Implications for the rest of us if Scotland votes yes

[Bernie Gunther]

And this is a point worth re-emphasising. The Yes movement is far wider than just the SNP.[/QUOTE

For what it's worth, if we can persuade Cumbria (for geographical continuity purposes), I'm all in favour of Merseyside going Scottish. I've had quite enough of Tory cunts.

 

[Wilf]

My law firm has just circulated a note to clients this afternoon, advising them of the risks that they see arising from the referendum result. .

Strangely enough, I've just received a note about the risks to urban if you left.

 

[coley]

how do they contribute to the EU ? if he insists that they are part of it ...what's the mechanism ? who does he pay , and with what , from where ?

....and we (UK) should get an immediate EU contribution rebate of at least 10% ....

We will also get an increase in life expectancy and a decrease in annual rainfall (@MTW)

 

[ibilly99]

referring to the OP question it might mean compulsory heritage musical retrospectives on a denationalised Scottish Broadcasting Corporation with programmes such as this ... ye gran will be hapeee !




Plus Dr Finlay's Casebook might be compulsory viewing - I reckon Janet was having a highland fling with the good Doctor.

 

[coley]

referring to the OP question it might mean compulsory heritage musical retrospectives on a denationalised Scottish Broadcasting Corporation with programmes such as this ... ye gran will be hapeee !




Plus Dr Finlay's Casebook might be compulsory viewing - I reckon Janet was having a highland fling with the good Doctor.

If they vote yes, than it's nowt mair then they deserve

 

[Sue]

Well, this is fun. And original.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Jim doesn't, though. He opposes EU membership. (I reviewed his book, "In Place of Fear II", on the Big Thread).

The point Sillars makes, has always made, is that after independence, the Labour Party in Scotland has the opportunity to realign itself; to get closer to what Sillars thinks is its roots. (Because the Westminster pull is rightward, due to parties chasing swing votes in South Eastern marginals). He would then, he says, rejoin the Scottish Labour Party. He believes such a party would win a Scottish election. He makes no bones about the fact that he thinks the SNP is the vehicle for independence, but not the party he wants to see winning post independence, nor the party he thinks the electorate would gravitate towards.

He is not claiming that he thinks the SNP will do those things (or the other measures he outlines in his book).

You may disagree with him, but that's his analysis. (It's, incidentally, at the root of his 2 decade rift with Salmond, mended only as his wife was dying from Parkinsons).

You're replying to an article telling us what Jim Sillars would like to see in an independent Scotland but then you're talking about the SNP.

I'm talking about the SNP because that's who will get in. But I admit that I've jumped in with both size 10s here and misjudged Sillars somewhat. He appears to be a man of substance.

But the real power brokers are not people of substance. The clowns at the forefront of the no campaign clearly, but Salmond, too, is not a person of substance. He reminds me of Neil Kinnock in the way he's taken his party and the way he plays to capital the closer he gets to power. And we all know where Kinnock ended up with his cushy tax-free establishment job at the EU.

It is an interesting point to ask how Scottish politics would realign following indepedence. But once the deals have been done by the likes of Salmond regarding the EU, NATO, the conditions for keeping the pound, and all the other positions a new Scotland will commit to, how much room will there be left? How will it be different from the rest of the UK?

 

[JTG]

The amount of tired stereotyping and cliched ignorance that's been bandied around by people the last few weeks - even here on supposedly enlightened Urban - makes me surprised more of them don't want to leave tbh

 

[Tankus]

but ........what about the sheep ?

 

[coley]

I'm talking about the SNP because that's who will get in. But I admit that I've jumped in with both size 10s here and misjudged Sillars somewhat. He appears to be a man of substance.

But the real power brokers are not people of substance. The clowns at the forefront of the no campaign clearly, but Salmond, too, is not a person of substance. He reminds me of Neil Kinnock in the way he's taken his party and the way he plays to capital the closer he gets to power. And we all know where Kinnock ended up with his cushy tax-free establishment job at the EU.

It is an interesting point to ask how Scottish politics would realign following indepedence. But once the deals have been done by the likes of Salmond regarding the EU, NATO, the conditions for keeping the pound, and all the other positions a new Scotland will commit to, how much room will there be left? How will it be different from the rest of the UK?

Not a lot, but Salmond and cronies will have their fingers wrapped around Scotland's purse strings, to their mutual benefit.
Still, totally irrelevant,The vote won't even be close.

 

[Sue]

Not a lot, but Salmond and cronies will have their fingers wrapped around Scotland's purse strings, to their mutual benefit.
Still, totally irrelevant,The vote won't even be close.

Not sure I understand what you mean by the bit in bold?

 

[newbie]

For someone who writes such long posts about political matters you have staggeringly little understanding of the subject

So educate me, O guru. Explain post yes parliamentary voting, pick holes in what I said.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Strangely enough, I've just received a note about the risks to urban if you left.

Negligible?

