Hillsborough: What Really Happened?
- Thread starter butchersapron
- Start date
likesfish
You can't park here sir
crap stadium that should never have been allowed but the FA did'nt like fans very much and some fans had behaved like scum heysal? anyone
crap policing before and during
a history of bad fan behavior the fences hadn't gone up for no reason
all the ingredients for a disaster
bad policing decent stadium no problem
if the fence had not been there lot less deaths but thre fences had gone up for a reason
crap policing before and during
a history of bad fan behavior the fences hadn't gone up for no reason
all the ingredients for a disaster
bad policing decent stadium no problem
if the fence had not been there lot less deaths but thre fences had gone up for a reason
The fences went up because it was easier to treat people like scum than it was to plan properly. Because hysteria over a few bad incidents overwhelmed the fact that the vast majority of games were relatively peaceful inside the grounds
In 1984/85 the arrest rate at football matches was 0.34 per 1000 with the joint arrest/ejection rate 0.72 per 1000. This dropped by 51% and 33% respectively the next season and continued to drop thereafter.
You can't excuse putting the fences up because it was a shit solution to an overstated problem.
In 1984/85 the arrest rate at football matches was 0.34 per 1000 with the joint arrest/ejection rate 0.72 per 1000. This dropped by 51% and 33% respectively the next season and continued to drop thereafter.
You can't excuse putting the fences up because it was a shit solution to an overstated problem.
I was in Sheffield that day - we drove past the stadium and saw queues of people waiting outside phoneboxes. I had no idea what was happening, I was only young and I thought that people were phoning to tell their friends the result of the match, that it was just what people did.
It still shocks me to think that just yards away 96 people had lost their lives. So many, so very needlessly.
It still shocks me to think that just yards away 96 people had lost their lives. So many, so very needlessly.
Yeah, it seems a different world where people had to use public phones and phones in people's houses to contact home and let them know they were OK. Just been reading the recollections of an Everton fan who was at the other semi at Villa Park that day - the way they had no idea what had happened, other than that the game had been abandoned, until news filtered through as they came away from the match. Many Everton fans had friends or relatives at Hillsborough and had an agonising trip home to find out if they were alright - this one guy remembers an Evertonian on his coach in Birmingham listening to the radio and shouting "my son's there, my son's there".
I think that's why it affects me so much, it could have been anybody. I've been in overcrowded terracing at Oxford and Blackpool as more and more people are coming in, oblivious to how crowded it is. It's scary stuff.
Late to this thread
I completely agree and that being so, I'm going to read 'Hillsborough : The Truth' (the book JTG recommended) as soon as possible, and I'm also going to watch that Jimmy McGovern programme tonight.
I also read the David Conn article in the Guardian on Monday -- he's one of the better investigative journalists around on football, that article was particularly good.
I also read those Oberver articles from a couple of weeks ago. Those eye witness accounts were mainly new I think, and contained some really, really harrowing reading
That former ambulance man's evidence that more than 40 ambulances were being kept outside the ground by the Police, is something I'd never known before, a total disgrace!
I'm old enough to remember Hillsborough (although plenty of the details being repeated now, and the new testimony, are really shocking because I'd forgotten so much). One of my Oxford friends must have been influenced by mainstream coverage including that of the Sun
at the time, because in the early nineties he was still arguing that drunken/thuggish fans 'must have been' a contributory factor, he also used to be less than keen to accept that the Police fucked up.
Enough has emerged since then for him to alter his views pretty comprehensively though, thankfully.
jtg's posts on this thread are interesting and informative. nice one mate
I completely agree and that being so, I'm going to read 'Hillsborough : The Truth' (the book JTG recommended) as soon as possible, and I'm also going to watch that Jimmy McGovern programme tonight.
I also read the David Conn article in the Guardian on Monday -- he's one of the better investigative journalists around on football, that article was particularly good.
I also read those Oberver articles from a couple of weeks ago. Those eye witness accounts were mainly new I think, and contained some really, really harrowing reading
That former ambulance man's evidence that more than 40 ambulances were being kept outside the ground by the Police, is something I'd never known before, a total disgrace!
