Loughborough Junction public space improvements - consultation begins

[Burn:Cycle]

Also.. in BREAKING NEWS... my call yesterday afternoon (around midday) to the "paper copy survey hotline" - where I left a voicemail asking to receive a paper copy of the most recent online survey as advertised in yesterday's flyer drop - has ALREADY generated the required result... landed on the doorstep today, before 12.


So it appears that;
- they do listen to their voicemail system
- they do act on messages received (sometimes!)
- They can turn requests around inside 24 hours. Even on a Friday.
- Organisation at Lambeth council isn't quite the bottomless pit we all reckon it is.

.... or perhaps I was lucky and stumbled upon the one person who is super efficient and capable of delivering excellent customer service....

 

[critical1]

Also.. in BREAKING NEWS... my call yesterday afternoon (around midday) to the "paper copy survey hotline" - where I left a voicemail asking to receive a paper copy of the most recent online survey as advertised in yesterday's flyer drop - has ALREADY generated the required result... landed on the doorstep today, before 12.
View attachment 78854

So it appears that;
- they do listen to their voicemail system
- they do act on messages received (sometimes!)
- They can turn requests around inside 24 hours. Even on a Friday.
- Organisation at Lambeth council isn't quite the bottomless pit we all reckon it is.

.... or perhaps I was lucky and stumbled upon the one person who is super efficient and capable of delivering excellent customer service....

That is ABSOLUTELY AMAZING, well done Lambeth, I phoned them up today, I wonder if they deliver on a Sunday!

Last night I saw this in the foyer, not much of a consultation... Dumping them like this.
Lambeth said that these leaflets would be delivered to every home.

 

[bimble]

· Evidence of impact on businesses (via face to face consultation by the Stockwell Partnership, including the business survey mentioned earlier)

· Evidence of impact on residents (via the ongoing Stockwell Partnership engagement)

Those are the bullet points that really worry me.
Seems they are saying that the only evidence they're planning to take into consideration with regard to local residents and businesses is the evidence gathered by Stockwell Partnership, during the few hours they spent 'roving around'.

 

[CH1]

Good or bad news. I spent most of the day over in Wimbledon Park then Clapham Junction.
Terrible journey back from CJ Lidl. 35 bus diverted. St John's Road closed eastbound. Buses on major divertion.
Also new? pelican crossing across Wandsworth Road at Debenhams.
It was almost as though G Wright was on loan to Wandsworth Council.
Journey time from Arthur Road to Coldharbour Lane including 10 minutes shopping in Lidl - 2 hours. Tailbacks from Debenams/Falcon crossroads to the former Granda Bingo yuppy flats building on St John's Hill, the Asparagus Pub on Falcon Road/Battersea High Street and Lavender Hill Police Station.

I only say this to explain how when I arrived home it was like being in a traffic free rural paradise. Even in central Brixton.

Have they fixed those lights - or is the whole world watching something called the Rugby World Cup?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Notwithstanding that I am a firm advocate of roads being used for their intended purpose, I would go further than Gramsci on this

To say "today the roads, tomorrow your homes" is UKIP style demagoguey. (or worse - I was thinking about the Smethwick quote, but I expect no-one reading this knows what I mean fortunately).

Frankly, I don't believe that Gramsci is being alarmist or engaging in demagoguery. It's entirely possible for councils to vary a scheme so deeply that peoples homes are threatened. Today I've looked at proposals that lists properties bordering on Cressingham Gardens as "possible acquisition opportunities" for the "regeneration" of the estate - something the 30 or so households now threatened know nothing about, yet.

I think the leaflet was strongly stated, but went over the top in that particular statement. As a liberal I like things kept honest and reasonable.

So, unlike your party, then?

The Cressingham Gardens campaign need your help - not being used as a tool to frighten Loughborough residents over road closures.
If Cressingham Gardens push back against the council's plans successfully that helps Loughborough. If Cressingham Gardens cannot stop the council's current plans that sets back Loughborough a lot more than any barmy road scheme.

Gramsci has already rendered assistance to us. For some reason he doesn't confine himself to a single issue at a time, and appears to have enough energy and compassion to engage himself on more than one project at a time. Fancy that!