 

[Nylock]

<....>
or a stand alone currency which would be on par with the Zimbabwean Dollar.
<..>

ffs have a word with yourself

 

[Sasaferrato]

ffs have a word with yourself

For a currency to have worth, it has to have a wee bit more to it than a picture of Wee Fat Eck on the front. Gold reserves, for example. Whereas Sterling is by no means gold backe

referring to the OP question it might mean compulsory heritage musical retrospectives on a denationalised Scottish Broadcasting Corporation with programmes such as this ... ye gran will be hapeee !




Plus Dr Finlay's Casebook might be compulsory viewing - I reckon Janet was having a highland fling with the good Doctor.

The fawning shown by STV, especially that of the odious cunt Ponsonby, indicates that it hopes to be the state mouthpiece, if the people of Scotland, in an act of monumental mass stupidity, decide to back Salmond.

 

[elbows]

For a currency to have worth, it has to have a wee bit more to it than a picture of Wee Fat Eck on the front. Gold reserves, for example. Whereas Sterling is by no means gold backed

Sterling survives for a number of reasons, despite the long-term balance of trade deficit and current account deficit. Large ones include the city of Londons financial institutions making us a large cog in the global borrowing system, and north sea oil & gas revenues. The dramatic drop in north sea oil production over the last decade+ has been at least partially offset by the large increase in the oil price.

So the fear, uncertainty and doubt over sterling which the No campaign whipped up is misleading in the sense that there is a strong mutual dependency there, it's not a one-sided thing.

 

[isvicthere?]

Freedom for Wessex!

We drove out the Vikings, after all. People have such short memories.

 

[belboid]

So the fear, uncertainty and doubt over sterling which the No campaign whipped up is misleading in the sense that there is a strong mutual dependency there, it's not a one-sided thing.

Salmond and Sturgeon's claims that they'll simply be able to share the current pound are grossly misleading tho. Sure, in the end, rump UK would probably agree, but with such strings attached it'll make the Euro look attractive. And it's no good arguing that it'd only be for a few years while a Scottish Sterling is brought in, the EU would never allow it.

 

[ska invita]

i heard someone saying that you dont need permission to use another currency...for example there are a number of countries around the world that use the US dollar as their primary currency... i dont really know enough about it to know if thats a good counterargument or not

 

[J Ed]

These headlines are just getting stupid

 

[danny la rouge]

These headlines are just getting stupid

 

[weepiper]

These headlines are just getting stupid

The plague of locusts and the rains of blood will be along shortly.

 

[belboid]

i heard someone saying that you dont need permission to use another currency...for example there are a number of countries around the world that use the US dollar as their primary currency... i dont really know enough about it to know if thats a good counterargument or not

that's only really countries where the official local currency is dodgy as fuck and can't be traded overseas (or only on really crap terms). They're not really places Scotland aspires to be.

 

[19sixtysix]

I think the chinese Yuan may be the one to adopt. If you're not having one of your own. Have the one most people use.

 

[19sixtysix]

Salmond and Sturgeon's claims that they'll simply be able to share the current pound are grossly misleading tho. Sure, in the end, rump UK would probably agree, but with such strings attached it'll make the Euro look attractive. And it's no good arguing that it'd only be for a few years while a Scottish Sterling is brought in, the EU would never allow it.

A Scottish currency would be perfectly OK in Europe. Countries are required to join the Euro when they meet the convergence criteria but until then they continue to have their own currency. Sweden just keeps missing the criteria.

 

[belboid]

A Scottish currency would be perfectly OK in Europe. Countries are required to join the Euro when they meet the convergence criteria but until then they continue to have their own currency. Sweden just keeps missing the criteria.

Sweden already had it's own currency tho. UK sterling would be fine by them, but Scottish? Whole new ball game.

 

[butchersapron]

A Scottish currency would be perfectly OK in Europe. Countries are required to join the Euro when they meet the convergence criteria but until then they continue to have their own currency. Sweden just keeps missing the criteria.

Aren't new entrants to the EU required to effectively write the convergence criteria (i.e austerity, no useful deficits etc) into their legal functioning? So that they get all that good stuff and no euro yet.

They're not really left alone until they meet the convergence criteria - they are forced to adopt measures to meet that criteria as part of early level EU entry.

 

[weltweit]

"a day of reconing!" eh .. nice

 

[belboid]

Aren't new entrants to the EU required to effectively write the convergence criteria (i.e austerity, no useful deficits etc) into their legal functioning? So that they get all that good stuff and no euro yet.

They're not really left alone until they meet the convergence criteria - they are forced to adopt measures to meet that criteria as part of early level EU entry.

and they'll be forced to adopt such criteria to have a UK currency union too. Which Salmond will then blame for backing out of every promise he's made now.

 

[andysays]

Aren't new entrants to the EU required to effectively write the convergence criteria (i.e austerity, no useful deficits etc) into their legal functioning? So that they get all that good stuff and no euro yet.

They're not really left alone until they meet the convergence criteria - they are forced to adopt measures to meet that criteria as part of early level EU entry.

But according to Salmond (and at least one person on this thread) all that will simply be ignored and an independent Scotland will be welcomed into the EU on whatever terms it chooses on day 1.