips, so likely it’s started by someone I’ve blocked.

 

[two sheds]

Anyone on prepayment meters?

UK government’s £400 energy bill support going unclaimed

Many households who use non-smart prepayment meters are failing to redeem vouchers, says PayPoint

www.theguardian.com

 

[CH1]

Anyone on prepayment meters?

UK government’s £400 energy bill support going unclaimed

Many households who use non-smart prepayment meters are failing to redeem vouchers, says PayPoint

www.theguardian.com

I have a friend with a Smart meter who says they had £67 credited on the meter?

 

[cupid_stunt]

I have a friend with a Smart meter who says they had £67 credited on the meter?

Smart meters are credited, people with dumb meters get vouchers.

 

[MickiQ]

I've just received(today) my first payment of Sunak Money of £66 into my bank account not credited to my meter.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I've just received(today) my first payment of Sunak Money of £66 into my bank account not credited to my meter.

That's normal for people not on prepayment meters.

 

[strung out]

Thanks normal for people not on prepayment meters.

I got mine credited to my Bulb balance on October 1st.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I got mine credited to my Bulb balance on October 1st.

That's also normal, for people with energy accounts, some companies pay it into your bank, others credit it to your energy account.

The posts above were about prepayment meters, where people get it credited to their smart meter or if they have dumb meters they get vouchers.

 

[MickiQ]

The email I had back in September told me they would pay it me a few days after they took my DD (presumably they wanted to take my money off me before they let me have some back) For historical reasons (it was the date Evil American Megacorp used to pay me) my DD's go out on the 22nd. It so happened that was a Sat this month so they took my DD's on Mon 24th and gave me my refund on Mon 31st (Today yay!) so I guess that will be it going forward.
I'm well enough off with a more than sufficient cash balance to just shrug my shoulders about that one week gap but I would imagine others might not be so fortunate and be forced to skimp a bit whilst waiting for their money back.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I was hoping to get my monthly electric consumption down from an average of 150kwh to 100kwh, after the new fridge freezer came into use at the start of October I soon realised I was likely to do better than that and perhaps get it down to somewhere nearer 75kwh, I am well chuffed to have ended up using only 67.82kwh in the whole of October, that's an average of under 2.2kwh per day.

At the new OVO rates, and including VAT, that reduces my electric usage cost from £52.97 to just £23.95, a saving of £29.02, equal to £348.24pa, and means the new fridge freezer will have paid for itself in an about 8.5 months!

Of course, I can't do anything about the bloody standing charges, which adds £13.29 to the month, making a total £37.24, but considering before the prices started taking off, and before OVO's silly over-estimating after they took over SSE's retail division, I had been paying £30pm for electric anyway, so that's amazing!


The comparison with the month before is also amazing!



Mainly due to the mild weather, but also the new boiler means I am no longer wasting money heating a hot water tank since the 1st Sept., the gas usage for October is impressive compared to the year before, using 682kwh less, meaning it cost me £1.78 for hot water only, compared to what it would have cost if I had used the same as last year of £71.94, saving £70.02.



£1.78 gas use plus £8.83 in bloody standing charges, totals £10.61, add in the electric at £37.24, the total for the month is £47.85 minus the £66.00 government grant, and I am up by £18.15 on the month, which makes cupid a very happy stunt.

At a guess I'll end up using £300 on heating over the winter months, and say £50pm on average excluding heating, that would total £900pa or £75pm, which would be amazing as before the price madness I had been paying £63pm for both electric & gas, and especially as at OVO's peak madness they thought I should be paying £191pm!