 

[ViolentPanda]

Good or bad news. I spent most of the day over in Wimbledon Park then Clapham Junction.
Terrible journey back from CJ Lidl. 35 bus diverted. St John's Road closed eastbound. Buses on major divertion.
Also new? pelican crossing across Wandsworth Road at Debenhams.
It was almost as though G Wright was on loan to Wandsworth Council.
Journey time from Arthur Road to Coldharbour Lane including 10 minutes shopping in Lidl - 2 hours. Tailbacks from Debenams/Falcon crossroads to the former Granda Bingo yuppy flats building on St John's Hill, the Asparagus Pub on Falcon Road/Battersea High Street and Lavender Hill Police Station.

I only say this to explain how when I arrived home it was like being in a traffic free rural paradise. Even in central Brixton.

Have they fixed those lights - or is the whole world watching something called the Rugby World Cup?

Clapham Junction has been like that during "peak shopping hours" on a Saturday since (to my memory) at least the '80s. Crossing Falcon Rd from the Falcon Pub to Dub Vendor used to be taking your life in your hands, as drivers would try to sprint through momentary traffic gaps. It's not helped by the fact that so many of the side roads that used to naturally "filter" the traffic flow, have been one-wayed.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I want to live in Milton Keynes....

You poor sick bastard!

 

[critical1]

peoples homes are threatened. Today I've looked at proposals that lists properties bordering on Cressingham Gardens as "possible acquisition opportunities" for the "regeneration" of the estate - something the 30 or so households now threatened know nothing about, yet.

Yes LJAG in the LJ Masterplan also went around stating "possible acquisition opportunities" or "possible development opportunities" ... these kind of statements have an impact when local residents read them. Are LJAG property developers, are Lambeth the new Foxtons??? with a SPV, are they fit to run a company?

 

[CH1]

Frankly, I don't believe that Gramsci is being alarmist or engaging in demagoguery. It's entirely possible for councils to vary a scheme so deeply that peoples homes are threatened. Today I've looked at proposals that lists properties bordering on Cressingham Gardens as "possible acquisition opportunities" for the "regeneration" of the estate - something the 30 or so households now threatened know nothing about, yet.

The comment was not directed at Gramsci in the way that you (and he) have concluded.
I felt that the wording of the LJ Road Madness (or Friends of Loughborough Junction) leaflet implying that now they are coming for Loughborough Estate's main road, next it will be their very homes was irresponsible and alarmist.

Gramsci did not do the leaflet did he? I doubt it, otherwise he would be taking a much more anti road closure line than heretofore. Althouh no doubt he can post his own comment. I do not presume to speak for him.

The clarification in post #2632 explained this.

I used a small l liberal by the way - and this was an admittedly slightly provocative comment, but I had not expected it was you who would be provoked.
Given that I mention Cressingham twice in the next para it is not surprising though. Sorry you did not like it.

As for your comment about my party - though I don't have one technically, and the way Liberal Democrats have followed the trend in contracterisation, PFI etc without bothering to see what that is rooted in has been their downfall I feel. When I joined the Liberal Party as a student in 1972 they were a trendy libertarian outfit which sat more easily with flower power, gay rights, anti-racism etc than the Labour Party (or for that matter Soc Soc which ruled Manchester University union at that time).

I am happy to politically reminisce with you over a cup of tea - but I am sure you have more pressing concerns. And I wish you all the best at the hearing. And apologise I have not given other than moral support to your cause. I am know other friends such as High Definition have done much more than me.

 

[CH1]

Clapham Junction has been like that during "peak shopping hours" on a Saturday since (to my memory) at least the '80s. Crossing Falcon Rd from the Falcon Pub to Dub Vendor used to be taking your life in your hands, as drivers would try to sprint through momentary traffic gaps. It's not helped by the fact that so many of the side roads that used to naturally "filter" the traffic flow, have been one-wayed.