I'm old enough to remember Hillsborough (although plenty of the details being repeated now, and the new testimony, are really shocking because I'd forgotten so much). One of my Oxford friends must have been influenced by mainstream coverage including that of the Sun
at the time, because in the early nineties he was still arguing that drunken/thuggish fans 'must have been' a contributory factor, he also used to be less than keen to accept that the Police fucked up.Enough has emerged since then for him to alter his views pretty comprehensively though, thankfully.
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
I's superb, not surprising given McGovern wrote it and Eccleston is playing Trevor Hicks.
Yep. It was the 5-0 game (
) in spring 2000. For some bizarre reason, OUFC and Thames Valley plod were expecting around 500 Rovers to turn up, even though it was fairly close, we were second in the league and had been taking loads away for weeks. So many of us were there that they were only letting us down Cuckoo Lane in stages to avoid overcrowding at the turnstiles (fair enough). However, I will swear blind that the away end was well over capacity that day and the official figure of just under 2000 was laughable.I went with a mate who was at Hertford College and stood leaning on a crash barrier. I distinctly remember being very scared as the pressure built up, especially when we scored at the Cuckoo Lane End and the crowd surged down pinning us right next to the barrier.
The scary bits were pretty short lived but it made you so aware that it would only take a couple of badly timed fuck ups to cause serious injury and worse
Wow.......so strange. I just started crying as they did a report from Hillsborough today on the radio. Not proper bawling ,just choked me up completely.
I love Liverpool as a city and I distinctly remember being 9 and watching the "game" and everything that followed, following the story and watching the rearranged game etc.
Really strange...
I love Liverpool as a city and I distinctly remember being 9 and watching the "game" and everything that followed, following the story and watching the rearranged game etc.
Really strange...
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
I was at Villa Park that day, in the opposite end to your family and mates though.
fen_boy
Exits gracefully.
We were dreadful that day.
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
Can remember it being a weird experience winning an FA cup semi but hearing drips of news from Hillsborough and having mates who were there I wasn't bothered.....
lostexpectation
New Member
the police hate people, they probably thought they deserved giving the football trouble of the time, theres accidents carelessness and letting things happen.
5t3IIa
Registered User
I believe the thread is entitled "Hillsborough: What Really Happened".
How is a post providing a link to possible eye witness accounts in any way wrong?
I have made no comment either way as to the validity of those comments but they exist.
If that's trolling on a thread with such a title you are well outside the real world.
Now if I posted something bad about the dead on the thread about the sad deaths that would be another thing but I have not done so.
You may not like what these locals are saying but the fact is they are saying it. Take it up with them by posting on that site if you don;t like it.
Don't read that Observer article then, you'll be in fucking floods
Totally crazy. Not a "me" thing to do at all...
Gingerman
Is a great bunch of lads.....
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/co...illsborough-disaster-but-have-the-police.html
Daily Torygraph in decent comment shock,one out of thousands is'nt too bad I suppose.
Daily Torygraph in decent comment shock,one out of thousands is'nt too bad I suppose.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
It's clear derf has no respect or idea at all really, so can we all just ignore him? Don't give him what he wants.
edit: seems everyone already is reading the last few posts
edit: seems everyone already is reading the last few posts
5t3IIa
Registered User
I understand that you aren't prone to bawling your eyes out matey
I understand that the whole thing was a hideous fucking disaster from start to finish and continues to be but I wonder why I'm so affected by it? Does it speak to parts of us that are scared of crowds and being suffocated? Is it the strories of how people helped each other? Is it to do with the constant drip drip of the police not doing their jobs properly and killing people that was bad then and and is bad this month? Fuck knows. I'm not expressing myself very well but I've cried over this anniversary about five times so far and I'm glad I'm not in to watch that McGovern doc tonight I understand that you aren't prone to bawling your eyes out matey
I'm truly not sure what it is. I watched it happen and I go to football all the time myself...that's all I can think of really but, yeah, the stories of how they helped and the way that was misrepresented really burns me up as if I was a Scouser myself.
