ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Sure and a lot of yer Yanks are grandsons of the sod.
mass grave of 800 infants found at Galway 'fallen women' home
- Thread starter weepiper
- Start date
Sure and a lot of yer Yanks are grandsons of the sod.
classicdish
Well-Known Member
The 2005 under-five mortality rate was 112/1000.
Thankfully the 2015 UNICEF figures are better:
Sudan = 77/1000 SDN - UNICEF DATA (down from 2005 = 95)
South Sudan = 99/1000 SSD - UNICEF DATA (down from 2005 = 140)
But obviously an order of magnitude above the (for eg) UK = 5/1000
(PS the worst figure for 2015 is Angola with 167/1000)
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Yuwipi Woman
Whack-A-Mole Queen
I have to wonder how these infant deaths compare to Nazi Concentration camps. I looked and couldn't find anything conclusive, and I'm sure it would depend on which camp.
Idris2002
Christmas Eve, you know?
Me granny always said no good would come of them Reagans going to Amerikaye.
Yuwipi Woman
Whack-A-Mole Queen
Where was the immigrant ban when we really needed it?
bubblesmcgrath
Well-Known Member
Who is this fuckwit ?
Captain Christy
Member
And people wonder how Tuam could have happened?
Probably the type that thinks eating meat on Friday makes Baby Jesus cry
bubblesmcgrath
Well-Known Member
Shit...even the bishops in Ireland have reacted with remorse and shame.....and rightly so...but it's all too late...what's new there?
Everyone is complicit in the past practice of putting unmarried mothers into homes....making them disappear from a society that had a false sense of "respectability".
Their own families put them in in many cases...signed them in...
Ireland was full of shit.
And as someone I know used to.say...it was also full of begrudgery.
People loved to see others fail.
They loved to see misery hitting someone.
Fucked up......
Not as bad in cities ...purely because the communities were not as closely knit as country places. But truly narrow-minded ignorance ruled in the countryside.
The scandals and horrors of the paedophiles in the church...and now the horrors of the mothers and baby homes...have really made me ashamed of Ireland...and the Irish people.
Openness and transparency are words that Ireland has yet to fully understand and embrace.
I hope every mother and baby home is forensically investigated for similar burial practices.
Captain Christy
Member
These homes must be viewed in the wider context also. Ireland was a poverty stricken country. Small farm holdings and large families most who would never go past national school. Boys reared for the emigrant ship for construction sites and girls destined for domestic service or early marriage.
No sex education or family planning. Any girl who became pregnant (assisted by a man!!! who seem to escape all blame) was not welcome bringing another mouth to feed home. The option was to the mother and child home where religious orders did society's dirty work. Certainly a lot of the treatment these girls got was far from Christian. However as regards the adoptions I wonder was it better that the poor kids were given to families rather than be landed back into some one roomed tenement or farm labourers cottage. From reading various reports it is obvious that the State just washed their hands of anything to do with
supervision and inspection of orphanages, juvenile reformatories etc. The media of the times didnt exactly cover themselves in glory either
No sex education or family planning. Any girl who became pregnant (assisted by a man!!! who seem to escape all blame) was not welcome bringing another mouth to feed home. The option was to the mother and child home where religious orders did society's dirty work. Certainly a lot of the treatment these girls got was far from Christian. However as regards the adoptions I wonder was it better that the poor kids were given to families rather than be landed back into some one roomed tenement or farm labourers cottage. From reading various reports it is obvious that the State just washed their hands of anything to do with
supervision and inspection of orphanages, juvenile reformatories etc. The media of the times didnt exactly cover themselves in glory either
Idris2002
Christmas Eve, you know?
Ireland was poor, but it was never that poor. In New Zealand, the depression of the 1930s was so bad that some people resorted to living in caves; yet it also produced a proper social democratic labour party that built a functioning welfare state. This was something Ireland never achieved, and not because of the state's poverty, but because of the absence of any political will to do better.
As for poor kids who were adopted - in the case of those sent to Australia, didn't they end up as cheap labour on farms anyway?
bluescreen
tofu eating wokerati
-
Well known fact that poor people don't care about their children or care for them.
Captain Christy
Member
How did you come to that conclusion?
- Well known fact that poor people don't care about their children or care for them.
Have a read of the reports outlining the terrible standard of housing, sanitation in Bo th urban and rural Ireland before and after independence. It's a credit to the many families who reared families in such conditions with high levels of infant mortality due to disease and malnutrition. For a so called rebellious nation the Irish tolerated a lot from their political leaders
Captain Christy
Member
I read accounts of both young males and females ending up on farms in the outback. It wasn't cheap labour. It was free labour.
19force8
For the avoidance of faith
Much as Connolly predicted, the defeat of the revolution lead to a carnival of reaction on both sides of the border. A phrase that trips off the tongue far too easily for the horrors it describes.