Adding the road closure and bus divertion was obviously the icing on the cake. Had I had the prescience of some members (not you!!) of this thread I would have gone back the way I arrived in SW19 - Thameslink. Just that had 30 minute train frequency and stopping off for shopping seemed more problematic for that reason.

 

[bimble]

As a liberal I like things kept honest and reasonable.

Just for fun.. may I direct you to this? .. The word Liberal as an insult.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Yes LJAG in the LJ Masterplan also went around stating "possible acquisition opportunities" or "possible development opportunities" ... these kind of statements have an impact when local residents read them. Are LJAG property developers, are Lambeth the new Foxtons??? with a SPV, are they fit to run a company?

It's worse than merely "a company". As you might have guessed, at Cressingham we've boned up on what Lambeth are doing, and their plan is that the SPV will most likely be an "umbrella" for a series of inter-related companies.
Are they fit to run a company? I'm not encouraged given current levels of competence.

 

[bimble]

It's worse than merely "a company". As you might have guessed, at Cressingham we've boned up on what Lambeth are doing, and their plan is that the SPV will most likely be an "umbrella" for a series of inter-related companies.
Are they fit to run a company? I'm not encouraged given current levels of competence.

Just in relation to the road closures, I don't see any obvious way in which this is a money maker for the council (apart from the fines but it doesn't look like they've even cashed in very competently on that so far).
The only people far as I can see who would benefit directly if the scheme remains in place are Network Rail.

 

[concerned1]

That is ABSOLUTELY AMAZING, well done Lambeth, I phoned them up today, I wonder if they deliver on a Sunday!

Last night I saw this in the foyer, not much of a consultation... Dumping them like this.
Lambeth said that these leaflets would be delivered to every home.

View attachment 78859

I have to say that this is quite a large stack of Leaflets just left lying about.

No wonder hardly anyone received leaflets last year!

 

[critical1]

I have to say that this is quite a large stack of Leaflets just left lying about.

No wonder hardly anyone received leaflets last year!

Well that was for one tower block, if you estimate that each block has about 240 adult residents that's a lot of lost consultation papers, It is of no surprise residents don't get notified if these are left lying with the junk mail...

 

[ViolentPanda]

Just in relation to the road closures, I don't see any obvious way in which this is a money maker for the council (apart from the fines but it doesn't look like they've even cashed in very competently on that so far).
The only people far as I can see who would benefit directly if the scheme remains in place are Network Rail.

Road closure/traffic calming changes the profile and use of an area.
As for benefit for the council, more active arches, more people paying business rates; more residential, more Council Tax take.

 

[concerned1]

How can destroying businesses in the LJ area and increasing rents on Arches bring money in for Lambeth Council? Now the meaningful Town Centre is a Polluted Traffic Jam, what businesses could possibly survive with the roads closed. There are already active businesses there that have paid rent/ rates for over 25 years and more and will be forced out by the lack of trade reaching them! So how would others prosper and from whom?
Or are we implying gentrifiying the area?

 

[CH1]

Yes LJAG in the LJ Masterplan also went around stating "possible acquisition opportunities" or "possible development opportunities" ... these kind of statements have an impact when local residents read them. Are LJAG property developers, are Lambeth the new Foxtons??? with a SPV, are they fit to run a company?

You jogged me into a company house check, which reveals that a new director with an address in Huddersfield joined the LJAG board in the summer. Three others had resigned - which fits what I said earlier.

 

[bimble]

Road closure/traffic calming changes the profile and use of an area.
As for benefit for the council, more active arches, more people paying business rates; more residential, more Council Tax take.

Yes, true. It's just that as Network Rail are intending to triple the rents , just like down the road, they look to me like the most immediate beneficiaries of the 'changed profile'.

 

[bimble]

Well that was for one tower block, if you estimate that each block has about 240 adult residents that's a lot of lost consultation papers, It is of no surprise residents don't get notified if these are left lying with the junk mail...

Re the delivery system for those consultation leaflets.. someone posted this on facebook on Friday, a folorn looking pile of them left out in the rain on cambria rd.

 

[critical1]

Yes, true. It's just that as Network Rail are intending to triple the rents , just like down the road, they look to me like the most immediate beneficiaries of the 'changed profile'.

Of course GENTRIFICATION has absolutely nothing at all to do with this new profile...

 

[bimble]

I'm resisting the G word, will keep doing it too so there (think its possible to see the whole thing just through the economics of it if you know what I mean: Massively increased rents = the car mechanics must be replaced by cafes etc . Or maybe I just don't like the word because I'm worried that I'm gentry.

 

[irf520]

Re the delivery system for those consultation leaflets.. someone posted this on facebook on Friday, a folorn looking pile of them left out in the rain on cambria rd.
View attachment 78935

That pile is about 3 courses of bricks high, so I reckon 1500-2000 leaflets there.

 

[bimble]

Clare Neely out at the junction this morning distributing these:


Haya87 is a worthy adversary (as a self styled professional campaigner) but really, this thing of calling all vehicles 'rats' and promoting the idea that it's all about 'creating space for cycling' those are crude tricks IMO.

 

[prunus]

Clare Neely out at the junction this morning distributing these:
View attachment 78973

Haya87 is a worthy adversary (as a self styled professional campaigner) but really, this thing of calling all vehicles 'rats' and promoting the idea that it's all about 'creating space for cycling' those are crude tricks IMO.

You must know that rat-run is a common term to describe using side streets to bypass traffic - it's not calling all vehicles rats. Don't fall into the trap of attacking everything the other side does with overblown rhetoric - it's no less a 'dirty trick' than those you are decrying. You're usually one of the reasonable ones on this thread

 

[prunus]

This morning's anecdotal datapoint: school's back in and the traffic was fine on chl when I went in.

There seems to be much less on Milkwood road and Herne hill road too - although that is just a feeling, could be observation bias (ie I never used to take much notice).

I think the scheme might actually be delivering its main objective. Even sadder then that the divisive implementation looks to make it unlikely to survive.

 

[ChrisSouth]

Gramsci is right. It's gotten really unpleasant and personal in here. And slightly hysterical (someone uses the phrase 'rat run' and there's meldown). It's disappointing.

 

[CH1]

Clare Neely out at the junction this morning distributing these:
View attachment 78973

Haya87 is a worthy adversary (as a self styled professional campaigner) but really, this thing of calling all vehicles 'rats' and promoting the idea that it's all about 'creating space for cycling' those are crude tricks IMO.

I admire her indefatigability.

Why is she using a Twitter abbreviated link to the Lambeth/Stockwell survey?

This is actually quite exciting - reminds me of growing up in rural Suffolk where the Tory and Labour parties used to drive the punters to the polling station, stick a party poll card in their hands and push them inside to vote.

Maybe Clare has the same rustic memories?

 

[bimble]

You must know that rat-run is a common term to describe using side streets to bypass traffic - it's not calling all vehicles rats. Don't fall into the trap of attacking everything the other side does with overblown rhetoric - it's no less a 'dirty trick' than those you are decrying. You're usually one of the reasonable ones on this thread

This is true, I do strive to appear reasonable and rational most of the time.
I'll defend myself thus: Lougborough Road is not a side street, it's the biggest street in the area, which is why I don't think the 'rat running' term is useful at all to describe the traffic that used to use it. It still seems to me that this experiment has created rather than solved rat running problems.
If the leaflet above just said 'closed to traffic', or even 'closed to through traffic' that would have been fair, but 'rat running motor traffic' just seems unnecessary and unaccurate.

 

[bimble]

This morning's anecdotal datapoint: school's back in and the traffic was fine on chl when I went in.

There seems to be much less on Milkwood road and Herne hill road too - although that is just a feeling, could be observation bias (ie I never used to take much notice).

I think the scheme might actually be delivering its main objective. Even sadder then that the devisive implementation looks to make it unlikely to survive.

If you're right - meaning if a significant amount of the people who made up the reported 10,000 to 13,000 vehicles that once used Loughborough Road have in fact decided to stop driving through the area and found alternatives instead - so that the weight of traffic on CHL will indeed be reduced and not increased by these closures then I will (I promise) do my best to forgive the implementation fiasco and humbly eat my anti-road closure hat.