Sasaferrato
Super Refuser!
To be a Christian is not a label. It is the way you live your life.
These people were not motivated by faith, nowhere in the New Testament does it say 'Demonstrate your faith by abusing children, and killing them by your neglect'.
Not one single Christian that I know would regard these people as being Christian, in anything other than their self identification.
Sasaferrato
Super Refuser!
And frequently, seriously abused labour.
TruXta
tired
What rubbish, no true scotsman all over again.
Sasaferrato
Super Refuser!
Oh well, you will know best I expect.
petee
no gods, no malarkey
a prominent defender of rightwing catholics, who are the most oppressed people on earth, you know.
be glad you don't have to live with him, as we do here.
Idris2002
Christmas Eve, you know?
Och Aye the noo, Harry Lauder appeared in Glesgae toon, Oor Wullie, MHAIRI BLACK, Irn Bru, Middenface McNulty - hey this pretending to be a Scotchman thing might actually catch on!
TruXta
tired
Well, it's not like official church bodies around the world have sanctioned and even commissioned lots of abuses is it? No no, nothing to see here...
Captain Christy
Member
Look over there! Cheryl Fernandence has a new tattooWell, it's not like official church bodies around the world have sanctioned and even commissioned lots of abuses is it? No no, nothing to see here...
A very decent piece in the Guardian about this.
'Hundreds of dead babies are not an asset to those invested in the myth of an abortion-free Ireland; they inconveniently suggest that Catholic Ireland always had abortions, just very late-term ones, administered slowly by nuns after the children were already born.'
The Catholic church is ‘shocked’ at the hundreds of children buried at Tuam. Really? | Emer O’Toole
'Hundreds of dead babies are not an asset to those invested in the myth of an abortion-free Ireland; they inconveniently suggest that Catholic Ireland always had abortions, just very late-term ones, administered slowly by nuns after the children were already born.'
The Catholic church is ‘shocked’ at the hundreds of children buried at Tuam. Really? | Emer O’Toole
Idris2002
Christmas Eve, you know?
Spiked online scumbag Brendan O'Neill has been permitted by the Irish Times to grace their columns with a piece arguing that people are getting all excited over nothing, and that the full facts of the case really show that the Tuam case wasn't that bad really, and don't justify the horrified reaction we see all around us, including on this thread.
You can go looking for the piece yourself, if you want to get really pissed off (I'm not exagerrating, by the way). One thing he argues is that the tank had compartments in it, and that these must have been put in place after it was built - and his implication is that this must have been a sign that it was being repurposed as a burial spot, thus saving the nuns from the charge of inhuman callousness.
Well, I looked it up, and it turns out that it's perfectly normal for septic tanks to have compartments in them:
You can go looking for the piece yourself, if you want to get really pissed off (I'm not exagerrating, by the way). One thing he argues is that the tank had compartments in it, and that these must have been put in place after it was built - and his implication is that this must have been a sign that it was being repurposed as a burial spot, thus saving the nuns from the charge of inhuman callousness.
Well, I looked it up, and it turns out that it's perfectly normal for septic tanks to have compartments in them:
bubblesmcgrath
Well-Known Member
There's no getting away from the abnormally high mortality rate of those who were in the mother and baby homes. That needs investigating.
And why didn't they bury them in a plot ? Why hide them?
It's all sick and twisted and there is no excuse for it bar that Ireland was a shitty place and women were treated like dirt. Unmarried mothers were treated like scum. The babies were treated like scum.
Irish society has a lot to answer for and the church has massive issues. Evil...pure and simple. Where was the belief that all.life is sacred?.
And why didn't they bury them in a plot ? Why hide them?
It's all sick and twisted and there is no excuse for it bar that Ireland was a shitty place and women were treated like dirt. Unmarried mothers were treated like scum. The babies were treated like scum.
Irish society has a lot to answer for and the church has massive issues. Evil...pure and simple. Where was the belief that all.life is sacred?.
Sasaferrato
Super Refuser!
Well, it's not like official church bodies around the world have sanctioned and even commissioned lots of abuses is it? No no, nothing to see here...
You appear to be unable to distinguish between those who self identify as Christians, but do not behave as such, and those who through their lives and actions are Christians. Sorry, I can't help you any further.
TruXta
tired
Nor can I help you clearly.
flypanam
Sausage to fortune
They have, but their secular mouth piece hasn't been so forthcoming. The dangerous thing is to think the church is finished influencing people politically, it hasn't it just airs it views through the Iona Institute, who for some reason get an inordinate amount of air time.
bubblesmcgrath
Well-Known Member
Sorry but nobody...and I mean nobody is listening to the Iona Institute.... People are numbed from all of this...on top of everything else that's gone on over the past 20 years here.
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